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There's a few easy solution to staffing a demiplane.

The easiest being a timeless demiplane. The specifics will depend on how you interpret certain effects on spells that are not normally permanent.

Sadly, Unseen servants only exist while within range, but as long as the caster is around you're good to go. You can have real casters or simulacra (effectively immortal/permanent as long as they stay in the demiplane) as servants. Even caster level 1 is sufficient for this purpose. Over time they could each have a swarm of unseen servants at their command. Smart money is on using low level simulacra of yourself. It cuts down on the possibility of having them turn against you. Plus at 1HD they're cost is negligible and you can use them as body doubles.

You could also have non-magic servants with minor magic items. Unseen servant + prestidigitation at will broaches are probably very popular among the absurdly wealthy magical gentry. One maid with such a broach could take care of the work of a small army of maids.

Alternately you can make a wondrous item/trap of unseen servant to handle specific repetitive tasks. An enchanted floor tile that keeps the X feet around it dusted.

Twine double: similar to simulacra, but I dont believe they get spells. However, it does have the added bonus of throwing off scrying if that's a concern for you and you decided not to block that from your demiplane.

Summon monster (all levels): permanent planar servants. There's some interpretation here, but it works on paper. Hypothetically someone in some planar hierarchy will take notice if you trap a bunch of their powerful entities, but as that's up to the DM. On paper it works.

There are more, but you get the gist.


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There are always weaknesses to be exploited. There's no way for mere mortals, powerful or otherwise, to be completely unassailable.

At 20th level lots of resources and effectively unlimited resources aren't that significantly different.

If I were DM and I really wanted to give them a number i'd say that combined they have the wealth of an additional 20th level character with which to build there fortress. That's 880,000. It puts the desired cap, but it's still a lot.


I'd stick to wealth by level. at 20 it's pretty ridiculous.
However, you could also just hand waive the cost of the base effectively giving them limitless resources for it. It's not going to much matter either way. At 20th level there are a TON of ways to get effectively free base enhancements and/or wealth.

If you make this a Play by post then I'll play a wizard and show them how it's done. ;)


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For out of combat healing? Wands of Infernal Healing. It's easy math, no rolling and all at CL1.

Edit: Although that's just for HP damage. Regeneration has the added bonus of growing back body parts. there are some macabre and interesting things one can do with that depending on the party alignment.


I'd go craft construct for the ship, but you could use permanent animate object on other parts of the ship. Self loading, self firing Batista come to mind. Of course you'll need at least one guy with a brain to give order to the lot. Still though, a crew of 1 on a ship is pretty cool.


Volkard Abendroth wrote:
Claxon wrote:
Now, it's worth noting that when you leave time catches up to you and those buffs would expire.

If you can cast Create Greater Demiplane you can also cast Astral Projection.

You have no reason to remove your physical body from your personal dimension.

This is severely debatable territory as the game mechanics for the ~ Permanent astral Projection hack haven't been 100% spelled out.


I usually just pick a foreign language and say the spell name in that.

Ex: mount: “Cavalo rápido!”
Portuguese for fast horse.


I built a chelaxian mystic theurge for my undead army.

Cleric HD and Wiz HD pools are tracked separately. As is the channel pool. As is the command undead pool. The end result is a crap ton of HD worth if undead to play with.

There’s an armor enchant that allows you to control more HD worth of undead. Add it to a suit of armor and a shield for even more HD. It’s devatable if it adds to both pools independently or not, but regardless it’s either a lot more undead or a WHOLE lot more undead.

For conservation of resources make as many bloody skeletons as you can. They’re hard to kill and always come back. Bloody flaming skeletons are one of my favorites.


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lemeres wrote:
Claxon wrote:
If I want a 6 pack of abs and have magic, I'll probably just use some transformation magic.

That also seems like a good way to get a 16 pack.

Quickly, we need to roll some knowledge (swimsuit calendar) checks in order to determine which monster type has some rocking 16 packs.

Polymorph any object means permanently having your perfect body.


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quibblemuch wrote:
Or you could try my ab-building method. I simply press an empty ice cube tray into my paunch and then sleep on my belly. After several nights, the indelible impression of abs is created. Sure, it's a weird 16 pack, but abs is abs!

