Spoilers....
Hi I got a couple questions about WC for our next adventure, my PC's have found allastor and we paused our campaign outside Filge's observatory.
The Circlet of +2 Wisdom concerns me. I have a cleric in the campaign and he is played by a player who has always complained about how tough clerics are, and this time he chose to play one to demonstrate, hah. Anyways, he is the only spellcaster, so he is already using the pearl of power and I think the +2 wisdom would be unfair as it would obviously go to him. I want to convert this Circlet to something else, maybe something a warrior could use. Anyone have any other ideas that would not ruin the other powers of the circlet? I just don't want to make it a circlet of +2 str and then find out in a later adventure that the further powers dont really mesh with it.
Also, the cleric worships heironeus, and so he often asks for backup, or help with the adventures. Eg, he went to the temple to get them to help him with Filge. I played Dunn telling him that he had few men to spare and this was out of their jurisdiction. In the end Dunn casted bless on him and told him to do it... But what about 3FoE? If he comes back to the church and says there is a temple of Hextor down there, do you think that they should get backup? Is it legal for them to go down there and bust up the hextorites? Does the church of Heironeus (being Lawful Good) care about the laws in this circumstance? I am new to DM'ing alignment stuff so I need advice on this.
Thank you
Hanexs
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Heheh, a Heironean asking for help from higher-ups.
I'd have the High Priest give him a stirring speech on how the Valorous One will be with him (the PC) as he faces the enemies of light, and promise to support him with disciplined prayer while he fulfills this calling.
In other words--"go show Heironeous that you're a tough guy, tough guy."
There was some discussion here in the past month or so regarding the extent to which the Temple would put itself "above the law". I believe it was Eric Mona who described a ritual in which Heironeans take the law into their own hands in lawless lands, but clarified that it would likely only happen in the most desperate of times when true and irrevocable evidence of wrongdoing was in hand... AND the higher-ups in the church beaurocracy gave approval. This of course would take some time, and you can always add to the "we have to act NOW" tension experienced by your group by having the well containing the Aspect bubble and steam menacingly while dark forms move within it.
In the end, your player's character could still be commendend for exhibiting bravery and initiave when both were called for, and also understand that the red tape involved when marshalling the forces of a Lawful church is not all that fun.
Also, I wouldn't change the circlet, at all. Not every magic artifact recovered has to be used OR sold; some can be kept simply to keep them from falling into unscrupulous hands and the like. If they don't consider it, play up the possibility of some of Diamond Lake's unsavory elements getting their hands on the Circlet if they simply leave it in the tomb, now that the path to Zosiel's tomb is clear.
The circlet: is there no other character that could benefit from that ? A ranger, paladin or monk, perhaps ?
I did not find the reference in the adventure, do you have the page ?
The priests of Heironeous would jump at a chance to bust the Hextorites, but they would probably have to ask for an official permission to do this, I think. The mayor would probably not grant the permission based on the tales of a few nobodies, as this would offend the mine manager greatly. Negotiation would take a lot of time and probably end up with nothing. That sets the mood just great, it makes a showcase of lawful evil alignment.
Stefan
The Circlet of +2 Wisdom concerns me. I have a cleric in the campaign and he is played by a player who has always complained about how tough clerics are, and this time he chose to play one to demonstrate, hah. Anyways, he is the only spellcaster, so he is already using the pearl of power and I think the +2 wisdom would be unfair as it would obviously go to him. I want to convert this Circlet to something else, maybe something a warrior could use. Anyone have any other ideas that would not ruin the other powers of the circlet? I just don't want to make it a circlet of +2 str and then find out in a later adventure that the further powers dont really mesh with it.
I understand your problem- and it's definitely justified. It's not fun when all of the really good magic items are geared specifically towards the most powerful member of the group. I'd suggest changing it for that simple reason- the game mechanics of it are simply that it grants a +2 to Wisdom, and when it gets powered up later, it becomes a +6- so there's not much to worry about not having it mesh later on. If there's anybody else in your party that could benefit from a mental stat-boosting item, like a Bard, Wizard, or Sorcerer, make it into a Circlet of Charisma or Circlet of Intelligence. If there's nobody else, I don't think it's a bad idea to gear it towards a Fighter- but aside from making it another stat-booster, it's a bit tough to figure out what to make it. One idea is, maybe, an item that casts True Strike on the wearer 3x/day? Then, when it gets powered up, it can do it as a free action (but only once per round)? Just an idea. In any case, though, try to gear it away from the Cleric at any cost- even if it means making it into a Circlet of Strength +2. (But describe the strength as coming from the spirits of long-dead Wind Duke warriors fighting alongside him or something, so it doesn't sound stupid.)
