Since there are a lot of domains out there that aren't in the SRD and not open content, either, Paizo can't convert them for us. In the case of open content stuff, they could, or the companies in question could (unless they go 4e, of course). But I doubt that wizards will give us PF-RPG material.
So here's a quick'n'dirty guide to do the conversions yourself, based on how the PF Alpha 3 domains look like compared to their SRD counterparts. (Well, actually, it's at the end of the topic, some explanations come first)
Domains are, for the most part, a simple matter, most of it is just a spell-like abilities of the very spells the domain grants. There are a couple of exceptions, though. You get abilities at levels 1, 2, 4, 8, 12, 16, 20.
The easy part:
A lot is just spell-like abilities. Mostly they're taken from the old domain lists, but the PF domains have some exceptions. Still, it should be no problem to either just use the domain spells, or, if you feel adventurous, find a suitable replacement.
On 2, 4, 12, 16 and 20, you get a spell-like ability:
Level 2: The 1st-level domain spell, usable 1/day per 2 caster levels.
Level 4: The 2nd-level domain spell 1/day
Level 12: either the 4th-level spell 3/day, or the 5th-level spell 1/day
Level 16: The 7th-level spell 1/day
Level 20: The 9th-level spell 1/day
The hard ones:
Levels 1 and 8 are special cases: Both use supernatural abilities, the 1st-level one usable at will, the 8th-level one usable one round/caster level per day. They usually don't follow a direct spell, but draw upon the general theme of the domain.
For 1st-level powers, you might want to incorporate the granted power sometimes.
If the domain wants an attack, it's a ray or bolt, sometimes a touch (so touch attack or ranged touch attack). Damage type should fit the domain, and damage should be 1d6 + 1/2 caster level. Restricted versions (like only applicable to a single creature type) might go as high as 1d8+, while very favourable damage types might reduce it to 1d4+
At other times, it might be a bonus of some type. Unless it's a special case, the bonus is often equal to 1/2 caster level. Other cases grant a +2 bonus.
The bonus can be conferred, and must be used within 3 rounds. Though usable at will, any one target can only benefit 1/day, or maybe 1/hour
A kind of hex (negative effect) is also possible. The effect will usually last 3 rounds, and the victim will be immune for one day, or maybe one hour. A save is usually not allowed.
For 8th-level powers, it's again something you have to play by ear. Something that fits the domain - look at the 4th-level domain spell for inspiration. It will often be an aura, which has a radius of 30'. Other effects are also usually limited to 30'.
Domain Conversion Guide
Caster Level: Ability (Unless noted, all are Spell-like)
1st: Supernatural (Su) ability usable at will. Often based on 1st-level domain spell and/or domain power, or the domain's usual theme. Attacks deal 1d6 + 1/2 caster level damage as a touch or ranged touch, damage type consistent with domain theme (for very good damage types, damage is 1d4+1/2cl, restrictive damage types 1d8+1/2cl). Positive effects must be activated within 3 rounds and last one check, negative effects don't allow a save and last 3 rounds. Any individual target cannot be affected more than once per day (once per hour in some situations)
2nd: 1st-level domain spell 1/day per 2 caster levels.
4th: 2nd-level domain spell 1/day
8th: Supernatural (Su) ability usable 1 round/caster level (need not be consecutive) loosely based on 4th-level domain spell and/or general domain theme. If aura, radius is 30 ft, if otherwise ranged, range is 30 ft.
12th: Either 4th-level domain spell 3/day or 5th-level domain spell 1/day
16th: 7th-level domain spell 1/day
20th: 9th-level domain spell 1/day
Example: Suffering Domain
1st: Pain Touch (Su): You can use a pain touch on a living creature as a melee touch attack. If you hit, pain wracks the target, bestowing a -2 penalty to Strength and Dexterity for 3 rounds. Once a creature has been affected by pain touch, it is immune to its effects for 1 day.
2nd: Bane (Sp): You can cast bane 1/day per 2 caster levels you possess
4th: Bear's Endurance (Sp): You can cast bear's endurace 1/day
8th: Aura of Suffering (Su): You can emit a 30 ft. aura of suffering for a number of rounds per day equal to your caster level. All enemies within this aura must make a will safe or take a -2 penalty on attack rolls, saving throws, ability checks, skill checks, and weapon damage rolls as long as they are within range. These rounds do not need not be consecutive.
