Much as I love killing off characters (my name says it all), for some reason my players are less than thrilled by it. Years ago, while playing through RttToEE one of the characters was killed and raised, then because they were a level back, the wound up getting killed again, and again. The fourth time the character died, the player said "screw it, Darian will just kick up his heels in the afterlife and let a more worthy adventurer save the world." Then the player made a whole new character (that never really fit as well) that wouldn't be 7th running with a pack of 11th level characters. Ever since that day my entire group has lived in fear of falling into the "Darian Pit."
Since a more recent PC fatality, I've come back to that old problem. Is the penalty for dying to harsh? There's no way around the level loss until True Resurrection (which costs 25,000 gp). Back in 2E all you lost was a Con point when you got raised. I recognize that in 3.x the idea is that the act of coming back from the dead is a taxing experience and it takes some time before you regain your strength, but perhaps the level loss isn't the best way to depict this as you never really get back to full strength.
Here's what I'm kicking around: When the character returns from the dead they they lose 100 xp per level (unless its a True Res) and they gain a negative level, that Restoration cannot remove, for a set number of days depending on the spell used to revive them (say 10 days for Raise Dead, 5 Days for Resurrection, 1 day for True res), at the end of which they are back to normal.
I'm curious about opinions. I don't want to make coming back from the grave to be a piece of cake, or cheapen the impact of such a death, but I don't want it to wreck the fun for my players either.
There is some built in mitigation via the experience table which rewards lower level characters more lavishly then higher level ones.
Also would think that this issue is somewhat mitigated by party size. If you have six players its easier to play a little more cautiously after dying and let the other players take more of the risks. If you only have four players and the dead character is the party fighter its nearly impossible - he has to go toe to toe with the Demon as there is no one else to do that job and is therefore in even more danger of dying again after loosing a level.
I have also noticed that dying can be something of a personality trait among players. Some of my players seem much more prone to dying then others. One of my players keeps making fighter types and then has a penchant for dragging the rest of the party past were they should stop and rest - 'Just one more room...That was not so bad - just one more room'. Of course being the fighter he's stuck way out in front when the players realize that this fight is not one they can handle with the 0 level spells they have remaining, turn tail and flee.
As an olde schoole gamer, I am an inveterate rules-bender and advocate of the same. If you want to change the rules to prevent the "Darian Trap", then go for it. The point of the game is to have fun; don't let the rules get in your way.
That said, you may want to talk it over with the group first, and find a simpler fix. If the character died magnificently (throwing himself in front of the wizard so she could cast the spell that would save the party), then his god could smile on him, and grant only half a level's XP loss. Another potential solution could be the other characters "donating" XP to the "Level the Meat Shield" fund. I wouldn't allow them to bring him up to par; death should (after all) set you back somehow...
Telas
Have you seen the Revivify spell? It's a 5th level Cleric spell that functions as True Resurrection, but only on characters who have been dead for a very short time (it's either 1 round, or 1 round per caster level). I believe it only takes 100gp worth of diamonds to use it, too.
Something else you might consider is ability damage. Perhaps instead of losing a level, the character takes a hit to Constitution or Charisma (whichever is higher), which can't be healed by magic but otherwise recovers as normal for ability damage. Something like 2 or 4 points should do it. But I'm just throwing that one off the top of my head, so feel free not to take it seriously.
Have you seen the Revivify spell? It's a 5th level Cleric spell that functions as True Resurrection, but only on characters who have been dead for a very short time (it's either 1 round, or 1 round per caster level). I believe it only takes 100gp worth of diamonds to use it, too.
Something else you might consider is ability damage. Perhaps instead of losing a level, the character takes a hit to Constitution or Charisma (whichever is higher), which can't be healed by magic but otherwise recovers as normal for ability damage. Something like 2 or 4 points should do it. But I'm just throwing that one off the top of my head, so feel free not to take it seriously.
The spell has to be cast within 1 round and takes a 1000 gold peice diamond. The cleric in my campaigns carries all his wealth around in 1000gp diamonds.
I think Jeremy hit the nail on the head. lower level characters gain more XP per encounter, which means the slowly catch up to the rest of the party. In my experience, it takes about 2-3 levels for someone to close the gap.
