Did anyone here ever run an Aztec/Inca/Maya-based campagin? How did it go, what special rules/monsters/plots did you use?
Thanks,
Uri
Hmm...the closest thing I ever got to was a Planescape adventure that I ran. I was...seventeen? at the time, so, it was a little odd.
From what I can remember, it involved wererats, couatls, a sacred sacrificial dagger and an Andean-mummy like cavern complex.
Yes the module I1 Dwellers of the Forbidden City was set in a ruined jungle city of the Olman empire, the Greyhawk equivalent of Aztecs/Mayans. There were yuan-ti, tasloi, mongrelmen, and other jungle critters. The other module that was set in the same area was C1 Hidden Shrine of Tamoachan. This got more into the Olman Pantheon, listing several of the gods. It featured an ogre mage and a western vampire (slightly different from traditional vamps). I played both of these in college under 1st ed ADnD rules. I tried to play up the theme since I was taking a Mexican history class at that time and was interested in the Aztecs. Both of these are available for pdf download through Paizo.
If you are looking for more current stuff, you will be delighted to see that the upcoming Savage tide AP has some adventures in the Olman region, specifically there is a hint of a return to Lost Tamaochan. I personally am looking forward to this. If you don't run the whole AP you might just take those bits that fit your goal.
I don't know what setting you are playing in but in Greyhawk, the Olman empire is in decline. This has happened even before the Flanaess version of Cloumbian exploration has occurred, so you can't blame it on smallpox! I don't play Forgotten Realms, but I did read a Maztica trilogy a few years back and I think that more closely reflects our history with the new world being discovered by the old.
Good luck with your campaign.
I had that stone sword from Tamaochan built for a LARP latex weapon as a movie prop. Though mine has the look of marbleized green stone teeth attached dark wooden frame.
You could download the Maztica boxed set released to 2nd edition AD&D that covered an Aztec like culture. I've never read it so I cannot comment on the quality but it is freely available here: http://www.wizards.com/dnd/files/tsr1066.zip
I had that stone sword from Tamaochan built for a LARP latex weapon as a movie prop. Though mine has the look of marbleized green stone teeth attached dark wooden frame.
Do you have any picture of this ? I would like to see what it looks like.
Stefan
You could download the Maztica boxed set released to 2nd edition AD&D that covered an Aztec like culture. I've never read it so I cannot comment on the quality but it is freely available here: http://www.wizards.com/dnd/files/tsr1066.zip
It is rather close to real-world history, IIRC, but has some nice ideas and is worth a look (especially as it is for free).
I liked the touch to call the conqueror Cordell :-)Stefan
I tried this in college once. I converted a lot of the equipment to pseudoAztec. Leather armor was jaguar skin armor, chain mail was woven feathers with the hollow stems filled with gold dust, swords were wooden with onyx teeth. Most of the players thought it was weird but ok, but one guy made fun of everything. All his sentences started like, "Even though I look rediculous in the stupid bird armor, I ..." Absolutely no intention of having any fun in the setting. We tried it twice and then I gave up.
I don't know what setting you are playing in but in Greyhawk, the Olman empire is in decline. This has happened even before the Flanaess version of Cloumbian exploration has occurred, so you can't blame it on smallpox! I don't play Forgotten Realms, but I did read a Maztica trilogy a few years back and I think that more closely reflects our history with the new world being discovered by the old.
Good luck with your campaign.
The Aztecs may have been devastated by smallpox (among other diseases, after contact they had a Spanish Influenza epidemic every couple of years or so.)
The Maya, on the other hand, just stopped building and maintaining their cities. The people are pretty much still there (along with a lot of the beliefs with a thin layer of Catholocism over the top). There are a bunch of different theories as to why. It's one of those "great mysteries" which you can get a lot of mileage out of answering in a campaing setting.
I had that stone sword from Tamaochan built for a LARP latex weapon as a movie prop. Though mine has the look of marbleized green stone teeth attached dark wooden frame.
AKA a "maquahuitl"
Usually made of shards of obsidian. Obsidian may shatter but it's sharper than surgical steel. In fact, the cutting edge is mono-molecular.
While not the most accurate source, but inspiring nonetheless, Act III (Kurast) in the DiabloII video game has a definite Mesoamerican flair to it. It is a jungle and swamp scenario with bazaars and a causeway leading to the capital city. There are giant spiders, vultures, undead, pygmies shooting blowdarts, tree creatures, swarms, tentacled swamp critters flinging poison. The religious zealots in the later parts of the scenario definitely look the part.
