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I am horrible at formatting for the web, but here is my first attempt at this Prestige Class. IT IS UNPLAYTESTED and therefore likely UNBALANCED. I am looking for feedback of any kind. Is this something you could see using in a Pathfinder campaign?
also: How the heck do I make the table clear?
BLOODPRIEST OF PHARASMA
Hit Die: d6.
Requirements:
To qualify to become a bloodpriest, a character must fulfill all the following criteria.
Skills: Heal 8 ranks, Knowledge (Religion) 8 ranks.
Feats: Spell Focus (Necromancy)
Spells: Able to cast divine spells.
Special: Possess either the Death domain or the Repose domain.
Class Skills:
The bloodpriest’s class skills (and the key ability for each skill) are Concentration (Con), Craft (Int), Diplomacy (Cha), Heal (Wis), Knowledge (arcana) (Int), Knowledge (religion) (Int), Profession (Wis), Speak Language , and Spellcraft (Int).
Skill Points at Each Level: 4 + Int modifier.
Table : The Bloodpriest
- Level;BAB;Fort;Ref;Will;Class Feature;Spellcasting
- 1st;+0;+2;+0;+0;Lore of Death, Lore of Life;+1 level of existing divine Spellcasting class
- 2nd;+1;+3;+0;+0;Lifetap;+1 level of existing divine Spellcasting class
- 3rd;+1;+3;+1;+1;Lore of Undeath;+1 level of existing divine Spellcasting class
- 4th;+2;+4;+1;+1;Bonus language;+1 level of existing divine Spellcasting class
- 5th;+2;+4;+1;+1;Lore of Unlife;+1 level of existing divine Spellcasting class
- 6th;+3;+5;+2;+2;Improved Lifetap;+1 level of existing divine Spellcasting class
- 7th;+3;+5;+2;+2;Sacrificial Vision;+1 level of existing divine Spellcasting class
- 8th;+4;+6;+2;+2;Bonus language;+1 level of existing divine Spellcasting class
- 9th;+4;+6;+3;+3;Thwart Fate;+1 level of existing divine Spellcasting class
- 10th;+5;+7;+3;+3;Greater Lifetap;+1 level of existing divine Spellcasting class
Class Features
All of the following are Class Features of the bloodpriest prestige class:
Weapon and Armor Proficiency: Bloodpriests gain no proficiency with any weapon or armor.
Spells per Day/Spells Known: When a new bloodpriest level is gained, the character gains new spells per day (and spells known, if applicable) as if she had also gained a level in a divine spellcasting class she belonged to before she added the prestige class. She does not, however, gain any other benefit a character of that class would have gained. This essentially means that she adds the level of bloodpriest to the level of some other divine spellcasting class the character has, then determines spells per day, spells known, and caster level accordingly.
Lore of Death (Sp): The bloodpriest gains the spell-like ability to cast Gentle Repose a number of times per day equal to her Charisma modifier. In addition, a corpse under the influence of this spell-like ability cannot become undead for the duration of this spell.
Lore of Life (Ex): The bloodpriest is able to use the Heal skill as a free action to perform first aid. In addition, all heal checks are made with a +2 bonus.
Lifetap (Su): A bloodpriest can expend one use of Turn/Rebuke undead to lifetap as a supernatural ability. Lifetap is a standard action. The bloodpriest chooses a single target within 30’. The target is allowed a Will saving throw (DC=10 + Con modifier+class levbel). If the target fails its save, the bloodpriest has made a connection to the target. On the following round, and each round thereafter, the bloodpriest may drain the target of 1d8+5 hit points (as an ‘inflict’ spell) and transfer that health to any other target within 30’ as a standard action (as a ‘cure’ spell). The recipient of the hit points is also entitled to a Will save. Once a connection is made, the bloodpriest may continue to drain the target as above each round as a standard action by expending another Turn/Rebuke undead. The target is allowed another Will save each round to break the connection on their initiative turn.
Lore of Undeath (Su): When a bloodpriest reaches 3rd level, she gains the supernatural ability to Turn/Rebuke undead. She may use this ability a number of times per day equal to 3 + her Charisma modifier. She turns undead as a cleric of two levels lower would. This class ability stacks with Turn Undead from other classes
Bonus Language: A bloodpriest can choose any new language at 4th and 8th level.
Lore of Unlife (Su): The bloodpriest gaine Extra Turning as a bonus Feat.
Improved Lifetap (Su): As Lifetap, but the amount of hit points drained and transferred is now 2d8+10.
Sacrificial Vision (Sp): The bloodpriest can cast Vision 1/day as per the spell. The XP cost is increased to 200 XP.