NICE 16 PACK, BRO!

CROSSFIT!!!!!!!


Natan Linggod 327 wrote:
blahpers wrote:
Loren Pechtel wrote:

I think the minor quality of life items will be far more prevalent than one would tend to think.

The thing is, magic items are eternal. Adventuring items are often destroyed or lost to the monsters when they beat an adventurer. However, quality of life items are rarely going to be lost. They're also easier to craft.

Thus I suspect they will be treasured items handed down from generation to generation, the production rate can be low and yet have the items be common.

"Oh good, I just inherited great grandma's tampon of tidiness." : /
Like the real world everlasting pill , which were passed down the generations.

Gross.


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thejeff wrote:
Tiny Coffee Golem wrote:

Sounds like low level spell casting would be a great diet plan. To hell with spending hours in the gym. I’ll just case detect magic 3X a day to maintain my abs.

Oh, there’s cake?
Make that 5X.

Bulking season FTW!

Edit: as I am not a spellcaster (yet) I don’t have abs, but you get the idea.

Starvation is not actually a good way to build abs. :)

You'd stay skinny, but more like a malnourished skinny kid than like a body builder.

Treat it like cardio. Too much and you look malnourished. To little and you can get fat, using the standard intake/output logic.

So eat a lot, lift weights, and cast detect magic just enough to maintain a slim waist without overdoing it and “eating” your own musculature.


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Sounds like low level spell casting would be a great diet plan. To hell with spending hours in the gym. I’ll just case detect magic 3X a day to maintain my abs.

Oh, there’s cake?
Make that 5X.

Bulking season FTW!

Edit: as I am not a spellcaster (yet) I don’t have abs, but you get the idea.


Bob Bob Bob wrote:
Recent Casting Limit/Rest Interruptions wrote:
If a wizard has cast spells recently, the drain on his resources reduces his capacity to prepare new spells. When he prepares spells for the coming day, all the spells he has cast within the last 8 hours count against his daily limit.

So you only "lose" the spell slot if you used it cast a spell in the last 8 hours. This is just to prevent "wake up the Wizard a minute early, have them cast all their spells, go back to sleep for an hour and get them all back".

As for why players are so blase about monstrous evil... well, have you met players? There's a reason children are now invincible in Fallout. And people made all kinds of mods to "fix" that. Look, here's a full list. Just start looking through it and realize that those aren't theoretical.

Well, that’s horrifying.


Claxon wrote:
Now, it's worth noting that when you leave time catches up to you and those buffs would expire.

Correct. They remain active past their natural expiration, but once you leave a timeless plane the expiration has still passed and they go away. Timeless doesn’t pause the timer. It just keeps it alive past it’s end timer.


RoseCrown wrote:

As the title says, I've finally written up a sorcerer I like. Except the Arcana. Is there a way to change the Arcana, or trade it for something else?

Warning: I'm already using a Wildblooded bloodline, so the Arcana has been changed once already.

No and given the latter, definitely no.

Just curious. What’s the bloodline / arcana?


Weirdo wrote:

Absent specific and presumably unusual PC class features, you also have to be 3rd level to take Brew Potion. And potions don't make good heirlooms. Yet they are generally considered available for purchase even in small settlements.

Claxon wrote:
Yes, small towns have some sort of NPC spellcaster and they can only cast 1st level spells (based on the rules). It's also worth noting that the small town is 200 to 2000 people. That's a pretty low rate, and that makes it pretty scarce.
What's your source for this? The settlement rules that I'm familiar with say a small town has 200-2000 people and 4th level spells, while a thorpe of fewer than 20 people still has 1st level spells (and a good chance of buying 1st level potions)

Or a level one alchemist.

Potions are an exception I think. They’re cheap, easy, universally useful, and fast to make. A lot of groups would be smart to have a potion of cure light wounds in hand just in case. I can see more low level magic merchant types having brew potion because the profit turnaround time is so fast. Plus they’re one time use. That could keep you in business. As opposed to making one “bum cleaning prestigitation” wondrous magic item used at an entire household could be a family heirloom passed down for generations.

Edit: a 25 gp investment that might save your life is a better rate of return than a 500gp device to clean your butt when leaves/cheap paper/ sponges on sticks are all basically free.


