How fares Paizo in the financial storm?


Off-Topic Discussions

Dark Archive

Well, with the major credit crisis, and the loss of jobs of some of your customer, and now the layoffs at "Wizards of the Coast" how is paizo doing. Are you guys doing okay? I'd hate for anything to happen to my favorite gaming materials. Only because honestly IMHO your pathfinder products beat the crap out of anything coming fro Wizards right now.

Paizo Employee Chief Technical Officer

Jeremy Mcgillan wrote:
Well, with the major credit crisis, and the loss of jobs of some of your customer, and now the layoffs at "Wizards of the Coast" how is paizo doing. Are you guys doing okay? I'd hate for anything to happen to my favorite gaming materials. Only because honestly IMHO your pathfinder products beat the crap out of anything coming fro Wizards right now.

Well, I have to say we are feeling the economic downturn a little bit, but I think we're faring much better than most are right now. While I hear most online retailers' December sales are down noticeably compared to last year, December sales on paizo.com are down just slightly.

On the publishing side, we're staying fairly steady, though Pathfinder Adventure Path subs have actually been down several weeks over the past couple months—the first time that's ever happened. Fortunately, people canceling subscriptions are usually letting us know that the decision is purely economic, with many of them telling us they're really sorry to have to unsubscribe and that they'll resubscribe as soon as they can justify the expense.

Most of our other subscriptions have remained even or grown slightly—Pathfinder Companion has been a particularly steady gainer. One thing that has surprised us is that we've also been gaining superscribers at a pretty regular rate; that's really important for economic reasons, of course, but also because it tells us we're on the right track with our product decisions. (People who can still afford to be "in" are likely to go "all in.")

The number of paizo.com accounts, Pathfinder Beta downloads, and Pathfinder Society members are all up—admittedly, they're all cumulative, so they never actually go *down*—but the rate at which they're going up is generally satisfying.

To sum up... we're not unaffected by the economy, and we're certainly looking forward to a recovery... but for now, we're doing fine.

Dark Archive

Glad to hear things are doing well. I predict that things may pick up again sonn economically speaking. My buisness is very much tied to the economy, when things are down people find therapy for their daughters close to home rather then shiopping them off to boarding school. Our enrollment is on the upswing again which indicates that people are feeling comfortable with the expenses of sending children to our program again. Once we get enough for them to finally give me my long overdue raise, I may upgrade to superscriber status myself.


I can't afford my paizo goodies anymore with the dollar so high and all...so I'm looking for extra sources of income... If it wasn't for the suscribers discount and free PDF I would be VERY hard pressed to continue with it... :S

Keep it up Paizo folks! :D

Sovereign Court RPG Superstar 2009 Top 32, 2010 Top 8

Hugo Solis wrote:

I can't afford my paizo goodies anymore with the dollar so high and all...so I'm looking for extra sources of income... If it wasn't for the suscribers discount and free PDF I would be VERY hard pressed to continue with it... :S

Keep it up Paizo folks! :D

I can say it's kept the PDF of Catalyst's Stratigic ops off my hard drive, but Paizo product keeps coming.

I dodged a bullet today and survived the layoff purge, so y'all have another subscriber for a bit longer.

Liberty's Edge

Hugo Solis wrote:

I can't afford my paizo goodies anymore with the dollar so high and all...so I'm looking for extra sources of income... If it wasn't for the suscribers discount and free PDF I would be VERY hard pressed to continue with it... :S

Keep it up Paizo folks! :D

i agree

the differences inthe price of money are killing me :S
but i have a vice to feed... when i can no more i will let you know

still good to know you are doing well


Vic Wertz wrote:

One thing that has surprised us is that we've also been gaining superscribers at a pretty regular rate; that's really important for economic reasons, of course, but also because it tells us we're on the right track with our product decisions. (People who can still afford to be "in" are likely to go "all in.")

You're welcome. :)


I'm sure there are many like me who are waiting for their economic situation to improve to super-size it.

Sovereign Court

I know right now I'm struggling just to keep my subscription up (and believe me that $30 would come in super handy) between my wife loosing her job, me loosing the ability to work overtime (my job is secure, but overtime is precious and needed right now and we are too slow to justify me working it), me getting into a wreck with the company car (which was being loaned to me since my scooter that I bought brand new turned out to be a PoS) leaving me and my wife sharing one vehicle.

By all rights I should drop the subscription, but if I do, then I'll probably become so depressed (we are already telling people we aren't participating in christmas this year because we can't afford it) so I'm keeping it at least till SD ends. I might loose my pathfinder sub for legacy of fire though I'll keep the companions coming because I can afford $10 every few months.


lastknightleft wrote:

I know right now I'm struggling just to keep my subscription up (and believe me that $30 would come in super handy) between my wife loosing her job, me loosing the ability to work overtime (my job is secure, but overtime is precious and needed right now and we are too slow to justify me working it), me getting into a wreck with the company car (which was being loaned to me since my scooter that I bought brand new turned out to be a PoS) leaving me and my wife sharing one vehicle.

