Hi there!
So, my gaming group got together last week, and we were discussing game sessions past, and one of my fellow players brought up an issue that annoyed him with a DM many moons ago.
This play has always been a Drow fan - and no, his PCs are not a Drizz't clone, he's been playing them before Bob Salvatore started writing that stuff - and he brought a character of his into a session with a new DM.
Keeping himself cloaked/hooded/gloved when hanging out above-ground, it seems that everyone his PC ran into was magically able to determine that he was a drow, because as the DM interpreted things, the Drow's "long slender fingers" were a dead giveaway, and when that was debated, this whole concept of the Drow having an extra finger joint was then tossed up, and it was able to be seen, even through gloved hands.
Now, all idiocy aside, apparently this extra finger joint bit isn't anything new?
The player fond of Drow commented about the finger joint thing being a creation of this particular DM, but a couple other players from our group countered, saying that they were also aware that the Drow had this particular feature...
I've been going over all kinds of 1st Edition and 2nd Edition sourcebooks, and I can't find ANYTHING that would indicate this - save for multiple references that the Drow have these "long slender fingers".
Goodman Games/EN World put out a book (Complete Guide to the Drow or somehing) that does state (with illustration) the extra joint, but that's not an "official" source.
We seek clarification! :)
Can anyone cite an OFFICIAL (i.e. TSR or WotC) source that has this? We couldn't find it in any of the Monster Manual/Monstrous Manual/Monstrous Compendium books, nor in the Fiend Folio or Unearthed Arcana.
I remember one of the old 2ed books, I think it was Cormanthor: City of the Elves or some such, mentioned that elves had long fingers (and thus used a different grip on their weapons, etc) but I don't ever remember hearing about an extra joint in the finger. So they'd have four bones in every finger... man, no wonder they have -2 Constitution. It'd really such getting those trodden on by a dwarf.
Were I the player, I certainly would have shown him the extra finger joint...
Too true! I do believe that's what ended up happening... :)
I remember one of the old 2ed books, I think it was Cormanthor: City of the Elves or some such, mentioned that elves had long fingers (and thus used a different grip on their weapons, etc) but I don't ever remember hearing about an extra joint in the finger. So they'd have four bones in every finger... man, no wonder they have -2 Constitution. It'd really such getting those trodden on by a dwarf.
Yup - the Cormanthyr book talks about the long fingers (like many other sources), and does go a bit further, with regard to elf weapons having differently shaped/designed hilts/handles due to that bit, but doesn't say anything about the extra joint...
I'd normally be inclined to write it off as some stupid idea that this particular DM had (especially knowing the guy), but then the Goodman/EN World book I mentioned details it, so I'm curious where they got the idea...
Keeping himself cloaked/hooded/gloved when hanging out above-ground, it seems that everyone his PC ran into was magically able to determine that he was a drow, because as the DM interpreted things, the Drow's "long slender fingers" were a dead giveaway...
I think you/ve nailed it. The DM interpreted that in his world, drows have an extra finger joints. He is the DM after all and should he chose to disregard official lore, that is his privilege. Take it or leave it.
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In Barlowe's Guide to Extraterrestrials, I think the Overlords from Arthur C. Clarke's Childhood's End had an extra joint or two in their fingers. They also had like 5 fingers and two thumbs, one on the radial, and one on the ulnar side of the palm.
I've never heard about it with drow in D&D though.
I think you/ve nailed it. The DM interpreted that in his world, drows have an extra finger joints. He is the DM after all and should he chose to disregard official lore, that is his privilege. Take it or leave it.
Augh, I guess I could have been more clear in my tale, but it was presented as a part of Drow physiology, taken from an official source, yet said source was never named.
On reflection just recently, two other players in our group recall seeing it in an official source, as well.
This would seem to be supported by the Goodman/EN World book, but I can't find said official source.
I'm not arguing what a DM can or can't do in his/her world.
My question still stands - can anyone cite an official source for this aspect of Drow anatomy?
(Edited to fix the blasted quote tag.)
