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Literally. I've procrastinated again, and I run my game tomorrow, so this is a bit of a Hail Mary. In my shrunken world quest I'm running my group in, we will likely run into some giant frogs soon. One or two should be plenty of challenge for my five person, level 5, heavily over-geared, gestalt party, but I want to throw in some tadpoles to flesh things out/fill in the battlefield a bit. I have found something called Bogwiggles, but I'm looking for other low CR creatures that could be reskinned as giant tadpoles to make this encounter a bit more interesting. Any ideas appreciated, links and/or typed out websites a bonus. Thanks all. :)


Okay, since several of you mentioned that you'd be willing to share NPC builds on the last thread I started, I figured I'd jump in here. This will sort of be a conceptual child of the thread I started some time last year, but I will try to break it into manageable chunks and trim down my normal text walls. Campaign and background details will follow as I think of them, or as requested for building guidance. As always, thanks to you all.

At the moment I'm in need of a human female alchemist who can do delayed bombs. As GM, I know I can hand wave and bestow extra/unique powers, but options for multiple delayed bombs, alchemical substitutions, or the like would be good. Basically, she's a field leader in a terrorist/cult organization inside of the city my crew has just entered. We're all level 5 and gestalt. This gal should be a good fight, but by know means super lethal. It's more about the chaos she can wreak upon the grand square. As subject quote may clue in, I'm drawing inspiration from Cheryl/Carol in the last two seasons of Archer.

I botched the encounter getting my crew through the gates of the city, but the guards they passed could come back up as sources of info, or small encounters later. Relatively generic, but a human, and drow, a half-orc, and a kitsune warrior, all about level 6. Decent fighting stats, but I'm more interested in skills and traits that point towards personality traits. The kitsune was friendly and amused by the party, the human and orc kind of neutral, the drow somewhat hostile, but not evil.

Keeping is mind that the party is only level 5, my penultimate villain (many months away) is a corrupted "Grand" cleric of this world's water deity. I'm looking for a guy who can summon some type of twisted, diseased, or otherwise tainted water elementals.

That's a good start, and already a bigger text wall than I meant to make. Looking forward to your all's suggestions.


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Hi folks. Been a while since I've been here. Still plugging away at working on my part of my group's ongoing shared campaign.

I was wondering if any of you can point me to a reliable character generating app or site. The way I build my characters is a long and tedious process due to my O.C.D. I'm looking for a way to churn out some quick NPC's with character levels for some of my encounters, and I need something where I can just scroll through options on a menu, plug in choices/numbers, and play. I'm not too tech savvy, and my laptop is becoming more and more woefully out of date, so something free/cheap, basic, and simple to download/access would be helpful. Thanks in advance folks.

p.s. (I did try and search first, but everything I could find was 7+ years out of date.)


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So, I was reading another thread, and had one of my stray thoughts dance across my mind.

What if a group built their characters based upon how their brains work? I'm probably phrasing this terribly, but I'll try to explain what I mean.

The example given in the other thread, was talking about how some players at higher level play may need to do a lot of math and account for many variables before declaring their actions on a turn. Totally reasonable and a valid way to play. But that got me thinking about players who just decide what they want to do, and just go for it. Sometimes this can lead to sub-optimal outcomes, if not outright disasters. For other players though, they seem to just intuit how the system works. That sort of player almost always make the "best" tactical decision with seemingly no time spent doing the math.

By extension of this, I jump to player aptitudes. We all bring different skills and life experiences to the table, but there are also those inherent talents or strengths within us. I'm pretty good a quick basic math, but no so hot at visualizing spatial relationships for example.

So, taking those innate talents into account, what if a group builds their party around those aptitudes. This is a bit different from building a character who IS you, but there are similarities. The question you would have to ask yourself is, if someone with my mind was in this world, what type of adventurer would I be?