Thwart Fate (Ex): At 9th level the bloodpriest gains the power of good fortune, which is usable once per day. This extraordinary ability allows the bloodpriest to reroll one roll that she has just made before the DM declares whether the roll results in success or failure. You must take the result of the reroll, even if it’s worse than the original roll.
Greater Lifetap (Su): As Lifetap, but the amount of hit points drained and transferred is now 3d8+15.
Why have Lore of undeath grant the ability to turn/rebuke undead? As a part of having at least one level of cleric as a pre-req (how else get the domain), the character can already do that.
Why have Lore of undeath grant the ability to turn/rebuke undead? As a part of having at least one level of cleric as a pre-req (how else get the domain), the character can already do that.
You could conceiveably take 1 level of cleric (to get the domain), and then level as a druid or some other divine class. With this ability, you would get a better turn undead-ability than you would otherwise.
Neat! I especially like the name.
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Why have Lore of undeath grant the ability to turn/rebuke undead? As a part of having at least one level of cleric as a pre-req (how else get the domain), the character can already do that.
You can meet the domain requirement via certain prestige classes (contemplative comes to mind) or even via certain Unearthed Arcana options (domain druid/ranger)
This allows the ability to turn/rebuke to continue to get better as the character levels up in this prestige class.
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What are they about (obviously specialists in necromancy)? Ie. what do they stand for (or against)? What's their typical alignment? Why do they exist? It's hard to comment on it without knowing these things.
I purposefully left the fluff off. I didn't want the fluff to get in the way of analyzing its balance/playability. It would be easy to say "That class feature doesn't fit the theme" but with Varisia and the details of Pharasma still largely unknown I didn't want to lock the theme down.
But the *catalyst*, if you will, for this Prestige class is the fact that Pharasma is the Goddess of Fate, Death, Prophecy, and Birth. Taking Death and Birth together I felt that a "lifetap" type ability is pretty cool and resolved the class around that. A single "fate" ability and a single "prophecy" ability round the class features out.
While as-of-yet unwritten, the idea is that clerics of Pharasma in general, and the bloodpriest specifically, are masters of the "Realms between": That no-mans land between life and death. Their prophecy derives from listening to the Unborn and the Undead. Bloodpriests hear the whispers of these souls as they travel between the realms of the living (the material) and the realms of the dead (outer planes). Such a close connection gives them insight into the very nature of life and death to the extent that they are able to transfer the life from one creature to another.
An interesting Min/Max combat note: Damaging an enemy Necromancer with Lifetap and transferring the healing to his undead minions to damage them is a very neat trick.
Another Note: I was tempted to drop 1 spellcasting level somewhere in the middle for balance, but I figured the lifetap was actually fairly weak (basically inflict light, then moderate, then Sever). If I kicked those up a category, like (Moderate, Severe, Critical) then dropping a spellcasting level might be necessary.
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RPG Superstar 2011 Top 32
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Overall, I think this PrC is a little underpowered. It doesn’t need the drop in hit die or base attack bonus, so use the usual d8 and moderate BAB progression and consider using the shield othersuggestion. Otherwise, a good job!
AH! You summed up my concerns exactly. I like the shield other idea too.
Stedd - I think you could bump this PrC up a notch, as suggested by ericthecleric. It's refreshing to be able to say that actually. Most proposed/homebrew PrCs are ridiculously overpowered. Nice job here, and very creative!
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The Lore of Life ability is a bit unusual. Using heal to stabilise a dying friend provokes an Attack of Opportunity, but table 8-2 doesn’t say anything about the first aid aspect (or I missed it); I imagine that first aid also provokes an AoO, so have a think about that aspect of Lore of Life. Maybe Lore of Life adds the +2 bonus to Heal checks (as before), and allows the bloodpriest to cast one shield other spell per round as a free action (as long as they have at least one prepared).
Oops! I meant Stabilize, not First Aid. Lore-wise, the idea is that Bloodpriests are so attuned to Life and Death, they can hit a pressure point or two and stabilize a character. And now that I think about, perhaps it should be a swift action. A bloodpriest with 2 or more dieing friends should have to choose...shield other is a good idea, make this class feature less clunky. I original wrote Lore of Life with a "permanent" Deathwatch ability as per the spell of the same name (sans the evil subtype). If the class is underpowered, then prhaps returning back to this is a good idea.
Lifetap is like the cleric using a stand action and turn undead attempt to cast an inflict light wounds and cure light wounds spell at range, with the Improved version acting like moderate wounds, and Greater version like serious wounds. But it requires two saving throws (or one if a willing ally is to be healed); thinking about it, I’d add to the relevant sentence so that it reads: “The recipient of the hit points is also entitled to a Will save, if they are unwilling.”
