"De-specifying" Skills?


Skills & Feats


My thought for simplifying the skills system considerably, and making certain skills more attractive, is to remove the "specify sub-category"
choice from all skills.

Have Craft skill? You make stuff. What stuff do you make? Well, whatever the campaign requires! Don't lock this character in a junkyard with plenty of food...

Have Perform skill? You entertain people. How? Well, however the campaign requires! Most entertainers have several favorite ways to entertain, and most also don't have some huge Intelligence score to learn a whole bunch of skills.

Have Knowledge skill? You know stuff. What stuff do you know? Well, whatever the campaign requires! As a DM, how many times have you seen your players choose arcana, religion, and dungeoneering when all your fun stuff involves history and nobility? Admittedly, a high-Intelligence character can know a lot of these skills, but for some reason little things like Spellcraft, Concentration, and cross-class Spot ranks seem to come first. It's pretty bad when cross-class Spot beats out a major category like this!

Have Profession skill? OK, this one's tough... justifying knowing how to do any job is kind of tough. It's probably necessary to remove this skill and ask each character to justify any non-adventuring job he has with backstory.

Simulationists can always say something like "pick 1 to 3 things you know/make/entertain with, and take a penalty with anything else". Another alternative is to have feats like Versatile Performer to cover Craft and Knowledge skills available, so at least the character can have it simple if he wants to!

What do you think?


Cross class skills dont exsist any more

I think the knowledges need to stay seperate, the others one dont bother me

Liberty's Edge

Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Charter Superscriber; Pathfinder Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game, Starfinder Society Subscriber

I prefer them separate.


I'm trying to sound out whether it is a good idea or not. I get the sense that it is not a horrible idea, but it is also not one to stir strong opinion one way or another (and that's assuming there's a couple people out there that agreed with my post but did not reply). I guess "despecifying" skills is a bit too much like 4e, though what they did there was more like "unfolding" the skills (i.e. knocking the word Knowledge off it).

Frankly, getting my players to select a Knowledge or Craft skill is like pulling teeth, and only a bard will ever select a Perform skill. There is a definite preference toward selecting skills that I ask for people to roll in play. How on Oerth can I ask someone to make a Craft (basketweaving) feat with a straight face. Isn't it just better to let the player pick "Craft skill" and let him surprise you with what he makes? Can't anyone be a Gandalf-like character who seems to know a fair bit about everything (and make a Spellcraft or Concentration check too)?

Maybe allowing the Versatile Crafting and Versatile Knowledge feats is the way to go. Just take the Versatile Performer feat and global-replace with Craft and Knowledge, I suppose.


eehhhh Craft/Perform/Profession is a possibility since they do have an unlimited set of sub categories and few that are actually listed until you find out you need 15 ranks in silk spinning to make a golem. (then again you can always just pay someone).

However I feel very strongly against the knowledges. There are 10 of them, they are specifically mentioned and laid out. They also are not as compressible or to be labeled as generic or useless. I would also point out I have the opposite problem as you, my players wouldn't cross class perception even after a 5 level span of having things sneak up on them, but most of them want to have at least a rank in every knowledge check in case they roll lucky enough to get some random piece of information.

In defense of infinite sub categories what will player do when he is ungodly amounts of levels into epic with his ridiculous intelligence score when he reaches maximum ranks in all skills and skill tricks.


Actually I would do:

- Merge all Perform (xxx instruments) and Perform (singing) into Perform (Music)

- Merge Perform (Oratory, Comedy and maybe acting) into Perform (Oratory?)

- Merge Craft & Profession into the skill TRADE

Liberty's Edge

DracoDruid wrote:

Actually I would do:

- Merge all Perform (xxx instruments) and Perform (singing) into Perform (Music)

- Merge Perform (Oratory, Comedy and maybe acting) into Perform (Oratory?)

- Merge Craft & Profession into the skill TRADE

Inspirational!


Ähh, thanks... I guess.

Liberty's Edge

DracoDruid wrote:
Ähh, thanks... I guess.

Your post jumpstarted a couple of ideas. I'm just waiting for the Alpha 3 bard to start tweaking the skills.

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