Maybe they are confusing drow with the Mercane from the Manual of the Planes. They are described as having an extra joint in the fingers, which are described as "spidery".
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Review of the Goodman book here.
Second to last paragraph:
"Internal art is done by Brad McDevitt, giving the book a universal feel. Interior front cover is used to showcase some drow features like the extra joint in the fingers and slightly slanted eyes of the drow, while the rear cover is a partial catalog of Goodman games books. Editing is fair, but the book feels wordy. Some parts are in two column format, others one column, stretching the text the entire length of the page. Upper and lower boarders are drow based with good spacing, outer and inner borders are tight."
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Keeping himself cloaked/hooded/gloved when hanging out above-ground, it seems that everyone his PC ran into was magically able to determine that he was a drow, because as the DM interpreted things, the Drow's "long slender fingers" were a dead giveaway, and when that was debated, this whole concept of the Drow having an extra finger joint was then tossed up, and it was able to be seen, even through gloved hands.
Why would they need to look at his hands, anyway?
Doesn't the fact that he's swathed in a burkha, and smells of mushrooms give him away?
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Better than citing a book that says that drow have normal hands I will cite you that no WotC book or novel states they have the extra joint. The drow have normal hands. The excuse to have every ignorant farmer with a int of 3 just happen to know some extrainious fact about drow is just a sign of a GM that doesnt know how to deal with drow players. Its called a spot check. Thats what they get. Made more dificult with cover and disguise. AND there is a chance that Mr. Ignorant Farmer would see the drow with NO cover, plane and simple, no disguise or anything, naked even. And think, "look, a black elf" and go back to farming.
Better than citing a book that says that drow have normal hands I will cite you that no WotC book or novel states they have the extra joint. The drow have normal hands. The excuse to have every ignorant farmer with a int of 3 just happen to know some extrainious fact about drow is just a sign of a GM that doesnt know how to deal with drow players. Its called a spot check. Thats what they get. Made more dificult with cover and disguise. AND there is a chance that Mr. Ignorant Farmer would see the drow with NO cover, plane and simple, no disguise or anything, naked even. And think, "look, a black elf" and go back to farming.
And that's what we're leaning towards.
If it wasn't for that darned Goodman book bugging the crap out of me...
Maybe I'll put in an email to them.
Heres my thought on the Goodman pic. Its 1 pic in 50baphuckinjillian. GG is wrong. Ill draw you a pick of a drow with 6 fingers and 3 legs and call it obvious everyone with 3 legs is a drow. And all 3 int farmers know this.
I understand, dude - the coincidence of it just bugs me - the local folks here that have heard of the dumb finger joint bit and the Goodman book would likely have a common source...
Nah, we're talking pre-1999 when this occurred...
Keeping himself cloaked/hooded/gloved when hanging out above-ground, it seems that everyone his PC ran into was magically able to determine that he was a drow, because as the DM interpreted things, the Drow's "long slender fingers" were a dead giveaway, and when that was debated, this whole concept of the Drow having an extra finger joint was then tossed up, and it was able to be seen, even through gloved hands.
I think I've seen this problem before...
Inigo: I don't mean to pry. You don't by perhaps have six fingers on your right hand?
Man in Black: Do you always start conversations this way?
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I do have to admit, I have kinda done this before, but not with every commoner the party comes by. I like making the occasional enemy NPC who's exceptionally perceptive and rubs the party's faces in it. It makes it so much more satisfying for the players when they beat him. Seriously, who doesn't like kicking a know-it-all's ass?
Settle the discussion once and for all. Check out D3:Vault of the Drow. Especially the original interior artwork by David C. Sutherland III. I have looked very closely at mine and it looks like five fingers with digits just like ours (except they are pretty darn slender). It is written by Gary Gygax and is the first publishing of drow from TSR (1978).
Paizo has it for pdf (I'm sure) and it has been rated one of the top modules of all time D&D gaming. So after you have settled the arguemnt you can go ahead and play a great game of D&D.