Yes, you summed it up nicely. I had that last line in there, but in editing it got dropped (I had it described as casting Inflict light wounds and a cure light wounds simultaneously at range, so the last would have been redundant if described that way). But I decided to make it a Supernatural ability instead of a Spell-Like ability and...well...it got cut.
Overall, I think this PrC is a little underpowered. It doesn’t need the drop in hit die or base attack bonus, so use the usual d8 and moderate BAB progression and consider using the other suggestions, too. Otherwise, a good job!
Yeah, I ALWAYS write a PrC on the weak side at first. In fact, with that in mind I might up the BAB but not the hit dice as well as replace the Lore of Life as written with the permanent Deathwatch I described. That may mean its still a hair on the weak side, but its always easier to bump it up in-game than tone it down! Besides, this build relies on a decent Con score, so the lost hp won't matter *much*
Thanks for the feedback. I'll give others a chance to comment then perhaps I'll re-post it here with changes and fluff added.
I like what you've got here and wish I'd thought of it. I'd go with the suggestions to up the HD to d8 and the BAB, and I might suggest adding a few more class skills to round things out. If they're part of a church that deals in prophecy, you might also grant them a limited ability earlier in their advancement to look into the future. Perhaps use of augury as a spell-like ability 2/day at that level when they gain a bonus language?
How the heck do I make the table clear?
Probably the best way is to take out the BAB and Saves columns, and the divine spellcasting +1, and just say that the Bloodpriest gets a Poor BAB, Good Fort and Poor Relex and Will saves, and then your table only includes the bonus stuff. We all know what Poor BAB and Good Fort etc means.
In general for Prestige classes, I am not a big fan of 10/10 spellcasting progressions, as they give very little reason to not take them. Also, taking out 1 level of spellcasting, makes it much harder to overpower them, as spellcasting is just THAT GOOD.
Having said that, I think I agree with others that this is a little underpowered. You may want to up the Hitdice to a d8, and BAB to Medium, skillpoints down to 2+INT, and simply drop spellcasting progression from the first level. (And maybe back to a good will save)
Clerics are generally the back up warriors of the party, and that is a VERY hard job to fill with a Poor AB and d6 Hitdice.
Looking at the Blodpriest, from the standard cleric, the Hitdice goes down, BAB goes down, Skillpoints go up and Will save goes down. The only thing that stays the same is spellcasting, and Fort saves (oh, and reflex saves, but they barely count).
I know if I was playing a cleric, I wouldn't want my character to change so much once I started taking levels in a PrC. Why does this focus on Birth/Death make them less efficient warriors, to me it seems as if it would rather distract from the spellcasting, as the get a number of Spell-Like abilities.
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Ok, I incorporated some changes. Beefed it up a bit, but I removed 2 spellcasting levels. Maybe I need to put level 6 spellcasting back in...
BLOODPRIEST OF PHARASMA
Hit Die: d8.
Requirements:
To qualify to become a bloodpriest, a character must fulfill all the following criteria.
Skills: Heal 8 ranks, Knowledge (Religion) 8 ranks.
Feats: Spell Focus (Necromancy)
Spells: Able to cast divine spells.
Special: Possess either the Death domain or the Repose domain.
Class Skills:
The bloodpriest’s class skills (and the key ability for each skill) are Concentration (Con), Craft (Int), Diplomacy (Cha), Heal (Wis), Knowledge (arcana) (Int), Knowledge (religion) (Int), Profession (Wis), Speak Language , and Spellcraft (Int).
Skill Points at Each Level: 4 + Int modifier.
Table : The Bloodpriest
- Average BAB, Good Fort and Will saves, Poor reflex save.
- 1st Level - Lore of Death, Lore of Life
- 2nd - Lifetap, +1 level of existing divine Spellcasting class
- 3rd - Lore of Undeath, +1 level of existing divine Spellcasting class
- 4th - Written in Blood, +1 level of existing divine Spellcasting class
- 5th - Lore of Unlife, +1 level of existing divine Spellcasting class
- 6th - Improved Lifetap
- 7th - Sacrificial Vision, +1 level of existing divine Spellcasting class
- 8th - Bonus language, +1 level of existing divine Spellcasting class
- 9th - Thwart Fate, +1 level of existing divine Spellcasting class
- 10th - Greater Lifetap, +1 level of existing divine Spellcasting class
Class Features
All of the following are Class Features of the bloodpriest prestige class:
Weapon and Armor Proficiency: Bloodpriests gain no proficiency with any weapon or armor.