12th: Enervation (Sp): You can cast enervation 3/day
16th: Eyebite (Sp): You can cast eyebite 1/day
20th: Horrid Wilting (Sp): You can cast horrid wilting 1/day.
bumping this and think posted conversions should go here as well
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The Elf Domain's received a conversion here.
Edit: Here's the conversion for the link averse.
Elf Domain
Level 1- +1/2 damage when using bows (Su)
Level 2- True Strike level/per day (Sp)
Level 4- Cats Grace 1/day (Sp)
Level 8- Tree Stride for cleric level turns per day. Those rounds do not have to be consecutive. (Su)
Level 12- Commune with nature 1/day (Sp)
Level 16- Find the path 3/day (Sp)
Level 20- Antipathy 1/day (Sp)
yep we should post it here..I did the deathless domain and will repost it later as well.
Nice work!
Thanks
I can't see this being in the beta Pathfinder PHB, but I'd like to see this exact writeup in one of the official DM products. I hate having to look things up on message boards when I really need them, and having this codified into the "official" Pathfinder rules somewhere would be mighty handy.
I think that if the final Pathfinder won't have a "3.5 conversion" part, there will be a booklet about converting existing stuff as necessary. You know, stuff like this guide, a general stat block and monster conversion guide (the monster conversion is in alpha 3 as far as I know, or at least a draft of it), the prestige skills part....
I think Jason has something that looks pretty much like my guide around (probably pinned to his office wall or something) and just hasn't got around to prettying it up and putting it somewhere (I guess right now getting the core system right is the number one top priority).
Oh: By all means: post any conversions you have made here, or link to them if they're already somewhere (repeating the text won't hurt, either).
Elf Domain
Level 1- +1/2 damage when using bows (Su)
Level 2- True Strike level/per day (Sp)
Level 4- Cats Grace 1/day (Sp)
Level 8- Tree Stride for cleric level turns per day. Those rounds do not have to be consecutive. (Su)
Level 12- Commune with nature 1/day (Sp)
Level 16- Find the path 3/day (Sp)
Level 20- Antipathy 1/day (Sp)
I'm a nitpick, I know. I was in counselling for it, but the guy threw me out after I had corrected his slight pronounciation mistakes three times within a minute. That guy was a hack ;-)
Level 1 should get the standard treatment for 1st-level powers. Meaning: It's a standard action to touch a bow, you have 3 rounds to activate it, it works once, and then you must wait a day to use
Level 2 should be 1/day per 2 levels.
Level 8 should refer to rounds.
What is the 7th-level domain spell? Maybe that would make a good 16th level ability.
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Elf Domain
Level 1- +1/2 damage when using bows (Su)
<snip>
Level 1 should get the standard treatment for 1st-level powers. Meaning: It's a standard action to touch a bow, you have 3 rounds to activate it, it works once, and then you must wait a day to use
That's a bit harsh. It's not as if doing extra damage counts as a debuff that the target should be immune to for the rest of the day. As written this power is nearly identical, mechanically, to the universalist wizard's Hand of the Apprentice power in that it requires a normal attack rather than a touch attack, which justifies the slightly higher damage die (assuming use of a longbow) as compared to the various ranged touch attack powers. Further, unlike the Hand it does not also add the character's casting-stat modifier to the damage bonus, and it has less potential to get around cover. OTOH it has a longer range, which probably cancels out those shortcomings.
I think the power was just fine as written, except perhaps that it should stipulate that it requires a standard action.
That's a bit harsh.
That's exactly how all the other 1st-level buffs work. Those who don't just give you +2 to a bunch of things, that is.
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That's exactly how all the other 1st-level buffs work. Those who don't just give you +2 to a bunch of things, that is.
That's a bit harsh.
Yes, but I was suggesting that it should be viewed as an attack power- hence my comparison to Hand of the Apprentice- rather than as a buff. As a buff, it's pretty weak. As an attack power it's about on par with another one that's already part of the game.
Personally I'd rather see them just go back to the old Domain system so people don't have to go through all this to use other domains.
I like the new system too much. It has a ton of flavour.
Plus, you can still combine the two.
Yes, but I was suggesting that it should be viewed as an attack power- hence my comparison to Hand of the Apprentice- rather than as a buff. As a buff, it's pretty weak. As an attack power it's about on par with another one that's already part of the game.
The buffs are all like that. Look at War, for example: you get the bonus on one attack roll, too.