While not the most accurate source, but inspiring nonetheless, Act III (Kurast) in the DiabloII video game has a definite Mesoamerican flair to it. It is a jungle and swamp scenario with bazaars and a causeway leading to the capital city. There are giant spiders, vultures, undead, pygmies shooting blowdarts, tree creatures, swarms, tentacled swamp critters flinging poison. The religious zealots in the later parts of the scenario definitely look the part.
Agreed! Ahh...Diablo II...once again you have captured my heart, being able to run on my Linux laptop...
Those pygmies freak me out, though!
AKA a "maquahuitl"Usually made of shards of obsidian. Obsidian may shatter but it's sharper than surgical steel. In fact, the cutting edge is mono-molecular.
That is one wild fun fact. I will remember it. Thanks.
That is one wild fun fact. I will remember it. Thanks.
AKA a "maquahuitl"Usually made of shards of obsidian. Obsidian may shatter but it's sharper than surgical steel. In fact, the cutting edge is mono-molecular.
From personal experience, it's something you never forget after the first time you try making an obsidian tool and you see the shards in your flesh. (Well actually you usually see the blood first.) It's so sharp, you never feel any pain.
From personal experience, it's something you never forget after the first time you try making an obsidian tool and you see the shards in your flesh. (Well actually you usually see the blood first.) It's so sharp, you never feel any pain.
I've accidentally cut myself on some truly sharp blades and the sharpest ones do have a way of not hurting as they split you open. Wonder why that is? For some reason when I'm cut and there isn't any pain it causes me to momentarily regard myself as a souless machine; rather, an ambulatory pile of meat. I'm not saying that isn't exactly what I really am (don't give me more credit than I deserve), only that painless slices have a way of bringing it home.
I had that stone sword from Tamaochan built for a LARP latex weapon as a movie prop. Though mine has the look of marbleized green stone teeth attached dark wooden frame.Do you have any picture of this ? I would like to see what it looks like.
Stefan
All the movie props are in currently in storage but I may have a picture around here somewhere. I'll keep an eye out. I worked with Sean Macguire, the owner of prop place in Scotland called Skian Mhor. They worked off my designs. Sean said the last shipment he sent to me was returned to him by the UK post damaged. He had been paid up front and never recreated my props. So he screwed me for $300 and even kept my one of kind professionally commissioned sketches. He is foul. Talented, but foul. Although I know a rather intimidating attourney in Scotland who greatly wanted to retrieve my money I'm the type to just throw up my hands and walk away. It's the loss of the sketches that most haunts me.
Wow, all these stories are really cool, really gives one motivation to start an indian campagin...
I've accidentally cut myself on some truly sharp blades and the sharpest ones do have a way of not hurting as they split you open. Wonder why that is? For some reason when I'm cut and there isn't any pain it causes me to momentarily regard myself as a souless machine; rather, an ambulatory pile of meat. I'm not saying that isn't exactly what I really am (don't give me more credit than I deserve), only that painless slices have a way of bringing it home.From personal experience, it's something you never forget after the first time you try making an obsidian tool and you see the shards in your flesh. (Well actually you usually see the blood first.) It's so sharp, you never feel any pain.
It slices right through the nerves. They don't get a chance to fire. I have met a guy who sliced a tendon working obsidian. It took several surgeries to to get the finger working again. It still looks odd. Flint (and by extension, glass, since flint is effectively dirty glass) doesn't cut so clean. It hurts when you screw up.
I have also heard of an archaeologist who convinced a Dr. to open him up for open heart surgery starting with a surgical steel scalpel then using a set of obsidian blades. There is basically no scar for the half of the incision done by obsidian, the cut was that clean.
More fun obsidian facts: It's mostly black, but it can come in a variety of different colors - green, marbled green black, snowflakes in black, red, black & red, white, etc. Pretty pretty deadly weapons.