You don't need to duplicate or stick to your own real world stats and skills. This is still a fantasy game, but instead, put yourself into a character who thinks/acts/responds/strategizes in a way that is organic to the real you. So, instead of the "balanced" party, you might end up with a crew of all casters and one rogue. Or nothing but fighters/martials, all bards, cavaliers and monks, etc, etc. I guess I'm just curious if anybody has ever built a group like this. Has anyone tried this, or maybe do you play that way all the time? What kind of group composition did this create? How did the game play go?

For a further example/clarification. Most of my early gaming friends were the classic brainy/academic geek types. Casters were a natural fit for most of us (though not everyone played those classes). As I've met other players over the years, I've met folks who's natural tendencies when declaring actions would indicate rogue, or "healer", bard, "face", "tactician", whatever. Not all of these are going to be specific classes obviously, but also/or style/jobs/roles that you fit into. The way my brain works, I'm not the most tactically savvy or quick on my feet. So fighter or ranger isn't necessarily the best choice for me; at least within the context of this discussion.

Eager to hear folks thoughts and experiences. Cheers all.


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Ooops. Hit enter and started with a blank post I think. Anyway . . . . . . .

Nobody actually has to justify themselves. We all have things we like for one reason or another, and opinions can't really be wrong.

What I'd like to discuss here, is a meeting of the minds between those who choose their weapon for aesthetic or flavor, and those who choose for mechanics. I'm not super good at the crunch, but I know there are certain weapons out there that are just held up as superior. What I'm looking for are examples of the ideas, builds, and corner cases where your favorite weapon really gets to shine. Probably difficult to do this with simples, but kudos to those who take the challenge.

So when is a morningstar the best choice? What about the old trust dagger, or a trident? The star knife? Maul? Longspear? etc.

Why does the weapon you choose belong on the table? What are the features that make it meet your characters goals/needs?


Howdy folks. Casting a wide net here, so I figured general discussion was best. As those who've seen my post elsewhere will know, I play in a group sandbox game where we take turns GMing the same characters in an ongoing story. Think different writers/directors of episodes on a TV series.

We currently have a player who is first time GMing, ( and she's killing it! :) ). I will be running next, and our discussion yesterday, got me to wondering about pacing, game, and story composition.

What I'm wondering is, how do your game sessions go? What is your experience, and your preference when it comes time to sit down and play? Most specifically, how many combats, and how frequently should they occur in your sessions? Also, how long are your sessions, and how often do you play? Does PbP, store game, home game, or society game affect your answers?

I know these answers will vary widely from person to person, group to group, game to game, but I'm hoping to spot some patterns or trends in the chaos.

All input is welcome, but I'm especially eager for the insights and advice of GM's. I'm curious how you lay in combats to satisfy your self, your story, and your different types of players. Regardless of your views, if you could include a quick line about your status as a full time GM, part time GM, or full time player, to give some context to your post, that is appreciated.

Thanks folks.


My husband put a question out on my gaming group's chat yesterday asking, "if one took levels in necromancer and druid, could you talk to wooden furniture? And further, in a city, wouldn't you have plenty of materials for raise dead?"

At first I thought, "ha ha, funny joke!" He was serious though, and didn't know about the necro archetype for druids. I thought about it a bit, and realized I don't know too much about the possibilities. So I bring it to you all. Are these things possible? How might one go about building it? If you just want to talk to the wooden stuff, is the necro necessary? If you really want undead wooden things, is it doable?

All advice welcome, 3pp is fine, rules appreciated. This should probably also be on the rules sub forum, but I have yet to figure out how to make a singular dual category thread. Thanks in advance.


Hi folks. Just saw a post on another thread that got me thinking. Figured it was better to start a new thread than hijack someone else's.

I expect there will be some strong opinions on this one way or the other, but here's the fat to chew:

When building a character (most specifically a caster), which classes work better as a generalist, and which are better built as specialists? The obvious breakdown might just be prepared vs. spontaneous, but the specific post that started this though for me suggested that a cleric is better as a specialist. I'm curious as to others thoughts, ideas, or experiences.