Spells per Day/Spells Known: When a new bloodpriest level is gained, the character gains new spells per day (and spells known, if applicable) as if she had also gained a level in a divine spellcasting class she belonged to before she added the prestige class. She does not, however, gain any other benefit a character of that class would have gained. This essentially means that she adds the level of bloodpriest to the level of some other divine spellcasting class the character has, then determines spells per day, spells known, and caster level accordingly.
Lore of Death (Sp): The bloodpriest gains the spell-like ability to cast Gentle Repose a number of times per day equal to her Charisma modifier. In addition, a corpse under the influence of this spell-like ability cannot become undead for the duration of this spell.
Lore of Life (Sp): The bloodpriest is under the effect of permanent Deathwatch spell. This effect is identical to the spell of the same name except it no longer has the Evil subtype and it is always active.
Lifetap (Su): A bloodpriest can expend one use of Turn/Rebuke undead to lifetap as a supernatural ability. Lifetap is a standard action. The bloodpriest chooses a single target within 30’. The target is allowed a Will saving throw (DC=10 + Con modifier+class levbel). If the target fails its save, the bloodpriest has made a connection to the target. On the following round, and each round thereafter, the bloodpriest may drain the target of 1d8+5 hit points (as an ‘inflict’ spell) and transfer that health to any other target within 30’ as a standard action (as a ‘cure’ spell). The recipient of the hit points is also entitled to a Will save. Once a connection is made, the bloodpriest may continue to drain the target as above each round as a standard action by expending another Turn/Rebuke undead. The target is allowed another Will save each round to break the connection on their initiative turn.
Lore of Undeath (Su): When a bloodpriest reaches 3rd level, she gains the supernatural ability to Turn/Rebuke undead. She may use this ability a number of times per day equal to 3 + her Charisma modifier. She turns undead as a cleric of two levels lower would. This class ability stacks with Turn Undead from other classes.
Written in Blood (Sp): At 4th level the bloodpriest may cast Speak with Dead a number of times equal to her Charisma modifier. The language dependency of the spell is ignored as the bloodpriest interprets clues form the corpse rather than actually listening to the dead speak. Many bloodpriests use this ability to determine the cause of death of animals as well as sentient beings, for example.
Bonus Language: A bloodpriest can choose any new language at 8th level.
Lore of Unlife (Su): The bloodpriest gaine Extra Turning as a bonus Feat.
Improved Lifetap (Su): As Lifetap, but the amount of hit points drained and transferred is now 2d8+10.
Sacrificial Vision (Sp): The bloodpriest can cast Vision 1/day as per the spell. The XP cost is increased to 200 XP.
Thwart Fate (Ex): At 9th level the bloodpriest gains the power of good fortune, which is usable once per day. This extraordinary ability allows the bloodpriest to re-roll one roll that she has just made before the DM declares whether that roll results in success or failure. You must take the result of the re-roll, even if it’s worse than the original roll.
Greater Lifetap (Su): As Lifetap, but the amount of hit points drained and transferred is now 3d8+15.
Why does lifetapping take two rounds? You have to burn a standard action and turn attempt on the first round and nothing happens until a round later, when you must continue to use a standard action? Change it so that they can drain and transfer the hit points the same round they make the connection. As written, the ability is far too weak. This makes it much stronger, but I really wouldn't worry about it being overpowered, especially if you leave off two levels of spellcasting.
Otherwise, I really like it.
I think "Lore of Unlife" should be an extrodinary ability rather than a supernatural one since it is only a bonus feat.
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RPG Superstar 2011 Top 32
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I think "Lore of Unlife" should be an extrodinary ability rather than a supernatural one since it is only a bonus feat.
Yeah, but it's cooler as a supernatural effect. It's like Pharasma is channeling the power straight into the priest, or has gifted them with such Lore - giving them extra power over the undead.
I think "Lore of Unlife" should be an extrodinary ability rather than a supernatural one since it is only a bonus feat.Yeah, but it's cooler as a supernatural effect. It's like Pharasma is channeling the power straight into the priest, or has gifted them with such Lore - giving them extra power over the undead.
I admit that getting the power straight from the deity is cool, but since this feat might become a prerequisite for another feat or prestige class. If either have an extrodinary ability then I believe that those abilities would require the supernatural feat to work even if they are extrodinary (which I admit is unlikely to occur).
RPG Superstar 2009 Top 32, 2010 Top 8
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I like the revised version. The extra abilties seem to balance out the loss of two caster levels. (I'm not a fan of full caster prestige classes either) I agree on the same round blood transfer. I'm guessing that the concern was esentially throwing a cure and an inflict in the same round. I'd argue three good reasons for allowing it to be the same round.