Also you have to be level 3 (rare) to take craft wondrous item (more rare). So even if a caster is available there are further requirements that make such items exponentially more rare.


I support necromancy, but nothing has changed, so see previous posts.


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Edward Vysenguard wrote:
Tiny Coffee Golem wrote:
Xenocrat wrote:
Tiny Coffee Golem wrote:

Eaating kale isn’t going to cut it. Emo Duck is right. A Lich is a walking corpse and will garner no nutrients from food.

I think a Lych can eat and benefit from a lychee, however.
Yea. The typo is killing me, but I’m gonna let it slide

Lych and lich are the same more or less i see call them in both way btw isn't the main plot.

Seems like my player are stone's. Lich are living creatures that not decay cause they are magic (That's the main argue atm, pretty sad).
One of the player found an npc that looks like human in a campaign so now for him lich aren't different from a normal human and they decay jsut cause the want it.
I wonder why i never ear about this kind of lich and i saw just death skeletal corpes...
I like realism in game (obv in the measure that a fantastic word allow it) and i'm getting serius problem to convince them that a lich can't be just like an human (still eat, still feel cause... it is magic).
I would like to find a rule that convince them about it but i'm not getting luck on this.
How the f*+@ a lich should be alive?
A lich with 1k age that just eating and washing himself don't decay cause is magic.
Do you have other argues for them? <3

“Lych” isn’t a word, but I’m not going to argue the point, because you’re right. That’s not the point of the thread.

Undead, including Liches, have no biological processes. Hence the lack of constitution scores. However, don’t take my word for it. Check out the last sentence of the undead type. “Undead do not breathe, eat, or sleep.”

undead type:

Undead are once-living creatures animated by spiritual or supernatural forces. An undead creature has the following features.

d8 Hit Die.
Base attack bonus equal to 3/4 total Hit Dice (medium progression).
Good Will saves.
Skill points equal to 4 + Int modifier (minimum 1) per Hit Die. Many undead, however, are mindless and gain no skill points or feats. The following are class skills for undead: Climb , Disguise , Fly , Intimidate , Knowledge (arcana), Knowledge (religion), Perception , Sense Motive , Spellcraft , and Stealth .
Traits: An undead creature possesses the following traits (unless otherwise noted in a creature's entry).

No Constitution score. Undead use their Charisma score in place of their Constitution score when calculating hit points, Fortitude saves, and any special ability that relies on Constitution (such as when calculating a breath weapon's DC).
Darkvision 60 feet.
Immunity to all mind-affecting effects (charms, compulsions, morale effects, patterns, and phantasms).
Immunity to bleed, death effects, disease, paralysis, poison, sleep effects, and stunning.
Not subject to nonlethal damage, ability drain , or energy drain. Immune to damage to its physical ability scores (Constitution, Dexterity, and Strength), as well as to exhaustion and fatigue effects.
Cannot heal damage on its own if it has no Intelligence score, although it can be healed. Negative energy (such as an inflict spell) can heal undead creatures. The fast healing special quality works regardless of the creature's Intelligence score.
Immunity to any effect that requires a Fortitude save (unless the effect also works on objects or is harmless).
Not at risk of death from massive damage, but is immediately destroyed when reduced to 0 hit points.
Not affected by raise dead and reincarnate spells or abilities. Resurrection and true resurrection can affect undead creatures. These spells turn undead creatures back into the living creatures they were before becoming undead.
Proficient with its natural weapons, all simple weapons, and any weapons mentioned in its entry.
Proficient with whatever type of armor (light, medium, or heavy) it is described as wearing, as well as all lighter types. Undead not indicated as wearing armor are not proficient with armor. Undead are proficient with shields if they are proficient with any form of armor.
Undead do not breathe, eat, or sleep.


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Xenocrat wrote:
Tiny Coffee Golem wrote:

Eaating kale isn’t going to cut it. Emo Duck is right. A Lich is a walking corpse and will garner no nutrients from food.

I think a Lych can eat and benefit from a lychee, however.

Yea. The typo is killing me, but I’m gonna let it slide


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Eaating kale isn’t going to cut it. Emo Duck is right. A Lich is a walking corpse and will garner no nutrients from food.

