Rapid Shot and Crossbows


Skills and Feats


Rapid shot has always perplexed me when it comes to Crossbows. Needing a action of some sort to reload a crossbow, how would you be able to get the "extra ranged attack" with it as you couldn't reload the crossbow in time. Rapid Reload makes that solution a hell of a lot easier (and then Crossbow Mastery from CotCT players). You would think it be something in the feat saying that about crossbows.

Thoughts?


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Currently, Crossbow combatants need some love; they cannot use iterative attacks at all without the use of a Repeating Crossbow or a Light Crossbow with Rapid Reload, Rapid Shot can be used ONLY in the aforementioned examples, and Manyshot cannot be used at all (it specifies that it can be used only with Bows); worse yet, the cannot grant a Strength bonus to the damage they deal. Their only advantages are a slightly better range increment (120 ft. Heavy Xbows vs. 110 ft. Composite LBows) and a better critical threat range. On top of that, the Heavy Crossbow is one of the worst weapons in existance, requiring a full-round action to be reloaded (or a move action with Rapid Reload...)
A Ranged-specialized Ranger would choose a Crossbow ONLY for the purpose of sniping from a prone position - not exactly a stellar option.
IMHO, something should be done for this (at least, allowing Manyshot to be used also with crossbows , and reducing the reload time of Heavy Xbows to move action if the character has a minimum Str required).
And yes, Rapid Shot should either specify that you must have Rapid Reload to use it with a non-Repeating Crossbow, or 'swallow' the Rapid Reload feat and give the two bonuses altogether (and eliminate the Rapid Reload feat at all)...
A sightly pretentious wish-list, I admit (especially the Rapid Shot&Reload part)...
Just my 2c.


The Wraith wrote:
Currently, Crossbow combatants need some love; they cannot use iterative attacks at all without the use of a Repeating Crossbow or a Light Crossbow with Rapid Reload, Rapid Shot can be used ONLY in the aforementioned examples

Maybe Crossbow Mastery will become core, enabling crossbow shooters to use those nice feats.

The Wraith wrote:


, and Manyshot cannot be used at all (it specifies that it can be used only with Bows);

Which makes sense. You'd need s special crossbow that can load that many arrows at once for it to function.

The Wraith wrote:


worse yet, the cannot grant a Strength bonus to the damage they deal.

No, they can't. But I could see feats that let you use dex on damage for crossbows and the like.

But remember: Crossbows also ignore your strength penalty. A lot of weak characters make use of crossbows to get past their deficiencies. I'm playing a bard with rapid shooting heavy crossbow right now (he'll eventually get crossbow mastery)

Liberty's Edge RPG Superstar 2008 Top 32, 2011 Top 16

While I agree that crossbows have lots of disadvantages, they're also great at low levels for any character that's not a pure archer. I regularly use them for melee fighter types as a first round fire and forget weapon before closing the distance. Until you get an iterative attack, you don't miss out on a lot, at least not without spending a good amount of coin on a mighty bow, which as a melee character I'd rather invest elsewhere at low levels.


One must remember the historical significance of the crossbows.

Using a bow requires special training. Aiming and firing and actually hitting what you aim at is a skill verging on an art form with bows.

Crossbows have sights. Point and click. Very little skill required other than a steady hand (e.g. good DEX in D&D).

A good archer, well-trained, can fire arrows quite quickly.

But a crossbow is difficult to cock. It takes a little time, more time with bigger, heavier crossbows.

All of which is fairly accurately represented in D&D 3.x/Pathfinder rules. Accurately enough for a simplified game combat system, anyway.

This is why crossbows are simple weapons, and bows are martial weapons. The feat required to use bows represents, in D&D terms, the training a bowman or archar needs to be proficient with his weapon.

This is why bows fire faster, or at least they do for good archers (high BAB translates into multiple attacks) or highly-trained archers (Rapid Shot and Manyshot being examples of extensive archery training).

Given all this, and the pseudo realism it represents in its gamey fashion, I think the two classes of weapons work as expected.

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