Another thread sparked this idea, but seems like a new topic and I didn't wish to hijack.

I know there are, and will always be, differing opinions on the strengths of different classes, and their supremacy to one and other. That being said, a common opinion on these threads is that Wizards are the most powerful class, superior even to Sorcerers.

Proceeding on the premise that the Wizard class is stonger than the Sorcerer, with all other variables being equal, would the following make a difference?

The flavor of Sorcerer's has always been that the magic is innate, coming from the bloodline within the character. With that in mind, what if all Sorcerer spells were actually spell like abililities? So spell slots would become uses per day, spells known would now be SLA's known/possessed. Mechanically exactly the same, except with regard to the mechanical differences between casting a spell and using/activating a SLA.

Would that extra bit of restriction sloughing raise the relative strength of the Sorcerer?


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I have a handful of different ideas for either story settings and/or individual encounters. Plan on building a fair bit on my own, but I'd like some help brainstorming how to bring some of these ideas together.

Background: Playing with a group of 6 PC's in a shared, sandbox, homebrew world. We all take turns at GM leveling once per story arc/GM rotation. In theory, I will GM 3 to 4 times. The world is built with several land masses and far flung islands so that, in theory, every type of setting and creature is possible (excepting Sci-fi type stuffs).

I've got about half a dozen ideas for things I'd like to present or run on my turns. Probably a few more, but I failed to right them down, so they're adrift somewhere in my subconscious. I'm hoping to draw on the skills and ideas of you who are better and/or more passionate GM's than I to see how these ideas might gel into 3 or 4 distinct story arcs/mini campaigns. Last time I ran for this group, in a different world several years ago, I had several ideas, a great layed out adventure, several enounters and unique story elements . . . . and then I TPK'd everybody on a side quest less than a 3rd of the way in. I need help figuring out how to balance my story builds into manageable chunks, both from a real time perspective, and a themeatic/story based one.

So, the ideas: (some might recognize some of these from other threads of mine)

1. A setting idea, not any story yet. Using the game Candy Land as a setting for a story. Appeal is in the idea of making candy themed monsters and NPC's, not much else there yet. May give this one away to one of our other players who has a young daughter and no GM experience yet.

2. Encounter, possibly multi-encounter idea. Could become whole story-arc. Homage to Plants vs. Zombies. At the very least would like to do 1 (maybe 3) "puzzle combats" using plant critters as summons/allies vs. undead. Maybe have a green witch/druid living in the Tree of Knowledge who either is the quest giver, or is a NPC needed to complete a quest who needs/wants a favor in return. Maybe a feud or turf was between rival plant magic users vs. necromancers.

3. Single encounter/challenge I think, could become more. A dinner party for overpowered monster leaders that the PC's must prepare/solve. This is a multifaceted, gridwork logic puzzle. I got a lot of good feedback on another thread of how to do this. Just not sure if it should be a single encounter, or if it becomes a whole arc of its own.

4. A gladitorial type tournament where each character must fight within the parameters of a specific role. This is the Midnight Games stuff. More combat focused for my hack and slashy players, but with an element of "puzzle combat" or at least more strategy emphasis.

5. A genearl scavenger hunt type quest. Perhaps at the behest of a mage's guild or some such. Could be inert items, but also thinking some type of a critter round up. Thinking pokemon safari zone mixed with a less lethat Jurrasic Park.

6. Full story arc idea, needs individual elements. A micro-sized adventure. Basically the characters all get magically shrunk down to bug size. They won't realize what happened at first. Could just as easily be a mass teleport or planar shift for all they know. Strangers in a strange land type setting along a massive lake river (in reality a ditch/brook running next to the inn they had just left). Meet the micro people, get pulled into a quest to defeat the BBEG that needs the random Maguffin up or down the "river", find out they're all shrunk somewhere along the way nearer to the end, prior to the final confrontation.