Don't forget Atl Atl's!!! Meso-Americans either forgot how or never learned how to make bows, so they used sticks to propel special spears (essentialy javelins). According to early Spanish resords, they could pierce the breastplates worn by the Conquistadors @ 300 yards. With stone headed javelins. I stated them out so they act like short bows, but A. they can't be used mounted, and B. a character has to take EITHER Crossbow/Bow or Atl Atl proficiency, not both. But it stays a simple weapon if you take the prof. Good for druids or sorcerers as a flavor thing, but no one ever took it :(
Don't forget Atl Atl's!!! Meso-Americans either forgot how or never learned how to make bows, so they used sticks to propel special spears (essentialy javelins). According to early Spanish resords, they could pierce the breastplates worn by the Conquistadors @ 300 yards. With stone headed javelins. I stated them out so they act like short bows, but A. they can't be used mounted, and B. a character has to take EITHER Crossbow/Bow or Atl Atl proficiency, not both. But it stays a simple weapon if you take the prof. Good for druids or sorcerers as a flavor thing, but no one ever took it :(
Atl-atl hurled javelins were used to kill mammoths. They have tested the theory out by using them against (culled) elephants. You can get the javelin into it's heart, through the same skin people have used to make very effective armor, feet of muscle and some pretty dense bone.
I would consider an atl-atl it a simple weapon (it's basically just adding in another elbow). It would just increase the range of a javelin or dart. A lot. Maybe it would increase the crit multple or range (as an offset to the whole issue of using ranged weapons in hand to hand).
Meso-americans did have bows though. Pretty much everyone from Tierra del Fuego to the Arctic circle had bows of some sort. I am sure I have seen them on Mayan stele and I think there was a bow mentioned in the Popul Vuh somewhere. Atl-atl's are just so much better at punching your way to something vital. Stone tipped arrows have pretty small arrow heads, less power and less damage. Almost all "arrowheads" people find were actually for javelins. If you have a large stone arrow head, you shoot the bow and the arrow falls at your feet.
that sword from the module... is that the one that had a bonus to hit vs. gas spores? I never got that one... IIRC, you don't want to hit gas spores with a sword, as they blow up in your face and hurt you. Arrows, sure.. but a sword?
Oh, you've never tried it?! If you make your save you get SUCH a buzz.
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Oh, you've never tried it?! If you make your save you get SUCH a buzz.
that sword from the module... is that the one that had a bonus to hit vs. gas spores? I never got that one... IIRC, you don't want to hit gas spores with a sword, as they blow up in your face and hurt you. Arrows, sure.. but a sword?
Meee.Shminnymumishnoo.
Oh, you've never tried it?! If you make your save you get SUCH a buzz.and it also gives wizards a +2 magical bonus when casting
"detect schnozberries"
Not only can you detect secret doors for two hours afterwards, you can manifest secret doors that aren't even there!*
*Which to the rest of us looks like a glaze-eyed guy walking into a wall and staying there for a while. Maybe licking it a few times. Giggling. Offering to buy it a drink.
Just so this thread doesn't get completely jacked, south and mesoamerican native cultures (well EVERY native culture actually) have a pretty documented history of drug use. Whether it be to pep them up as they stalked through the jungle by chewing on coca leaves, or shaman types using halucinogenics to create visions, there are plenty of opportunities to implement some supplementary rules into your game. I know that the Book of Vile Darkness has some rules, but there are bound to be others out there as well. A couple of experiences spread out during your campaign could provide for some curveballs for your players.
HEY NOW! How about a class of shamans who use special flora to see visions. The visions manifest in reality... like the secret door I'd mentioned. So that misty boa that the shaman sees floating before him materializes and actually launches out to wrap around an enemy and squeeze his entrails out like spray cheese. An illusionist whose magic is powered by his induced hallucinations. Nah? Yeah? Nah?
Perhaps some self-transformation abilities like William Hurt in Altered States after drinking that spiked goat's blood.
And what of healing? Maybe the shaman can look at a wound and see it not there anymore... and the wound isn't there any more.
Meee.Shminnymumishnoo.Oh, you've never tried it?! If you make your save you get SUCH a buzz.
that sword from the module... is that the one that had a bonus to hit vs. gas spores? I never got that one... IIRC, you don't want to hit gas spores with a sword, as they blow up in your face and hurt you. Arrows, sure.. but a sword?
My players are stoned enough already... (I hope they ain't readin' this or else I'll get stoned!)
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Obsidian is a volcanic glass. Flint/chert and chalcedony are cryptocrystalline rocks that are more common/more readily gatherable to most prehistoric cultures. Chert, chalcedony, and obsidian all have very homogenous make-ups and when fracture in very characteristic ways. I've also seen archaeologists and knappers who use modern glass, coke bottle bases, and even hard candy to make tools. I have a lithic-specialist buddy from Pennsylvania who has relatives that work at an industrial glass factory and give him big chunks of slag glass to work with.