Most actual attacks follow the same pattern: you make a touch or ranged touch, and deal 1d6 +1/2 damage.
Even hand of the apprentice is nothing more than a variant attack roll - you replace your strength with your int for the attack. It can't be used by a strong evoker or evoker/fighter to augment his strength to add two attributes to his attack.
Granting a flat +1/2 level on damage for all ranged attacks would be in addition to the usual bonuses (strength, weapon enhancement). It would just make the character's primary attack form a lot stronger. It's way too much for one of two domains. Even evocation - which is all about spell damage, only gets +1 +1/5 level on spell damage.
Heck, even divine power - a 4th-level spell you have to spend slots on only gives you 1/3 level. A 1st-level at will power should not be stronger than a 4th-level spell.
Not even fighters get that much added. By level 20, they'll get +4 - or maybe +8 if they also pump two extra feats into the thing.
This would again mean that elven clerics make the best archers around, which is just wrong.
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Hi,
I get your point about the bonus to damage being a little much.
How about this for a level 1 Elf Domain ability, based on the destructive smite ability:
Archers Smite (Su): As a full-round action, you can make a single bow attack against an opponent with a bonus on damage equal to ½ your caster level (minimum 1). If the attack hits, all critical threats against the target are automatically confirmed for 1 round, including this attack.
The only difference is it shifts melee to missile.
I must adimit I'm not keen on the change to the war domain. Previously you gained a weapon proficiency and weapon focus. Perhaps this was too much, but the battle smite seems a poor alternative...
Battle Smite (Su): You can touch your deity’s favored weapon and give it the ability to deal a battle smite. For the next 3 rounds, anyone wielding the weapon may add an enhancement bonus on one damage roll equal to 1/2 your caster level for one attack roll. The target must decide to use this ability before rolling to attack. This effect fades
after 3 rounds or when the battle smite is used. Once a wielder has used a battle smite, he gains no further benefit from it for 1 day.
So you 1st to 3rd level cleric can gain an extra 1 point of damage to a weapon damage roll once per day per person as a standard action...
Compare this to the trickery domain ability:
Copy Cat (Su): You can create an illusory double of yourself as a move action. This double functions as a single mirror image and lasts for a number of rounds equal to your caster level (unless dispelled or destroyed). You can have no more than one copy cat at a time. This ability does not stack with mirror image.
Much more useful as a move action and you can use as many times as you like per day.
The Level 7 domain spell is live oak
I must adimit I'm not keen on the change to the war domain. Previously you gained a weapon proficiency and weapon focus. Perhaps this was too much...
...But I'm still racking my brain trying to find a use for magic weapon 1/day per 2 levels. Or even 1/day after 6th level or so, when everyone in the group already has magic weapons.
P.S. This is a great thread. I hope we can get a lot of domains converted and critiqued here, in a sort of unofficial netbook of domains.
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There is a significant shift in the power offered by domains. I imagine this is a deliberate balancing mechanic that won’t be welcomed by fans of the cleric.
Look at some of the previous 3.5 domain powers.
Death Domain: Death touch, kill someone with a touch attack 1/day if you roll over creatures current hit points.
War Domain: Weapon proficiency and weapon focus in deities favoured weapon (normally martial)
Gluttony Domain: Enlarge person as the spell for cleric level rounds per day as a free action.
Travel Domain: Freedom of movement 1 round per cleric level per day automatically when needed.
Some domain powers were pretty poor:
Evil, chaos, Law and Good Domains: Type spells cast at +1 caster level.
You also got you Domain spells, effectively all 1/day when you could cast spells of that level.
Compare to the Pathfinder level 1 war domain power listed above or the Death Domain: Bleeding Touch (Su): As a melee touch attack, you can cause a living creature to take 1d6 points of damage per round. This effect persists for 1 round per caster level or until stopped with a DC 15 Heal check or any spell or effect that heals damage. Touching a creature affected by this ability causes the duration to reset but does not stack. This is a bleed effect (see the Glossary chapter).
I’d defiantly rate Bleeding Touch over Battle Smite and in this instance possibly over the 3.5 Death Touch.
In 3.5 a cleric of glutton and war could be stomping round the battle field enlarged with their weapon focus battle axe, shield, full plate and slightly reduced base attack (possible offset by buffs).