1) This ability allows the cleric to heal and damage in the same round, since many players hate 'wasting an action to heal' this is more enticing.
2) I may have misread, but it's save for no effect, right? Even save for half, you're burning a finite resource, your turn undead attempts, to power it.
2a) Yes I know the 'bag of nightsticks' cheese. Any prestige class for pathfinder should be balanced against the SRD, not horrid things like that.
3) There's a power that does the heal/damage routine in a similar fashion, Hostile Empathic Transfer (again, ignoring the Complete Psionic nerf since that's not SRD) so it working in a single round would be fine.
This might be a little late, but...
...why do you not require the character be a Pharasma worshiper?
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I like the revised version. The extra abilties seem to balance out the loss of two caster levels. (I'm not a fan of full caster prestige classes either) I agree on the same round blood transfer. I'm guessing that the concern was esentially throwing a cure and an inflict in the same round. I'd argue three good reasons for allowing it to be the same round.
1) This ability allows the cleric to heal and damage in the same round, since many players hate 'wasting an action to heal' this is more enticing.
2) I may have misread, but it's save for no effect, right? Even save for half, you're burning a finite resource, your turn undead attempts, to power it.
2a) Yes I know the 'bag of nightsticks' cheese. Any prestige class for pathfinder should be balanced against the SRD, not horrid things like that.
3) There's a power that does the heal/damage routine in a similar fashion, Hostile Empathic Transfer (again, ignoring the Complete Psionic nerf since that's not SRD) so it working in a single round would be fine.
I was indeed concerned about heal/damage in the same round. I was tempted to make it work on a "fire-forget" style, that is just do it, especially since I dropped 2 spellcasting levels. I will probably do that in the next incarnation. I have no problem with that change, perhaps even a small bump in the damage/heal amount as well.
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Stedd: If you don’t mind me asking, do you think that Prestige Classes should be weaker than standard classes?
I do not. I am just VERY cautious in PrC design. As I stated in an earlier post, I believe its better to have a slightly weak PrC rather than a slightly more powerful PrC when introducing them to a campaign. It's easy for a DM to give it a small boost, no player will argue. But "nerf" an ability and trouble is down the road.
I posted both versions with the understanding that neither of them are what I consider 'playable'.
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I admit that getting the power straight from the deity is cool, but since this feat might become a prerequisite for another feat or prestige class. If either have an extrodinary ability then I believe that those abilities would require the supernatural feat to work even if they are extrodinary (which I admit is unlikely to occur).I think "Lore of Unlife" should be an extrodinary ability rather than a supernatural one since it is only a bonus feat.Yeah, but it's cooler as a supernatural effect. It's like Pharasma is channeling the power straight into the priest, or has gifted them with such Lore - giving them extra power over the undead.
I may be wrong...but I am pretty sure Turn Undead is a Supernatural ability. A feat giving you more supernatural abilities may be a bit redundant. Hmmm...now that I think about it, gaining a feat is neither Sp, Su, or Ex...it just is.
I would probably like to know a bit more about Pharasma's priesthood before I commented further on this prc. At the moment the prc looks pretty good, but again I'd wait to see some more official Paizo stuff about Pharasma first.
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RPG Superstar 2009 Top 32, 2010 Top 8
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Feats are by defualt (ex) abilities. Psionic feats are SU.
Because psionic feats are supernatural abilities—a departure from the general rule that feats do not grant supernatural abilities—they cannot be disrupted in combat (as powers can be) and generally do not provoke attacks of opportunity (except as noted in their descriptions). Supernatural abilities are not subject to power resistance and cannot be dispelled; however, they do not function in areas where psionics is suppressed, such as a null psionics field. Leaving such an area immediately allows psionic feats to be used.
And if I may speak to the prestige class losing levels thing.
A prestige class should be as good as a core class at that level. In other words, a Cleric X/Prestige Y should be on par with a Cleric X+Y.
A Cleric and Sorcerer both get no special features, except increased caster level, and a wizard gets bonus feats only. Every prestige class gets specific features. In other words, if a prestige class casts as well as a core class of same charater level, why would you -not- prestige out? (I'm looking at you Abjurant Champion)
I'll say there are a very few classes primarily the Archmage, where full casting makes sense. The Archmage gives up three average to poor feats, and pays for their arcana with spell slots.
If you have to weigh delayed/deferred casting ability for the prestige classes perks, that's balance.
Must be your young eyes, Saern! :-)
I wish that were the case. While young, my eyes aren't the sharpest in the world. My genetics have had me in glasses for reading and driving for some time now. :)
Stedd: I like your philosophy when it comes to designing these PrCs. This bloodpriest is looking very inticing.