By all rights I should drop the subscription, but if I do, then I'll probably become so depressed (we are already telling people we aren't participating in christmas this year because we can't afford it) so I'm keeping it at least till SD ends. I might loose my pathfinder sub for legacy of fire though I'll keep the companions coming because I can afford $10 every few months.

LKL, enter the Atomic Array 011 contest by December 25th to win $50 credits to the Paizo store.

That might getcha some Pathfinder.


Sorry to hear about the job-loss, LKL. Hang in there.
EDIT @ Jade - You just want him to listen to all the talk about Legacy in the interview, don't you? I wasn't that stoked about that AP until listening to the previews you guys scooped...Still, the contest is a good point.


lastknightleft wrote:
By all rights I should drop the subscription, but if I do, then I'll probably become so depressed (we are already telling people we aren't participating in christmas this year because we can't afford it) so I'm keeping it at least till SD ends. I might loose my pathfinder sub for legacy of fire though I'll keep the companions coming because I can afford $10 every few months.

I hope you don't have to! I should drop my suscription like but this is pretty much my only indulgence (no Sinister pun intended :P). And this sure helps "sanity" as you say. Also I kinda have the feeling that Legacy of Fire will be the best of the three AP so far ;)


Mairkurion {tm} wrote:

Sorry to hear about the job-loss, LKL. Hang in there.

EDIT @ Jade - You just want him to listen to all the talk about Legacy in the interview, don't you? I wasn't that stoked about that AP until listening to the previews you guys scooped...Still, the contest is a good point.

It certainly ignited my interest. (Legacy of Fire pun. As you were.)


OH no. Just think of what our fishy puns inspired last time.

Sovereign Court

With all the "luck" I've had this past few months, you expect me to win a contest that will be joined by every paizite on this website?

By the way you realize listening about LoF is going to make me more depressed since odds are it will end up incomplete like my CotCT.


Dang. When it rains, it pours. On the other hand, if Heathy-lottery logic holds, maybe all this bad luck necessitates your winning? And I got the feeling that maybe the holiday busy-ness was keeping as many people as expected from entering? (I may be reading too much between some of Jade's posts.)

Sovereign Court

That sounded a lot sorrier than funny, I intended it to come across sarcastic, instead when I read it now it comes off as whiney. Things aren't all that bad. Winning would make my christmas, but I'm not going to get my hopes up because it would be bad to get all excited and not win. But I'm listening now, so I'll enter before the end of the day. And I am actually lucky, I have a wonderful wife who makes all of my hardships worth it. I just woundn't mind if I hadn't used all my luck in life getting her. :)

I'm sure a half a year from now things'll be back on track, just gotta stay positive, or at least bitterly sarcastic :)


lastknightleft wrote:
That sounded a lot sorrier than funny, I intended it to come across sarcastic, instead when I read it now it comes off as whiney.

I took it as sarcastic whiney, just plain good'ol LKL style!

Spoiler:
kidding! ;P


Don't worry--your sarcastic tone is intact. I just hate to hear of troubles, especially this time of year, and everybody is having them. I should be more old style man: Stop your whining! Suck it up! In my day, we had to catch and eat rats just to free up food money for our adventure paths!
There, feel better?

Sovereign Court

Hugo Solis wrote:
kidding! ;P

Why? that should be completely serious because that generally is what I go for. I may sound bitterly sarcastic online but I'm actually more ridiculously sarcastic. My I'm going, bye now thread is actually about the most perfect description of my personality on these boards, and I do a lot of whinney sarcasm on that thread under the guise of my roommate.

Sovereign Court

Mairkurion {tm} wrote:

Don't worry--your sarcastic tone is intact. I just hate to hear of troubles, especially this time of year, and everybody is having them. I should be more old style man: Stop your whining! Suck it up! In my day, we had to catch and eat rats just to free up food money for our adventure paths!

There, feel better?

Replace rats with deer and you've pretty much hit the nail on the head :) I've had venison meatloaf for two days running and tomorrow will be day three (that's not a complaint, venison meatloaf is awesomesauce, Bambi's mom is soooooo succulent)


lastknightleft wrote:
Hugo Solis wrote:
kidding! ;P
Why? that should be completely serious because that generally is what I go for. I may sound bitterly sarcastic online but I'm actually more ridiculously sarcastic. My I'm going, bye now thread is actually about the most perfect description of my personality on these boards, and I do a lot of whinney sarcasm on that thread under the guise of my roommate.

Jeps, totally agree, but I just wanted to be on the safe side not to offend you ;)


Geez. I miss venison. When I was helping to run a bkstore in OK, I had customers who would bring me venison. When I moved to NJ, I could not understand why we weren't allowed to hunt them with our cars and take our winnings home with us.