I don't recall the name of the first Dr. who used obsidian scalpels in modern heart surgery, but if I remember correctly, he was from Houston and was an avocational archaeologist. His experiences with stone tool manufacture were what got him thinking about obsidian in a surgical context. When he found out he had to have heart surgery, he made his own blades for one of his colleagues to use.
There was a study through the University of Maryland School of Medicine tracking the progres of post-op patients, some operated on with traditional tools, some with obsidian tools. The tensile stength of the scars tended to be approximately the same, but the obsidian scars were narrower and less prone to inflamation. Because of those two facts, they are being used more frequently in plastic surgeries.
Obsidian tools used in surgery today are ground, not 'knapped', and like The Jade mentioned, they can be ground to and incredibly fine point. The company that mainly did obsidian tools in the 90s was called Aztecnics, but I don't think that they are in business any more.
Obsidian = good...unless you wear flip-flops when you work it. Little, tiny bits of obsidian debitage between your toes is not a good idea.
My players are stoned enough already... (I hope they ain't readin' this or else I'll get stoned!)
I doubt your stoner players could muster the ambition to throw rocks. They're probably holding rocks, forgetting why they are holding rocks, and spinning off into conversations about rock concerts. You'll find them there on the couch in the backyard still talking at 11pm.
I actually want to flesh out that class I thought up above (unless it already exists). Although it's anthropology 101, I wouldn't expect to get it published as it deals with substances that affect the mind other than alcohol and WoTC and Paizo do have to watch their acts.
Although Merrowyn Owl from AoW? That's not foolin' anyone! ;) Nor did Beladonna Took from the Hobbit. That was Tolkein giving us his two word 'how-to' on fantasy writing.
Obsidian tools used in surgery today are ground, not 'knapped', and like The Jade mentioned, they can be ground to and incredibly fine point. The company that mainly did obsidian tools in the 90s was called Aztecnics, but I don't think that they are in business any more.
I really do learn quite a bit on these boards.
Can't take credit for the bit about the mono-molecular edge though... that bit o' knowledge was brought to you by the good folks at CallawayR.
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I actually want to flesh out that class I thought up above (unless it already exists). Although it's anthropology 101, I wouldn't expect to get it published as it deals with substances that affect the mind other than alcohol and WoTC and Paizo do have to watch their acts.
I've got 6 ranks in Knowledge (Psilocybin Mushrooms)... I can hear the colors! He-he-he-he-he-he! Now I'm horny.
'shrooms in action are, um, interesting to watch. Milage may vary (uh, from what I understand).
I doubt your stoner players could muster the ambition to throw rocks. They're probably holding rocks, forgetting why they are holding rocks, and spinning off into conversations about rock concerts. You'll find them there on the couch in the backyard still talking at 11pm.
Well, that's not too far from the truth, my players play a bunch of orc siblings (nasty D&D orcs, not the noble WoW breed, I hate these!) who raid a peacfeul and subdued mexican-like society already enslaved by the spaniard-like people. Soon, they'll come face to face with their Aztec cousins...
One of them plays, suspicously well, an Orc stoner with a Memento-like memory span ("You see, I have this condition...") and extremly unstable personality. One time he got stoned and hurled his magic shield at the enemy and proceeded to block stones with a spear...
Well, that's not too far from the truth, my players play a bunch of orc siblings (nasty D&D orcs, not the noble WoW breed, I hate these!) who raid a peacfeul and subdued mexican-like society already enslaved by the spaniard-like people. Soon, they'll come face to face with their Aztec cousins...
One of them plays, suspicously well, an Orc stoner with a Memento-like memory span ("You see, I have this condition...") and extremly unstable personality. One time he got stoned and hurled his magic shield at the enemy and proceeded to block stones with a spear...
That must lead to great roleplay but how do you keep him alive? A lil rule bending in the name of good comedy?
The Aztecs may have been devastated by smallpox (among other diseases, after contact they had a Spanish Influenza epidemic every couple of years or so.)No one expects the Spanish Influenza!
...sorry. I had to. I don't know what came over me.
Well, really, no one DID expect it. It was the first global pandemic. No one had ever had to deal with something like that.
And unlike the Inquisition, the Influenza viri didn't even have high minded principles (except maybe "COPY ME, COPY ME, COPY ME")
I actually want to flesh out that class I thought up above (unless it already exists). Although it's anthropology 101, I wouldn't expect to get it published as it deals with substances that affect the mind other than alcohol and WoTC and Paizo do have to watch their acts.I've got 6 ranks in Knowledge (Psilocybin Mushrooms)... I can hear the colors! He-he-he-he-he-he! Now I'm horny.