However, he’s a spellcasters and can take other steps. The easiest probably being the daily casting of gentle repose on themselves, though that only stops the decay process. It doesn’t stop the problem with negative energy hands, unnatural aura, etc.

May want to make a custom item that casts Semblance of Life. Look it up on the PFSRD.

Edit: might be appearance of life


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Most of that can be accomplished with prestigitation. Enough people have access to 0 level magic that there are probably also “devices” to take care of certain biological things. Now it’s availability and affordability are different matters.


Necro from way way back


Dot


Weirdo wrote:
Dr Styx wrote:

Why let others know you have Undead with you.

Make your Undead blend in with Apperance of Life

Components V, S, M (one Tiny or larger living creature)

Duration 10 minutes/level (D)

Gonna be sacrificing a lot of rats to keep that spell active for long.

On the up side you’ll have plenty of dead rats/skeletons to play with and animate.


I don’t think they officially do. At most of you were to “fall” climbing somehow you just wouldn’t fall.


Bardarok wrote:

That's a tough one and I am not aware of a rebuilt subsystem for that. I generally recommend Spheres of Power as a chassis to make custom magic systems to emulate books/movies etc., it is built for that sort of thing. That said you would still need to homebrew a good amount of stuff to make a good approximation of sympathetic magic.

I kinda figured. No worries. It was just a thought. I was kinda hoping someone had done it for me. All good. Thanks anyway.


Guess not


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I’m a fan of the easy chair shaped earth elemental to keep the lazy halfling caster from ever having to actually walk anywhere.


bump


Dot


One of my favorite books “Name of the Wind” has a magic system called Sympathy.

Basically it’s a way to connect two things and have them affect each other. Is anyone familiar with a pathfinder conversion with subsystem?

P.S. if you haven’t read the book and it’s sequel, Wise Mans Fear,” I highly recommend it.


I’m of course disappointed, but I get it. No worries. If you ever decide to get it going again PM me.


DM_Scholar wrote:
I know that it says a lich's phylactery costs money, but that really should be included in the template. I won't make you pay the exorbitant base costs, no.

Thank you


I plan on making unique items. Specifically an intelligent Phalactry. To that end how would you like the 120k until cost for that t work. In my backstory I imagine that as part of the devils bargain. Any additional costs would be on me though. I’ll clear the final build with you of course, but does that sound reasonable so far?


A couple of questions. can you comment on:
1- initial stat point buy
2-how do you want item crafting to work?
3- did I understand correctly that scrying just doesn’t work?


Hi hi. Dot for interest.

I’ll have the Lich worm that walks started out as soon as possible.


Wizard. Always wizard.


I’ll have other questions, but I’ll wait for the official rules to see if they’re answered there.


I’ll definitely have to rework a few things, but I can make it happen.


Asmodeus' Advocate wrote:
Tiny Coffee Golem wrote:
Sounds great. Lich + worm that walks made of grave worms, plus whatever version of devil bound you want, correct?

Yup!

I also have a small list of banned spells, for higher level play. These spells are banned for PCs and NPCs alike; they just don't exist in the world. In no particular order, they are:

    Blood Money
    Lesser Planar Binding
    Planar Binding
    Greater Planar Binding
    Polymorph Any Object
    Create Greater Demiplane
    Emergency Force Sphere
    Ethereal Jaunt
    Etherealness
    Lesser Simulacra
    Simulacra
    Greater Simulacra
    Mass Suffocate
    Time Stop

In addition, wish and miracle can only be used for the effects that are explicitly mentioned in their spell entry, except for wish, which can no longer give inherent bonuses to ability scores.

The "Persistent Spell" feat no longer exists. I see your frown, I feel your frown. I use the feat too. That's why I'm banning it.

I'm just trying to remove the death without a save spells, as well as making walls and non-magical monsters matter this late in the game, and I'm removing a few of the "I win and also I conquer the universe" options for wizards. :)

In addition, one of the rules will be that no one can have spells higher than sixth level at the start of the game. The reason for this is twofold, 1) it helps curb the flow of arcane insanity, and c) it guarantees that the scary lich who sold their soul for power is one of if not the most dangerous caster in the party.