Also, the cleric worships heironeus, and so he often asks for backup, or help with the adventures. Eg, he went to the temple to get them to help him with Filge. I played Dunn telling him that he had few men to spare and this was out of their jurisdiction. In the end Dunn casted bless on him and told him to do it... But what about 3FoE? If he comes back to the church and says there is a temple of Hextor down there, do you think that they should get backup? Is it legal for them to go down there and bust up the hextorites? Does the church of Heironeus (being Lawful Good) care about the laws in this circumstance? I am new to DM'ing alignment stuff so I need advice on this.
This same thing came up in my AoW campaign a few weeks ago, and I was really worried about it- after all, the Three Faces of Evil adventure is already crappy enough as it is, so any goodness left in it would surely be done away with if the PCs just charge right in with the entire temple of Heironeous behind them, right? Well, no. That's when I realized it can't happen.
The Church of Heironeous won't help the PCs. Frankly, there isn't any proof. Sure, the church may take the law into their own hands and run in with swords swinging- but only if they have more evidence than the word of a necromancer they've never met, and a note signed "S". Seriously, there's absolutely no real evidence to merit breaking the law. Not yet, anyway. What the PCs would be doing is asking the church of Heironeous- already on rocky ground as it is, trying not to usurp the mayor and sheriff- to break into a respectable mine manager's mine because of a hunch. They'd never do it. Now, of course, if the PCs go down there, find some evidence (that is, capture and/or kill some of the leaders and bring them back), THEN there'd be evidence- but at the moment, they're asking Dun to walk into the sheriff's office and moon him. They'd never do it.
Thanks for the comments. I think turning it into an amulet of true striking might be just the alley I will go up.
About the follower of heironeus... Would a cleric of heironeus have a problem with sneaking into the mine? I guess it is illegal (trespassing?), but you could argue that it would be for the greater good...
I guess the reason why I ask is that I do not want to trivialize alignment in this campaign. Some of my pcs have chosen true neutral (so they dont have to do anything) but have already found out that many good clerics in town will not deal with them, or at least do not give them good prices... Still I guess this would be a little far off the handle since it is only trespassing? Anyone got opinions?
About the follower of heironeus... Would a cleric of heironeus have a problem with sneaking into the mine? I guess it is illegal (trespassing?), but you could argue that it would be for the greater good...
I guess the reason why I ask is that I do not want to trivialize alignment in this campaign. Some of my pcs have chosen true neutral (so they dont have to do anything) but have already found out that many good clerics in town will not deal with them, or at least do not give them good prices... Still I guess this would be a little far off the handle since it is only trespassing? Anyone got opinions?
I don't think that should be a problem at all. Although the church won't back him up, he's definitely got enough evidence to clear his own mind- he's almost undoubtedly heard firsthand the testimony of Filge and/or Kullen, or whatever, and so as far as he could be concerned, he's doing exactly what is for the greater good- exposing a corrupt mine leader and the cult behind him. He just doesn't have enough proof to make it an official matter, is all. At times, keeping in mind that the end sometimes justifies the means is good enough reasoning as any.
About the follower of heironeus... Would a cleric of heironeus have a problem with sneaking into the mine? I guess it is illegal (trespassing?), but you could argue that it would be for the greater good...
It doesn't have to be tresspassing, my players spent half a session figuring out a way into the mine, and eventually got jobs as miners.
You previously stated that this player is playing a cleric just to prove a point, then you should show him the responsibility that comes with power. Hassle him about breaking laws and if he keeps doing it, take away a few spell slots. If he's asking the church to do something about an evil cult, have them reply that they are... they're sending him. He's a low ranking priest, so they should be sending him to substantiate these rumors. And if he's begging for help explain how he'd be failing in Heironeus' eyes.