Hi all.
I have a fundamental question about cantrips/orisons.
As I understand it, Sorcerers at first level select 4 cantrips, and can cast them as often as they like.
I assume Bards would be the same, knowing 4, and with no limit to how many they can cast per day.
So far, so good.
Is it true that Wizards at first level can only cast 3 per day at first level? They would have more freedom over which cantrips they can cast, but are limited by how often they can cast them. This would make them versatile, but not overpowering.
Some of my fellow players believe that the number “3” in the spells per day table actually refers to cantrips known, and they can cast those 3 as often as they like.
The Beta book says Wizards can “prepare” a number of cantrips per day, while Sorcerers “know” a number of cantrips.
Orisons. Clerics can “prepare” a number per day, and have “3” in the spells per day table. This sounds a lot like the Wizard. Does that mean they can cast any cantrip(s) 3 times per day?
To contradict this is the note that 'cure minor wounds' is now 'stabilize' which has the implicit understanding that “at will” means “as often as you like”.
The way things currently stand in the game I’m playing, only Bards & Sorcerers are casting zero-level spells as often as they like but not everybody agrees.
Are the tables for spells per day a composite of spells per day and cantrips known?
So far, I can see trouble if everybody can cast as many zero-level spells as they like, and can see examples of that on other threads.
If Bards & Sorcerers can cast them as often as they like, what then about Druids & Clerics?
In a nut-shell, does “at will” always mean “as often as you like”, or does it mean, similar to an innate ability with no material components required?
Thanks for reading this far.
Cheers,
Philip.
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i know the cleric orisons are "at will", which is why they removed "cure minor wounds" from the list, to prevent "infinite healing". the # in the wizard/cleric column is the number that are prepared, and those can be cast at will. you can prepare different ones each day, i think.
i can see where the "buff" type cantrips (guidance, resistance) and detect/read magic could present some problems beinbg "at will" for certain plots/foes, though, but i think the devs want to give casters something not too powerful but always available, casting wise.
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In a nut-shell, does “at will” always mean “as often as you like”, or does it mean, similar to an innate ability with no material components required?
"At will" in this context is both similar to an innate ability with no material components a candn be cast as often you like.
The answer to your question can be found in the description of the wizard's Cantrips ability on p.49 (or the Cleric's Orisons ability on p.22).
Cantrips (Sp): Wizards can prepare a number of
cantrips, or 0-level spells, each day. They can cast these
spells at will as a spell-like ability. The number of
cantrips a wizard can prepare each day is noted on Table
4–14 under “Spells per Day.” Cantrips are treated like any
other spell cast by the wizard in terms of duration and
other variables based on level.
So the "3" you see in the tables for wizards and clerics is how many cantrips/orisons they can prepare each day, but they can cast any of those three as often as they like.
Looking at it now, it would perhaps be clearer if the 2 sentences I bolded above were switched:
The number of cantrips a wizard can prepare each day is noted on Table 4–14 under “Spells per Day.”
They can cast these spells at will as a spell-like ability.
Hope that helps.
Zero Level spells always seemed like flavour rather than crunch, but inventive players can make use of anything to get the job done. Minor buffs at will are fine - take it as good advice shouted from the back or a bit-of a pep-talk.
Thanks guys. It all makes sense now.
More basic questions.
At first level, Wizards select (“prepare”) 3 cantrips they can cast as often as they like. Players need to write down which cantrips they can cast each day, and can choose different ones each day.
Yes/No?
Spells per day. Wizards decide which spells to prepare. At first level a Wizard can cast one first level spell per day, so they would need to decide which spell that will be in advance. If the adventure is not what the player was expecting, s/he may be completely ill-prepared and useless to the party.
I had presumed that when wizards prepare their spells, they study the whole book, even though they can only cast one spell at first level. Apparently not. Is this true?
Sorcerers know a certain number of cantrips. The player needs to write these down but can cast them as often as they like. These cantrips cannot be changed, unlike Wizards who can choose different ones each day.
Yes/No?
Thanks in advance,
Brisco.
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At first level, Wizards select (“prepare”) 3 cantrips they can cast as often as they like. Players need to write down which cantrips they can cast each day, and can choose different ones each day. Yes/No?
Yes. The Wizard chooses three cantrips from his book each morning, and cast cast those three cantrips as much as he wants all day long.
Spells per day. Wizards decide which spells to prepare. At first level a Wizard can cast one first level spell per day, so they would need to decide which spell that will be in advance. If the adventure is not what the player was expecting, s/he may be completely ill-prepared and useless to the party.
And that's indeed a common situation. He's got Sleep or Charm Person studied, and the day's encounter is against Skeletons, which means he's limited to smacking away with his quarterstaff.
Unlike the Sorcerer, he's got a very limited number of spells prepared, and can only cast them as many times as he's prepared them, so a Wizard with 3 first level spells might have Sleep and Magic Missile x2 prepared, and if he really needed a second Sleep, or a Mage Armor, he's out of luck until tomorrow.
I had presumed that when wizards prepare their spells, they study the whole book, even though they can only cast one spell at first level. Apparently not. Is this true?
No such luck. The Wizard would be vastly better than the Sorcerer, if this were the case, as the Sorcerer has the flexibility, while the Wizard has the big spellbook that acts like a swiss army knife, allowing the Wizard to have many options, but to benefit strongly from being aware of the upcoming day's events, so that he can prepare accordingly. Good use of Knowledge skills, or, at higher level, scrying spells, can help to figure out what sorts of spells might be needed in the next 24 hours. (Experience also helps, both out-of-game player experience at figuring out what spells are most generally useful and which ones you never want to be without, and in-game character experience as the PC has more and more spell slots, and can start buying or making scrolls of lesser-used spells that would be handy to have, such as Knock, but aren't always necessary to prepare on a daily basis.)
Sorcerers know a certain number of cantrips. The player needs to write these down but can cast them as often as they like. These cantrips cannot be changed, unlike Wizards who can choose different ones each day. Yes/No?
Yes. The Sorcerer's big drawback is a much smaller pool of available 'spells known,' while the Wizards is practically unlimited. The Sorcerer's big advantage is that he can cast whatever spells he does know flexibly, so that the Sorcerer who knows Sleep and Magic Missile can choose to cast three Magic Missiles, three Sleeps or any combination of the two, but he'll never be able to whip out a spellbook and prepare a Color Spray or Mount spell, unlike the Wizard.