I may have other ideas later. I don't claim any of these are amazingly unique/original, but anybody is welcome to use any of these if they appeal. I'd appreciate input on different ways to combine, refine, and/or add to these. The hope, as above, is to have a frame work for 3 to 4 story arcs that could be run in 4 to 12ish sessions of approximately 4 hours each. Keeping in mind that my group tends to progress semi-slowly, and I have a tendency towards over embellishment/complication/biting off more than I should.

If levels matter at all for those giving more mechanical advice, the earliest I might run is Lvl. 4, all the way up to 20. In theory each time I run, we'll be about 5 levels higher than the time before.

Thanks to any and all in advance.


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Had this idea a few days ago, and then read a thread of Reksew_Trebla's that resparked the idea. It's a bit like their question/idea, but in reverse. This is another theory/story crafting topic.

Assuming you could get everyone on board, and not stomp all over player agency feels, is there a way to pull off a successful campaign where everyone dies at the start? There are most certainly multiple facets and steps to this question/scenario, but I'll try to better explain my thoughts.

So, in theory, you have all of your players build the endgame version of the character they want. Max level (or maybe max -1), all the features, gear, powers, etc. that they could possibly want to be the epitome of the concept they visualized for the charcter. Then, start the game, and nearly instantly, everybody dies.

Assuming there's a way to pull this off without inciting a table flipping, game ending, friendship severing revolt, the next step is to now have everyone build new characters who are somehow related to or otherwise linked to their original charcters. Think the joke about the wall of identical dead bards who keep showing up for the final encounter. Instead of being maxed out though, these characters would be built as low/starting level versions of the same concepts. Now the real game begins.

The story would advance through whatever you're wanting to play. Somewhere near the end of the campaign though, an option to restore/ressurect the original characters comes up. I'm curious how different groups might handle this choice. If you've played two characters from the same concept, one in real play and one that was "perfect" in theory, how close would the two be to each other at this point? Which character would you choose to move forward with, the original, or the one you've played for so long?

Just a weird thought in my head. Curious to read peoples ideas. Beyond the what choices would you make part, I'm curious if anyone has any idea on how you could implement that early original character deaths idea as a surprise, without ticking all of your players off.


Entirely possible I'm mis-remembering, but is there more than one way/path to get a magical fox fire ability specifically linked to the Kitsune race? I seem to recall 2 or 3 different powers/features by that name, all similar, but mechanically distinct.

I know there's the kitsune bloodline for sorcerer, and there are a few kineticist talents.

I seem to recall either a racial magic item for kitsune, similar to a star gem (?)
and/or a racial feat other than magical tail.

Can anyone help me out?


Howdy folks. I'm asking for some advice on how to play and advance a character of mine. This is my Ratfolk who started my first thread on these forums.

As in the subject line, the character is primarily driven by concept, but my concept was difficult to wrangle to begin with, and then kind of mutated and exploded a bit once I got on paper. I do know how to build better/more optimal/focused characters, but on this guy, I kind of went all over the place. Thus far the build is pretty well locked. I'm not horrible, but I know I'm likely sub-optimal, and I'd like advice of how best to play the character I have tactically. I'm looking for tips of game mechanics I might be overlooking, possible synergies or combos in my build I may not see, and then lastly recomendations for choices at leveling to not necessarily optimize, but make sure I can at least contribute.

I appreciate any and all help, but I will save a few people some wasted key strokes. This is a homebrew campaign with a sandbox world and shared GMing. We try to stick to RAW, but we do allow several 3pp sources, and make case by case house rules for build concepts of story purposes. We are gestalt as well, so with that extra complication, I very much do not want to multiclass . I'm complicated enough as is. If something in my build doesn't add up, it's probably something we house ruled, but feel free to ask, and I'll explain, or correct myself as necessary. We did rolled stats for instance.

