Hi everyone,
Long time 3.0-3.5 DM, poster to the boards for some time now and this evening me and a few regulars managed to fit in our first brief pathfinder playtest. (we've been awfully busy wrapping up our 3.5 campaign)
Spent a little longer than usual creating a party of 5th level characters. A dwarven Barbarian, a half-orc cleric, and an elven wizard.
Ran a seat of my pant's dungeon using a the thieves guild map of mystery from dungeon 128 and my digital map projector rig (beautiful map particularly when overrun by an aboleth and it's skum minions)
Combat was crisp given the few players, I was surprised by the grapple rules, I still feel that they need to be cleaned up a bit but they are more elegant in play than I would have thought by looking at them on paper.
Combat casting posed a major issue for us, the orc cleric realized early on that in order to even have a chance to cast spells in combat he would need to sink all 5 skill points into spellcraft to overcome his -2 int penalty. This was juxtaposed to the frail elf wizard who had no trouble doing so. That just isn't right. The cleric was deeply offended at what he called a double-wammy of needing to focus in one thing and not being able to diversify, vs other party members (the mage) being able to diversity with 1 skill point to many skills.
Given his character's reliance on defensive casting I can see his point.
Basing defensive casting off int seriously hinders clerics, particularly if they have poor int as they have a negative modifier and not enough ranks to do anything else.
Our Solution: Cease to make combat casting a spellcraft check. Make it a CMB check instead vs DC 15 + CMB of threatening opponents (a free action as part of spellcasting). If you succeed at the maneuver no attacks of opportunity by enemies are possible, otherwise they get attacks of opportunity as usual. This removes a nasty skill burden from low int clerics and generally make's front line clerics better at defensive casting than their frail back-rank wizard counterparts by virtue of generally higher strength and BAB.
Additional solution:
Don't apply int penalties to skill points or impose a 2 skill point per level minimun for all characters and creatures (Both Clerics and particularly animals could use more skills)
Thoughts?
I wonder how you feel about my own pet solution:
1) Casting a spell in a threatened area always triggers an AoO unless...
2) The caster has the combat casting feat, in which case they never trigger an AoO and...
3) The ranger and paladin get combat casting as a bonus feat
Most spellcasters can use the 'screw it, I'll step 5' back' technique, but a surrounded spellcaster can still be in a world of hurt. Plus, it removes a couple of rolls and a skill sink.
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Making Combat Casting a Combat Maneuver will make it pretty much impossible for standard casters (wizards and sorcerers) with low BAB to utilize successfully. While a cleric or druid may be able to overcome the steep DC, the wizard or sorcerer won't.
I'm more in favor of basing Spellcraft off whichever ability the character uses to cast. Though, this could get murky with multi-classed casters (mystic theurge especially).
I wonder how you feel about my own pet solution:
1) Casting a spell in a threatened area always triggers an AoO unless...
2) The caster has the combat casting feat, in which case they never trigger an AoO and...
3) The ranger and paladin get combat casting as a bonus featMost spellcasters can use the 'screw it, I'll step 5' back' technique, but a surrounded spellcaster can still be in a world of hurt. Plus, it removes a couple of rolls and a skill sink.
Actually I would have to concur. I personally have a very hard time seeing a caster casting spells while a combant is swinging a weapon at your head.
So if any can please explain why a caster would be in the middle of combat and logically how a person is pulling out thing out of a pouch and waving your arms around is able to avoid being hit please do. Otherwise I think I am going to have to dump concentration from my campaign.
I am not trying to nerf the wizard. I just have a hard time picturing it.
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I wonder how you feel about my own pet solution:
1) Casting a spell in a threatened area always triggers an AoO unless...
2) The caster has the combat casting feat, in which case they never trigger an AoO and...
3) The ranger and paladin get combat casting as a bonus featMost spellcasters can use the 'screw it, I'll step 5' back' technique, but a surrounded spellcaster can still be in a world of hurt. Plus, it removes a couple of rolls and a skill sink.
Actually I would have to concur. I personally have a very hard time seeing a caster casting spells while a combant is swinging a weapon at your head.
So if any can please explain why a caster would be in the middle of combat and logically how a person is pulling out thing out of a pouch and waving your arms around is able to avoid being hit please do. Otherwise I think I am going to have to dump concentration from my campaign.
I am not trying to nerf the wizard. I just have a hard time picturing it.
I agree. It just fits the role being played. It is a matter of player choices. Sometimes we just can't get to be fantastic at everything all the time and need to make choices.
I have played a cleric now for over a year, and I do not remember once drawing a weapon. I don't even bother to write one on my character sheet anymore. I do carry a shield though :)
For me, my melee weapon is the fighter!
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Spellcasters should get an armor bonus to their Concentration check.
If the AoO hits a spellcaster, the attack is hitting their armor (most likely in the case of clerics and paladins.) By that logic, the armor is absorbing some of "the blow" which is what distracts spellcasters from their gestures and chanting.
As a wizard/sorcerer levels up, they get robes that protect them better so thing should even out on a skill vs armor scale.