Sovereign Court

The Jade wrote:


LKL, enter the Atomic Array 011 contest by December 25th to win $50 credits to the Paizo store.

That might getcha some Pathfinder.

I entered, but since my discussion of where i would explore somehow ended with me cold and lonely walking around in the dark at the bottom of the Marianas trench I don't think I'll win. What can I say, my personality overwhelmed my better judgement :).

Dark Archive

Well I'm glad things look ok. Keep me posted.


lastknightleft wrote:
The Jade wrote:


LKL, enter the Atomic Array 011 contest by December 25th to win $50 credits to the Paizo store.

That might getcha some Pathfinder.

I entered, but since my discussion of where i would explore somehow ended with me cold and lonely walking around in the dark at the bottom of the Marianas trench I don't think I'll win. What can I say, my personality overwhelmed my better judgement :).

It's an entertaining and inspired entry.


Jeremy Mcgillan wrote:
Well, with the major credit crisis, and the loss of jobs of some of your customer, and now the layoffs at "Wizards of the Coast" how is paizo doing. Are you guys doing okay? I'd hate for anything to happen to my favorite gaming materials. Only because honestly IMHO your pathfinder products beat the crap out of anything coming fro Wizards right now.

Considering that gaming gets you away from the unpleasant realities of everyday life (which is completely healthy, so long as you don't go overboard), I wouldn't be surprised if demand remains relatively stable (compared to demand for certain other kinds of products)-even during a serious downturn. Also, gaming can be a fairly inexpensive hobby. Think about how many hours of enjoyment you can get with just a few books. $200 might buy you a few video games that you play for a while and forget about, but that much start-up for RPG products can go a long, long way. It's a huge return on investment.

Liberty's Edge

jocundthejolly wrote:
Considering that gaming gets you away from the unpleasant realities of everyday life (which is completely healthy, so long as you don't go overboard), I wouldn't be surprised if demand remains relatively stable (compared to demand for certain other kinds of products)-even during a serious downturn. Also, gaming can be a fairly inexpensive hobby. Think about how many hours of enjoyment you can get with just a few books. $200 might buy you a few video games that you play for a while and forget about, but that much start-up for RPG products can go a long, long way. It's a huge return on investment.

I believe that the film industry during the Great Depression wasn't hit hard. The assessment was because people wanted escapism from the unpleasant realities of their lives. If this is the case, that does bode relatively well for Paizo.

On the home front, my wife's company just lost a bid for a MAJOR contract and will have to close its doors by the current contract's end. This means, best case scenario, she has six months left of employment. But we aren't holding our breaths. Admin went through yesterday with a hatchet and hacked off the figurative heads of management - one level above hers. They've given her "special projects", i.e., upper management's responsibilities, of which she has NO experience handling.

She's looking for new work in a depressed market and alas, if successful, it'll likely come with a notable pay cut.

I expect we'll be tightening our belts, but currently I don't plan on this curbing my Paizo support.

Paizo Employee Chief Technical Officer

Vic Wertz wrote:
While I hear most online retailers' December sales are down noticeably compared to last year, December sales on paizo.com are down just slightly.

Actually, our sales have improved over the last week or two, and so December 2008 is now up just slightly over December 2007.

The e-commerce sector as a whole is estimated to be down 3% compared to last year, so "slightly up" is pretty good.

Grand Lodge

I feel awful seeing so many people loosing jobs and hurting also.

I am currently temping at the University of Missouri. They just initiated hiring freezes and are preparing to layoff workers due to an expected 10-25% cut in funding! As a temp I won't be cut, and I expect to stay employed as a temp for the next year there. Perhaps in 2010 they will begin hiring again and I can get benefits. Until then a paycheck is good enough.

I hope to find out Monday if I get to stay where I am. The only down part to temping is an assignment may last 2 weeks and you wait for 4 weeks for a new assignment.

But I think I have made them dependent upon me enough that I may get to go ahead and stay.


Congratulations to Krome on finding a job. I am glad for you. May the New Year bring you much success.


Gratz Krome!

Sovereign Court RPG Superstar 2009 Top 32, 2010 Top 8

Good to hear Krome. I'm working on the diversify or die approach at work myself. I'm lucky i've figured out the game before some of me (now former) coworkers. Just hope to keep ahead of the game.


Krome wrote:

I feel awful seeing so many people loosing jobs and hurting also.

I am currently temping at the University of Missouri. They just initiated hiring freezes and are preparing to layoff workers due to an expected 10-25% cut in funding! As a temp I won't be cut, and I expect to stay employed as a temp for the next year there. Perhaps in 2010 they will begin hiring again and I can get benefits. Until then a paycheck is good enough.

I hope to find out Monday if I get to stay where I am. The only down part to temping is an assignment may last 2 weeks and you wait for 4 weeks for a new assignment.

But I think I have made them dependent upon me enough that I may get to go ahead and stay.

Way to go Krome.

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