A 3P cleric with the same domains would probably be less potent, but still a strong combat adversary. They would still have the battle axe, but not weapon focus (unless they brought it). They would probably not be enlarged (although the gluttony level 1 domain power is yet to be decided), unless they cast the spell to enlarge themselves. They could battle smite (possibly underpowered) an opponent 1/day, cast magic weapon on their and their allies weapons (see Kirth’s post above) and cast Goodberry (level 1 Gluttony domain spell).
See the fighter smirk… Reminds me of Order of the Stick 3.5 update…
There is a significant shift in the power offered by domains. I imagine this is a deliberate balancing mechanic that won’t be welcomed by fans of the cleric.
I'm a cleric fan and I agree that he can use some downsizing.
On the other hand, turning is now a lot more useful than before, since you can use it to augment your healing. That takes some pressure off the cleric, who can use more of his spells for non-healing purposes.
Plus, while there are less domain spells than before per domain, you get two of them at once.
Death Domain: Death touch, kill someone with a touch attack 1/day if you roll over creatures current hit points.
War Domain: Weapon proficiency and weapon focus in deities favoured weapon (normally martial)
Death Domain is nothing more than a damage spell. Actually, it's less, as it can only kill, not damage. If you roll one point short of slaiyng the guy, he won't feel a thing. Doing the same with fireball will leave him in dire straights.
And while the war clerics might miss the weapon focus, it is mitigated by the fact that all clerics gain weapon proficiency in their deity's favoured weapon now.
You also got you Domain spells, effectively all 1/day when you could cast spells of that level.
Actually, they're all 1/2 day, since you have to choose one. In Pathfinder, you get both.
They would probably not be enlarged
No, they wouldn't. Not after level 9. Righteous Might kicks Enlarge Person's backside.
Especially since in Pathfinder, the often undead disciples of gluttony (= necromancy with sin domain) can't be enlarge personned, being no-persons.
But I'm still racking my brain trying to find a use for magic weapon 1/day per 2 levels. Or even 1/day after 6th level or so, when everyone in the group already has magic weapons.
You never know when you have to pick up something on the spot...
P.S. This is a great thread. I hope we can get a lot of domains converted and critiqued here, in a sort of unofficial netbook of domains.
Good idea. I think I'll convert something from the spell compendium.
How about this for a level 1 Elf Domain ability, based on the destructive smite ability:Archers Smite (Su): As a full-round action, you can make a single bow attack against an opponent with a bonus on damage equal to ½ your caster level (minimum 1). If the attack hits, all critical threats against the target are automatically confirmed for 1 round, including this attack.
The only difference is it shifts melee to missile.
That can work.
I was just saying that we should stick to the way domains are now, not go and make something that is just like another domain power, but way stronger.
If the stuff is considered too weak, we should tell Jason and get his opinion about it, and why he made it like that.
I must adimit I'm not keen on the change to the war domain. Previously you gained a weapon proficiency and weapon focus. Perhaps this was too much, but the battle smite seems a poor alternative...
I must say the 1/day against enemies are okay. Your everage enemy doesn't stick around that long, so you can usually use that several times.
But the 1/day per companion restriction is a bit much. Maybe something that can be more often, but is not as powerful, would be in order.
The Level 7 domain spell is live oak
It's always the question on whether you use 7 1/day or 6 3/day.
I just realised that the 16th-level power can be something 3/day, too. Now I have to look into revising my guidelines above.
Update
Slight addendum:
Level 16: The 7th-level spell 1/day or 6th-level spell 3/day
And another conversion, if anyone wants to play a priest of big K (not, me, I mean a certain Claimer ;-)
Spells from the Spell Compendium (SC) have page numbers for reference.
Greed Domain
1st: Soul of Greed (Su): As a standard action, you can touch an item to know its value. You make an Appraise check with a +5 bonus and will know its market value to the copper piece. You can always take 10 on this roll.
2nd: Cheat (Sp): You can cast cheat (SC 46) 1/day per 2 caster levles you possess.
4th: Entice Gift (Sp): You can cast entice gift (SC 83) 1/day.
8th: Guard the Hoard (Su): You can guard a container with a trap that deals 1d6 points of damage for every two caster levels you possess when the object is opened. The trap lasts a number of rounds equal to your caster level or until discharged. You can create a number of traps per day equal to your caster level. This ability works otherwise like fire trap
12: Fabricate (Sp): You can cast fabricate 1/day.
16: Teleport Object (Sp): You can cast teleport on a touched object (and only a touched object) 1/day
20: Sympathy (Sp): You can cast Sympathy 1/day.