That's all I got for special rules so far, is there anything you think needs saying? Also, is there anything in particular you want to see in the game?

Can’t say I’m totallt happy with all of that, but I can work with it. I’ll let you know if I think of anything.


Asmodeus' Advocate wrote:
Tiny Coffee Golem wrote:
Asmodeus' Advocate wrote:
Tiny Coffee Golem wrote:


Edit: on a related note I now really want to play this character in a pbp monster game.
What's the final CR? I might consider DMing.

I legitimately have no idea. If you’re really interested I’ll modify to a CR you’re comfortable with for your game vs what I’m making.

Needs to be at least level eleven to be a lich, so the minimum CR is 16. That sounds plenty high, so let's stick with that. (It's more manageable a PC than a 16th level wizard, since you'd only have level six spells.) I imagine that the reason you want to play him is for the theme/personality, and you'd be cool with most rules, so I might make it a spheres of power game, but probably not. I'm fond of the system, but not as familiar with it.

I'm interested in DMing because I have a concept for a campaign kicking around my head where the PCs sold their souls to a devil and want to get them back, that doesn't really work at the lower levels, or for most parties.

The idea isn't terribly well fleshed out yet, since I didn't think I'd actually use it for anything. But if I decide to go for it (I think I'm more likely than not to do so, but it isn't a certainty) I'll get back to you on the story and rules and such, say, day after tomorrow?

Sounds great. Lich + worm that walks made of grave worms, plus whatever version of devil bound you want, correct?


Claxon wrote:

Ummm....why not have one of the duergars sneak into town and find a relatively quite spot, something like a building with a basement or a warehouse or something.

Relay that information to whomever the spellcasters are, and use scrying to observe the location by following the individual. Use teleport to travel to the location with your trolls. This make take a few days to get all the trolls in depending on the number of spell casters who have access to teleport.

This plus one scroll of teleportation circle.


Dot for interest


Tiny Coffee Golem wrote:
The Sideromancer wrote:
If you want infernal vermin for devilbound worms that walk, consider bringing in the hellwasp swarm.
That has some potential

Upon reflection: I think I’ll stick with vanilla worm that walks + Lich made out of grave worms.

Plus devil bound


The Sideromancer wrote:
If you want infernal vermin for devilbound worms that walk, consider bringing in the hellwasp swarm.

That has some potential


MKtheDM wrote:
Tiny Coffee Golem wrote:

Rough working idea:

1)Faustian bargain to gain the half fiend template. 2) Then later adding Lich.

Random disorganized thoughts:

- Engage the PCs as unwitting allies toward these goals.
- Faustian bargain has a clause about not directly moving against the PCs and the standard “we get your soul when you die” clause.
- the Lichdom (possibly vampirism if he needs an effective, but sloppy shortcut) is to avoid his inevitable fate of his soul in hell.
- then part of the reason he can’t devote more time to undermining the PCs is because he’s got hellish agents coming after him. Perhaps he can once again unwittingly engage the PCs to permanently take out his hellish “benefactor” to finally free him from the contract.

- I’ll need to build in some weaknesses for the PCs to exploit else he just becomes an overwhelming enemy.

Thoughts?

Devilbound Template?

I think, Yes. I’m leaning toward the contract being his exploitable weakness. Not the paper specifically, but the bargain. Maybe the PCs get a copy or something. Before that though maybe they’ll be made an offer.


Asmodeus' Advocate wrote:
Tiny Coffee Golem wrote:


Edit: on a related note I now really want to play this character in a pbp monster game.
What's the final CR? I might consider DMing.

I legitimately have no idea. If you’re really interested I’ll modify to a CR you’re comfortable with for your game vs what I’m making.

Edit: currently he’s a half Elven wizard 14 and his gauntlet is an intelligent item that has a few things on it, but mostly it’s an @ will lesser wish item. I wanted to have a mechanical reason to cast whatever lower levels spells he might need at the moment. A couple of other powerful items too, but that’s the main thing. As an NPC he’s had effectively infinite wealth and time. He was originally designed as an ally to facilitate the initial plot and not as an enemy.

I assume all his original stuff plus these templates may be a bit much to DM as a PC. Again, if you’re really interested we can scale him whichever way you’d like.

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