Talib Aguiye Ironsi's page

A 4th level Paladin with the Magical Knack trait can activate scrolls of Bull's Strength ^_^

I of course will be voting for my cousin, Helakai. You should all do the same.

Sacred Servant. Sacred Fist is a Warpriest archetype.

If chosen, I would select +2 to Charisma. It's what I picked on the Chronicle Sheet as well.

I read that you're not a PFS member. I can create the event for you and do all the paperwork for you. I'd just need your signature. But that doesn't need to happen until the end of each Book. At that point I'd just snail mail the Chronicle Sheet to you with return postage to make it as easy for you as possible.

Ask your players if any of them are interested in receiving PFS credit and I can include them in the event, too.

Alrighty, so this is probably jumping the gun, but since I stayed home sick today anyways I decided to kill time statting up a 4th level version of Talib using the 18pt buy you suggested:

OMGosh, I played through Book 1 before our group fell apart! I would *love* the chance to finish.

This profile is now the PFS character that evolved out of that lost opportunity. He even has the Chronicle Sheet for Book 1. He's a melee-focused Paladin (Sacred Servant) of Rowdrosh, the Divine Herdsman.

He's a "warm stranger in a cold land". A Mwangi goat herder who answered his god's call to protect against a greater calamity. When your homeland is a tropical climate, covering the world in winter is certainly something worth fighting!

He's more "anti-chaos" than "anti-evil". In fact, if you're fine with a bit of houseruling, it'd be awesome to change his Detect and Smite Evil to Detect and Smite Chaos.

His primary weapon is a polearm, but he has Catch Off Guard so he can switch to using the handle when he's forced into close combat.

But I guess anything can be changed to fit your Campaign.

HERE is the tent I use for him when I play PFS, if it helps to visualize him =).

1.) Would he need a caster level check? The sorcerer would have the same caster level as the wizard that made the scroll. Difference is that a 3rd level wizard can cast a 2nd level spell, while a 3rd level sorcerer cannot.

This is in the Core Rulebook.

It's why 4th level Paladins with Magical Knack can read scrolls of Bull's Strength.

Nope.

Resistance overlaps. You'd use the highest of your options.

Paladins can multiclass. If they cease being Lawful Good, or otherwise violate their tenets, bad things happen to them.

John Compton wrote:

In the setting, all divine magic originates from a divine source, such as a deity, archdevil, empyreal lord, etc.—even for those divine casters who don't know the exact source of that power (e.g. some oracles and druids).

I've heard this stated and referenced before, but I've never seen it in print. Is there a book reference for this? I searched the ISWG and couldn't find it.

Divine: "of, from, or like God or a god".

"Filling in the gaps" is totally acceptable, within reason.

Take Rowdrosh, The Divine Herdsman, for example. He's pretty much an entry in a table. Only mechanics, nothing detailed.

So my Paladin kind of "makes it up" as I go.

It's incredibly liberating.

"Not at my table!!"

Greetings! I have a Sacred Servant (Travel Domain) Paladin in PFS as well (this profile). I'll try my best to answer your questions:

It seems most people are assuming that the sacred servant paladin archetype gains the domain of choice's granted power but I see no official Paizo wording that states that.

You probably haven't found any threads discussing it because there's no ambiguity. "[W]hen a sacred servant gains the ability to cast spells, she also chooses one domain associated with her deity".

From the Cleric class writeup we find rules for domains. "Each domain grants a number of domain powers, dependent upon the level of the cleric".

Both Agile Feet (Su) and the increase to base speed are domain powers granted to you by choosing the Travel domain.

It's a pretty sweet deal for a Paladin, which is why it's so popular.

So, if I take this Archetype and I were to take the travel domain, would I get the following automatically? Also, at what level would I get it at? 4?

As the ability states, you gain the domain at 4th level.

If the answer is yes, am I to assume this would stack with Longstrider?

It functions the exact same for both Clerics and Paladins, so yes.

Also, for the secondary power, in this case, Dimensional Hop, would I be able to use it at level 9 if I have the magical knack trait?

For purposes of determining when you gain access to higher level domain powers, treat your effective Cleric level as your Paladin level minus 3. Magical Knack only raises Caster Level, not Class Level, so you won't be gaining access to any domain powers earlier.

What about the wisdom requirement for uses per day for the domain powers? Do you change it to charisma since it's for a Paladin?

It remains Wis-based, as we are given no rules for switching it out to Cha-based. It's one of the many reasons why dumping Wisdom won't work so well for this build (I started with a Wis of 12 for this very reason).

Hope that helps!

Talib Aguiye Ironsi wrote:

The "controversy" is usually when you see Paladins casting Infernal Healing (as the last thread showed).

If a Paladin cast Summon Monster X, and it contained the Evil Descriptor, the same sort of thread would be spawned.

Which they CAN NOT do in either case.