'shrooms in action are, um, interesting to watch. Milage may vary (uh, from what I understand).
Until they start throwing up on everything.
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I've been trying to figure out what a dzolob is all day. All it says on the net is they were "the offenders." Hunab Ku, the Mayan creator deity, seems to have destroyed the 1st age of the dwarves that built the cities, then second age of the dzolob, and we are currently in the third age of man, which alarmists think is coming to an end in 2012.
That's what is kind of challenging about Central America. The archaeology is sparse because the invaders destroyed a lot of the texts, and archaeology is made difficult because jungle is notoriously hard on materiel. I remember being down in Panama, and the seeing the workers with string trimmers sculpting the lawns, but the jungle was just patiently waiting for the opportunity to reabsorb all the funny little manmade buildings and contrivances.
Uri,
There was a very good adventure in Dragon #70 called "Mechica" which is exactly what you are looking for. Maybe you can hunt on E-bay or something if you don't have the Dragon archive CD ROM.
Stefan
I've been trying to figure out what a dzolob is all day. All it says on the net is they were "the offenders." Hunab Ku, the Mayan creator deity, seems to have destroyed the 1st age of the dwarves that built the cities, then second age of the dzolob, and we are currently in the third age of man, which alarmists think is coming to an end in 2012.
That's what is kind of challenging about Central America. The archaeology is sparse because the invaders destroyed a lot of the texts, and archaeology is made difficult because jungle is notoriously hard on materiel. I remember being down in Panama, and the seeing the workers with string trimmers sculpting the lawns, but the jungle was just patiently waiting for the opportunity to reabsorb all the funny little manmade buildings and contrivances.
According to FASA's Shadowrun game, the next age of man in the Mayan Calender is set to begin on December 26th 2011 with the Emergenace of the Great Dragon Ryumo over Mount Fuji in Japan, heralding the return of magic.
That's a date i'm watching with geeky fascination though i'm not holding my breath lol.Be safe all.
That must lead to great roleplay but how do you keep him alive? A lil rule bending in the name of good comedy?
Two facts keep him alive:
A) The other players look after him (after all, he is there brother).B) He is big. I mean real big. Like one step away from large with stats to match.
Uri,
There was a very good adventure in Dragon #70 called "Mechica" which is exactly what you are looking for. Maybe you can hunt on E-bay or something if you don't have the Dragon archive CD ROM.
Stefan
70? Are you sure, because the Paizo website has no records of this adventure...
Yes, I looked it up in my Dragon CD ROM archive because I remembered the adventure when I read it the first time back in '83 and I was impressed by it. After you posted, I checked to verify the issue number. Let me go back to it and give you a review of what it contains, so you have a better idea before you spend your money hunting on e-bay.
Okay, Dragon magazine #70 (February 1983), Mechica, an AD&D adventure for 4th-7th level, by Gali Sanchez (no, not GALIL, I know what you're thinking, LOL).
Features adventurers wandering into the Sapotec mountains to find a lost culture of Mechica, an Aztec/Mayan culture based on sacrifice and worship of werejaguars. Skimming through the intro, I see nice artwork (for the 80's), encounter tables, rules on converting armor classes.
The adventure is essentially a "backdrop" which is why I thought it would be perfect for what you are looking for. The adventure describes cities and temple sites around a lake and river in the Sapotec mountains. There are maps of temples and cities, descriptions of rituals and key NPCs. The final battle is to get the emperor's treasure in Tenocatlan, which is the center of Mechica existence.
I never ran the adventure back in the day, but I was impressed by it when I read....impressed enough to remember it 23 years later when you asked about it.
I think the free Maztica download from Wizards website might be all you need. I just looked at it and it's pretty cool.
I think the free Maztica download from Wizards website might be all you need. I just looked at it and it's pretty cool.
Thanks, it's really helpful.
Uri,
There was a very good adventure in Dragon #70 called "Mechica" which is exactly what you are looking for. Maybe you can hunt on E-bay or something if you don't have the Dragon archive CD ROM.
Stefan
I found it and it's perfect, simply perfect.
Thanks.
I believe there's rules for Atl-Atls in one of the Dragons, in a Barbarian Class acts. It also has rules for Celts.
As for the Maqahuitl(sp?) There's stats for it in the MMIV.
Cool, any idea what issue Dragon that was?