Another thing you could consider, is encouraing the party wizard and cleric create magic items. The xp cost of item creation means the gap can be closed even quicker. And some of those powerfull items end up in the hands of their lower-level party member, giving him a bigger chance to survive other encounters.
out of curiosity: why was it Darian that kicked the bucket 4 times in a row. That's too uncanny to be a coincidence.
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Here's what I'm kicking around: When the character returns from the dead they they lose 100 xp per level (unless its a True Res) and they gain a negative level, that Restoration cannot remove, for a set number of days depending on the spell used to revive them (say 10 days for Raise Dead, 5 Days for Resurrection, 1 day for True res), at the end of which they are back to normal.
I'm curious about opinions. I don't want to make coming back from the grave to be a piece of cake, or cheapen the impact of such a death, but I don't want it to wreck the fun for my players either.
Hey TPK;
I agree with you, and my group has also had problems with this issue; specifically, the characters that end up complaining are the ones that most often lose out on bonus XP for roleplaying because their usual contributions to conversation consist of, "I cast magic missile," or "I deal 42 damage with my two-handed greataxe while raging and rampaging." So, we allow characters to be resurrected with either raise dead or resurrection and suffer no level loss; however, they receive a negative level that cannot be removed by any means until they gain a new level. In addition, this new level must be a full and complete one; they must start the level with the negative level from being raised and work their way to the next level before the negative level can be removed. In this way, there is no permanent detriment to the advancement of the character, but true resurrection is still very valuable (especially at high levels in time-crunch scenarios) and there is a definite penalty for biting the big one.
out of curiosity: why was it Darian that kicked the bucket 4 times in a row. That's too uncanny to be a coincidence.
Return to the Temple of Elemental Evil is a pretty tough mod, and he had some pretty lousy rolls. Let me see if I can remember his deaths...
1) failed reflex save against the dragon outside the moathouse
2) being swallowed by a xorn at the earth temple
3) half-fiendish ogre mage... need I say more
4) and the final humilation... drowning in the water temple thanks to a natch 1!
The spell has to be cast within 1 round and takes a 1000 gold peice diamond. The cleric in my campaigns carries all his wealth around in 1000gp diamonds.
Must be a b@#+@ to pay for coffee in the morning - were do you find a vendor who can identify a 1000 GP diamond and make change.
As a player who tended to be more noble than his characters could handle, I had at least a few die on me in the past, and repetitively all while trying to save the fighter of the group as he was the only one who could stand up to the evil dragon. So pushing the fighter out of the way and taking the full brunt of the acid breath was just so the fighter could kill it himself.
That being said i think the DM just decided that because we killed the dragon and thus saved the local village, where a high level cleric was helping to heal all the sick on his own, he raised me with True Resurrection for free.
I guess what I am saying is that the DM decided that because the character acted true to form he let him be raised to his original. So in the end it is up to the DM. Though I also like this idea of a negative level until you get to the next level, definitely would help in higher level campaigns.
Good idea.
Later
A.
If the gap needs to be closed rather quickly, you could also do a few mini encounters or sidequests for your fallen character. Typically, I do not, and I'd imagine other DMs wouldn't want to add to their already-heavy campaign load. But in the original case of Darian, a sidequest specifically tailored to his class with some heavy story or RP awards might help make the sting a little less. Something I've tried in my games (especially very long campaigns heavy on the story) is a short pop quiz before each session for XP. I'll hand out 25, 50, or even 100 XP on a pop for people who can answer "What was the name of the tavern you stayed at last night? Who did you save on the road? Who are the (random organization)?" It helps out the magic item crafters and recently dead, especially if you bump up the reward.
out of curiosity: why was it Darian that kicked the bucket 4 times in a row. That's too uncanny to be a coincidence.Return to the Temple of Elemental Evil is a pretty tough mod, and he had some pretty lousy rolls. Let me see if I can remember his deaths...
1) failed reflex save against the dragon outside the moathouse
2) being swallowed by a xorn at the earth temple
3) half-fiendish ogre mage... need I say more
4) and the final humilation... drowning in the water temple thanks to a natch 1!
ok, fair enough...
why didn't any of the other players die similarly horrid deaths?
what I'm getting at is this: is there anything in your gming style, or the player's style that cause this particular character to die so often while the others live, or was this just 4 increadubly unlucky breaks?
If it really is the last one, there's no need to adjust the rules. But if you find that one character regularly dies more often than another one, changing the rules isn't going to solve your problem.