Paladins can not prepare Infernal Healing nor use wands of it as it's not on their class list.

Nor for that matter can they cast the Summon Monster spell line, so those are non-existent examples.

You are incorrect.

There are several ways that a Paladin may go about doing this.

Unsanctioned Knowledge exists. Samsaran is a Boon Race. Pathfinder Savant exists. Multiclassing exists. UMD exists.

The "controversy" is usually when you see Paladins casting Infernal Healing (as the last thread showed).

If a Paladin cast Summon Monster X, and it contained the Evil Descriptor, the same sort of thread would be spawned.

Are Trade Goods listed in Chapter 2 of Ultimate Equipment available?

I hadn't realized UE had Trade Goods.

My Paladin has been buying the ones from the CRB this entire time.

He has the Farmstead Vanity, so all gold he earns through his Day Job checks he converts into livestock Trade Goods.

"Losing out on gaining" equates to "losing nothing".

You're most likely not going to be getting an "official response". There are bigger questions lined up in the FAQ queue, and this archetype functions just fine as is (unlike many others that simply don't). I don't think the text you're quoting is ambiguous. When read in its entirety, it makes sense.

The best practice for now would be to run it as it's written until (if) someone ever mentions otherwise. Luckily this has no impact on character concepts. At the very most, you're just getting the same amount of spells as any other Paladin, plus all the cool other abilities.

In other words, you're losing nothing by not having this answered.

It doesn't.

This isn't the first time that an archetype provided a redundant feature.

Paizo utilizes a lot of authors. Not all of them are 100% thorough in their research when creating content. Even then, sometimes the content they create gets edited for balance (by another fleet of people that might not do a whole lot of research).

It's also possible this archetype initially offered bonus slots, and they were edited to be only spell list.

Whatever the reason, all the archetype gives now is what it states.

You get what the ability gives you: spells added to your list.

The way you've parsed it may make it seem otherwise, but only because you've taken that sentence away from the others it was referencing.

You don't gain any additional spell slots. If you're interested, take a look at the Sacred Servant archetype (they gain Domain spell slots like a Cleric).

(I have a feeling this will be another one of those long threads about alignments that ultimately gets locked)

@ThePuppyTurtle: This topic can be summed up in one overarching general statement:

Expect Table Variation

And that goes for both players and GMs. There is no one way to roleplay or deal with an issue such as this, and people who believe there is will have to learn to loosen up. It's like the old Paladin vs Necromancer debate. Some people worry about making a Necromancer and being unable to play it in a group of Paladins, but seldom do people worry about making a Paladin and being unable to play it in a group of Necromancers. You just need to tweak the way you analyze roles and look at everything from multiple perspectives.

Using myself as an example, I have two characters that own slaves: one's your typical Chelaxian, and one's a Paladin.

My Paladin of Rowdrosh, the Divine Herdsman, believes that there is nothing wrong with lawful slavery. He'd be a hypocrite to condemn gnolls for purchasing and selling humans when he does the same thing with cows and goats. The level of sentience involved only increases the amount of care that's required.

Slaves are legal for purchase from the Adventurer's Armory.

"Everything in this book is legal for play" (with the following exceptions). Slaves are not one of those exceptions.

It doesn't have stats, so you can't place a mini on the map for it, though. Other than being something that goes on your ITS, it's mostly just RP fluff.

Unfortunately I'm about the only Paladin in my area that refuses to Smite until after I've detected evil.

One cool trick though is the ability to read scrolls a couple levels earlier.

Normally, a 4th level Ranger can only read a 1st level spell scroll without having to make a Caster Level check.

With Magical Knack, that same 4th level Ranger can read a 2nd level spell scroll (such as Cat's Grace) and not have to worry about failure.

You can always shorten your grip, as a free action, and attack using the shaft of your polearm as an improvised weapon.

Glaives, guisarmes, lances, longspears, ranseurs, and whips are reach weapons. A reach weapon is a melee weapon that allows its wielder to strike at targets that aren't adjacent to him. Most reach weapons double the wielder's natural reach, meaning that a typical Small or Medium wielder of such a weapon can attack a creature 10 feet away, but not a creature in an adjacent square. A typical Large character wielding a reach weapon of the appropriate size can attack a creature 15 or 20 feet away, but not adjacent creatures or creatures up to 10 feet away.

If the Gargantuan T-Rex is adjacent to you, you're going to have to step back 5ft to stab it with your Longspear.

Gisher wrote:

Talib Aguiye Ironsi wrote:

It just occurred to me that I have a Sacred Servant/Oath of Vengeance Paladin that might be affected by this.

I know the combination was contentious before, and I've always been prepared to remove one of those Archetypes if it was ruled they didn't stack. I'll have to check into it when I get home.

