Different idea for handling Skills.

[Neil Phillips]

I am loving me some Pathfinder so far. However, I have a different take on handling skillz, which I would like you to consider.

First, the way I buy skills is to see how many points I have, them put them into the class skills I think are the most useful, making sure as many as I can are at Level + 3. I then keep raising them by +1 per level. This ensures that my character is the best at the skills his class uses. Skills I am not good at are made up for by other characters who have maxed out his class skills. I don’t think I have ever had a player take a cross class skill. It’s like throwing away a point. That is fixed in Pathfinder, but looking at other games handling skills, I think it can be easier than Pathfinder’s solution.

Here is the system I have used in the past in my game.

1. Each character chooses a race. Each race has a list of 2 to 4 “Racial Skills.” The player chooses two of these skills at time of character creation. From now on they are considered “class skills” at all times, no matter if the class chosen lists it or not. These usually will be the races’ skill bonus, such as +2 to Stealth for Halflings instead becomes Racial Skill: Stealth.

2. At character level 1, a player chooses his first class. All of the Class Skills listed are given 4 ranks, as well as the two Racial Skills. All should now be Level + 3 ranks. Humans can choose ANY TWO SKILLS as racial skills.

3. At each additional level, all Class and Racial skills improve by 1 rank. In case of multiclassing, the +3 ranks are only given at Character Level 1, not Class Level 1. So if a person was a fighter 1 and takes a level of Rogue 1, all the rogue class skills get only 1 rank, not 4. This makes the first choice of multiclass that much more important!

What this accomplishes is:
* Each class is best at what he does.

* There is some customization of skills, so you can end up with a Fighter with good Perception without multiclassing. This can help to keep people in one class only, one of the goals of Pathfinder.

* A racial skill used as a class skill is way better than a racial bonus to a non-class skill. My 15th level Halfling Fighter could care less about having a Stealth of +4 (Dex mod +2, Skill bonus +2) vs. a 15th level rogue with a perception of +20, even before I take add my Armor Check penalty. However, it is not quite as good as having the bonus is to a class skill. Oh well, que sera, sera.

I do like the racial skill thing a lot, as it adds that level of making a character the way I want it to be without breaking a lot of the game. Even if you do not change the way skills are purchased, please consider adding racial skills anyway.

Thanks all!!!!

[Eric Tillemans]

Not a bad system at all Neil. Unfortunately, skills were extensively discussed and revised through 3 revisions of the Alpha, then again for the Beta and THEN the Beta version was discussed during the skill design phase of the Beta. The bad news is that this means your commentary will probably fall on deaf ears as far as Paizo is concerned (although you never know, they may make a last minute change).

The good news is that the Pathfinder skill system does take into account some of the things you wanted to accomplish, just in a different way. In the current version as say a fighter, you gain 2+int skill points per level at every level including 1st and the max ranks in any skill is equal to your level. No more x4 skill points at first level and all cross class skills have the same 1 point cost as class skill. However, any skill which is a class skill that you put at least one point into you gain a +3 bonus. This makes for a very simple system that allows characters to customize by taking any skill (though if it's a non-class skill you won't have the +3 bonus).

The only part the Pathfinder system doesn't use of yours is the idea of racial skills, which I REALLY like. In addition to that, I wouldn't mind some regional skills for Golarion which could make certain skills class skills.

Anway, good job on your skill system - I think it's a good one. I also think Pathfinders system is pretty good and a step up from 3.5.

[Neil Phillips]

Eric Tillemans wrote:

Unfortunately, skills were extensively discussed and revised through 3 revisions of the Alpha, then again for the Beta and THEN the Beta version was discussed during the skill design phase of the Beta. ... The good news is that the Pathfinder skill system does take into account some of the things you wanted to accomplish, just in a different way.

well, I just found out about Pathfinder. After I checked out DnD 4e before release I went to play other games (True20, GURPS and Spirit of the Century). Wish I'd been there from the start!

I think you are right, the Pathfinder skill system does seem to work pretty well. I realize now you are not throwing out a point everytime you raise a cross class skill. Its only -3 below a class skill, which is fair. And Skill Focus could bring a cross class up to class skill.

Thanks for you kind words about racial skills. For me it is all about options, and I think it adds to the background you come from.