| ruemere |
Basically, this is an updated version of my older post. It's nowhere to be found, I'm afraid, so I'm taking the liberty to add it here again.
1. Too many subsystems.
The classes, as presented in Pathfinder Beta, use more subsystems to handle progression of class abilities than those in 3.5.
The direct consequences are: steeper learning curve, increased bookkeeping, decreased backwards compatibility.
The indirect consequences are: decreased appeal for beginner players, slower combat resolution due to increased resource management overhead, increased complexity for mutliclassing and use of prestige classes.
Also, all melee classes are still unable to defend themselves from control spells (Weak saves, incapable of working around walls, SoD effects).
Examples follow.
1.1 Barbarian.
1.1.1 New subsystems: Rage point pool, Rage powers.
- Incompatible horizontally (no other class uses Rage point pool or Rage powers) and vertically (no classes to develop on new Rage mechanic).
- Increased bookkeeping... (sorry, going to vent a bit) Ye Gods, I need to say this: try to use a horde of 40 Barbarians in Pathfinder Beta. Whoever came up with this concept, should be made to run such battle 3 times a day until they apologize for not thinking the concept though.
1.1.2 Suggested optimizations.
- Replace Rage powers with [Rage Combat] feats.
- Replace new Rage versions with [Rage Combat] feats.
- Add prerequisite to each [Rage Combat] feat: usable only when Raging.
- Replace "Rage power" with "Bonus Rage Combat feat" in class feature progression.
- Make all feats usable at-will but only one at any given time.
- Make all rage feats to be distinct so that switching between various Rage powers during combat would be an interesting option for character.
- Make use of each feat a Swift action.
- Lengthen Rage duration to 15 minutes.
- Limit number of Rage uses to 1+Con modifier/day.
- Ability to self-heal between encounters. Right now Barbarians with their low armor class provide biggest hitpoint sink for all healing abilities.
1.2 Fighter.
1.2.1 New subsystems: Weapon Training, Armor Training.
- The systems are easier to manage. Unfortunately they lack room for customization.
- New systems are entirely lackluster. Adding more attack bonuses, more damage or improving armor class will not solve two major problems of Fighter class:
- nothing to do besides hitting round after round,
- defenseless against spellcaster characters.
1.2.2 The following Fighter archetypes are still not viable under Pathfinder Beta:
- highlevel Fighter commanders (not enough skill points, no feats for officers)
- melee battlefield controller (fighters able to hinder or penalize opponent actions via use of skirmisher weapons)
- lightly armored duellers
- big game hunter (Improved Grab == bye bye, Mr Fighter)
1.2.3 Broken (unusable) feats:
- Power attack - impossible to find sweet spot (i.e. relation of taken penalty to opponent's armor class)
- Combat Expertise - use of non fighter ability (Intelligence) and general weakening of the feat
1.2.4 Suggested optimizations against tier 1 characters:
- Combat feats pool should incorporate feats allowing to negate magic effects which eliminate fighter from play: effects targetting Will save, effects displacing fighter character, effects building barriers between fighter and his prey, effects which permanently block line of sight between fighter and opponent.
- Combat feats for negating magic effects should be available at higher total character levels, not just total Fighter levels
Examples of test cases which fighter should be able to handle at resource cost:
- Empowered Ray of Enfeeblement
- Invisible Flying Wizard
- Wall of Stone
- Solid Fog
- Dominate Person
- Hitpoint attrition from multiple encounters
Examples of possible abilities to help fighter in a game non-breaking way:
- Ability to temporarily ignore temporary ability damage
- Ability to use Perception based roll to improve chance of guessing location of invisible objects or to fight while blinded
- Ability to break magically conjured or created objects
- Ability to temporarily ignore magical effects impeding movement
- Ability to delay or weaken effects which take away chracter's control from player
- Ability to self-heal damage between encounters
1.3 Ranger
1.3.1 New subsystems: 0. There are however new class features.
Favored Enemy - this is still the biggest pain to handle. Very campaign specific and requires cooperation from GM's side to be effective. Basically, the best way to use it is still to declare Humanoid (human) to be your first and foremost enemy, with appropriate type of outsider or undead second.
Combat styles and Spellcasting still feel very awkward.
Favored Terrain - this is much better than Favored enemy, however some distinctions appear artifical:
Urban <> Underground (dungeons)
Forest <> Jungle
Also, benefits are rather hard to remember.
1.3.2 Suggested optimizations.
Favored Enemy - replace this with ability to study opponent and then gain significant advantages against. It should be personal, at will and require certain time to use.
Favored Terrain - decrease number of terrains, limit number of bonuses to 2 (skills) and 1 (combat). Increase bonuses (+2 for skills is fine, but +1 to initiative is too low to produce an effect).
Combat styles - just allow Rangers to pick combat feats from more limited pool than that of a Fighter. No more virtual feats, please. Just make them regular bonus feats.
Spellcasting - just drop it or make optional. It's not gamebreaking not to cast spells, but such limited spell access only adds to bookkeeping instead of enhancing the class.
Regards,
Ruemere
| Epic Meepo RPG Superstar 2009 Top 16, 2012 Top 32 |
1.1.2 Suggested optimizations.
- Replace Rage powers with [Rage Combat] feats.
- Replace new Rage versions with [Rage Combat] feats.
- Add prerequisite to each [Rage Combat] feat: usable only when Raging.
- Replace "Rage power" with "Bonus Rage Combat feat" in class feature progression.
- Make all feats usable at-will but only one at any given time.
- Make all rage feats to be distinct so that switching between various Rage powers during combat would be an interesting option for character.
Yes to this. I've been saying for some time that 'rage powers' should work like the old combat feats, and should have no points cost.
Favored Enemy - this is still the biggest pain to handle. Very campaign specific and requires cooperation from GM's side to be effective. Basically, the best way to use it is still to declare Humanoid (human) to be your first and foremost enemy, with appropriate type of outsider or undead second.... Favored Enemy - replace this with ability to study opponent and then gain significant advantages against. It should be personal, at will and require certain time to use.
Yes to this as well. Your favored enemy should be a specific enemy you pick once per encounter, not a creature type.