Sacred Servant and Oath of Vengeance both change the Spells class feature, so it looks like they are incompatible. Interestingly, though, neither change has the "this alters the Spells Class Feature" language.

"This alters" is a relatively new language that we've begun to do every time, but old archetypes, you'll find, will never have them.

IIRC, the debate surrounding these two archetypes was that 1) Oathbound adds spells to the Paladin Spell list, and 2) Sacred Servant grants a Cleric Domain.

Those two archetypes do not modify the same Class Feature. One affects the Paladin Spell list, while the other grants an entirely new, unrelated ability.

This is evidenced by the Cleric class, which divides up "spells" and "domains" into separate Class Features.

It just occurred to me that I have a Sacred Servant/Oath of Vengeance Paladin that might be affected by this.

I know the combination was contentious before, and I've always been prepared to remove one of those Archetypes if it was ruled they didn't stack. I'll have to check into it when I get home.

Ultimate Mercy

I also have a 4th level Zenj Paladin of Rowdrosh (this profile) that I enjoy immensely. The Zenj are the nomadic Mwangi people that herd livestock out on the plains. Not everyone from the Expanse has to be from the Jungles.

Surprised that nobody linked to the FAQs on the matter.

Can I use my longspear to attack at both 10 feet and 5 feet?

And

Can I use two-weapon fighting to make an "off-hand" attack with my armor spikes in the same round I use a two-handed weapon?

And

What kind of action is it to remove your hand from a two-handed weapon or re-grab it with both hands?

Basically, your (Cestus/Gauntlet/Spiked Gauntlet) isn't available to threaten when it's holding another weapon, but Armor Spikes don't take up a hand, so if you're wielding a reach weapon and wearing Armor Spikes you can effectively threaten everything within 10ft.

Or, on your turn, you could just switch the grip of your reach weapon and attack adjacent.

A Paladin can cast Detect Evil, as a spell-like ability, at will. The tag, "(Sp)", means "spell-like ability". The abbreviation "SLA" is popular here on the forums.

As a spell-like ability, it still provokes attacks of opportunity, unless "cast" defensively. It has no somatic, verbal, or material components, and doesn't even require a focus or holy symbol. It still requires a concentration check under certain circumstances.

There is one difference that people get caught up on, though, specifically regarding the Paladin's spell-like ability. A Paladin has 2 options when casting Detect Evil as a spell-like ability at will:

1) exactly as the spell. Standard action to cast, multiple rounds of concentration, and a cone-shaped area.

OR

2) as a move action, with one target, and not requiring the 3 rounds of concentration.

But other than those options, a Paladin's Detect Evil SLA is pretty mundane.

My Paladin of Rowdrosh uses the gold he earns from Profession (Herdsman) his "Farmstead" vanity to purchase more livestock.

I think he's up to 5 goats and 1 cow, so far.

My 4th level Paladin (with Magical Knack) uses scrolls of Bull's Strength (a 2nd level Paladin spell) going by this same logic.

His Caster Level is 3 (matching the Cleric level required to scribe it), his casting stat is high enough, the spell is on his spell list, and the type is divine.

Profit.

Link to PFS discussion, for context.

Is Bane a weapon enchantment, or grouping of 24 individual weapon enchantments that share a name and similar functions?

Lekku, to help you better understand the "nuances of the game", you should first know that Pathfinder is referred to as having a "permissive" ruleset. That means you can only do what the rules tell you. The default assumption when you read an ability (such as this boon granting you bane) is that it functions the same as the bane ability quoted above. In order for the boon to function differently, its text must clearly say so.

Since there is no such text on the boon, and it actually references spending 4pp to change the enchantment, then it works as the default bane ability.

That's why we're saying "the burden of proof is on you".

And it's actually ironic how similar these forums are to the legal system. We have FAQ requests between disputing parties that eventually are given rulings by a few oligarchs and codified as law.

Oathbound does not modify spells, it adds spells.

That's one of the definitions of "modifying", actually ;-)

But gaining a Domain at the same level you gain access to the Spells Class Feature would, IMO, be different. Which, IMO, means that they *should* stack.

But, ultimately, it's not up to me.

I only play PFS. This would actually be for my 22nd character. I've come to accept a fair amount of table variation during my tenure, and I could probably be fine with the occasional GM that says "no", but it'd be nice to have a consensus.

This thread has a demonstrated history of going silent for months at a time... Maybe I'll ask again next year...

This isn't that much of a thread necro, right?

I'm looking to combine these archetypes as well.

It looks *to me* like they work.

The Oathbound Paladin modifies the Spells Class Feature by adding to the Paladin Spell List.

Whereas the Sacred Servant grants a Cleric Domain at the same level a Paladin gains the ability to cast spells.

Furthermore, the Sacred Servant lacks wording to the effect of "this otherwise modifies X class feature" that you normally find when an archetype modifies a class feature.

Further thoughts?