The build (sorry if formatting is off):
Gestalt Ratfold Alchemist (Plague Bringer/Blacksnake/Dimensional Excavator) // Sorcerer (Pestilence Bloodline) Level 2

Str: 14 Dex: 19 Con: 16 Int: 19 Wis: 16 Cha: 18

Racial Features: Market Dweller, Cornered Fury, Cleanliness, and Surface Sprinter

AC:18 (+2 magic shirt, 4 dex, 1 size, +1 unslotted deflection bonus)
Touch:16 Flat-footed:14

Fort:6 Ref:7 Will: 6

CMB +2 (do magic weapons add to this?)
CMD 16

Magic +1 Whip, Magic +1 Tail Blade (both +5 to atk; 1d2+3 dmg)
Bite (+4 atk; 1d3+2)
Ranged Touch Spells (+6 atk)
Special Atack: Lash Talent: Sting (+5 atk; target makes DC 16 Fort save or drops held items and provokes AoO's)

Alchemist and Archetypes features: (Black Snake loses bombs) Prof. w/ whips and no provoking AoO when using whip for atk; can deal lethal dmg. w/ whip regardless of target AC or NAC bonus; Plague vial (replaces mutagen) standard to consume, 10/lvl., can contaminate weapons as standard action, any creature that hits me or is hit by contaminated weapon DC 15 Fort save or Sickened 1rd/lvl.; Alchemy; Disease Resistance (+2 saves v. disease); Poison Use; Discoveries -- Level 2 Pheromones(SU), +3 competence to Bluff, Diplo, and Intimidate

Sorcerer Features: Arcana allows vermin to count as animals for mind affecting spells; first level power Plague's Caress (Sp), melee touch atk sickens for 1 rd, 3+Cha uses per day.

Feats: Brew Potion (class), Eschew Materials (class), Lvl.1 Sharptooh (Ratfolk racial, gives bite atk.)

Traits: Business Venturer (+1 Appraise, Knw. Local, and Prof. Merchant, Local is class skill), Rich Parents (900 starting gold value), Extremely Fashionalbe (wear 150 gp worth of fancy clothes and jewels +1 Diplomacy, Intimidate, and Bluff, Diplo is class skill), Drawback Sentimental (-2 perception v. surprise, -2 ref v. traps)

A lot of gear, if any is relavent please ask

Extracts and Spells:
Alchemical: Adhesive Spittle, Ant Haul, Bouncy Body, Comprehend Languages, Cure Light Wounds, Long Arm, Crafter's Fortune, Shield, True Strike, Expeditious Retreat

Sorcerer: Cantrips; Predtidigitation, Acid Splash, Low Blow, Conjurer's Toolbelt, Lightning Sand
Lvl. 1's; Mud Ball, Pressure Spray

Skills: 10(12) Appraise, 10 Bluff (no ranks), 10 craft Alchemy, 8 Craft (Coins/Minting),8 Craft Leather, 12 Diplomacy, 8 Intimidate (no ranks), 5 Kn. Geograpy, 5 Kn. History, 10 Kn. Local, 8 Kn. Nobility, 8 Prof. Cook, 9 Prof. Merchant, 10(14) Slight of Hand, 8 Stealth (no ranks), 7 Survival

***************************
Conceptually this character came to being from a few different ideas. Primarily he is based upon the concept of disease as a natural vector/cost/byproduct of trade. Equally important to the concept is the dichotomy of filth/dirtyness and cleanliness. Primarily this comes through is spell choices, and in roleplay between in and out of combat persona.

The character is a merchant prince of an extremely powerful clan, that has trade connections to most of the mainland, and several islands to boot. He travels to learn the trade, keep his family's influence strong, and experience the treasures of other cultures. Specifically he is passionate about art and history, especially as these aspects are reflected in a society's coinage. After culture, and coins, his other great passion is cuisinne.

In combat, I know his numbers aren't fantastic. Conceptual/mechanically I've assumed he is (should be?) a debuffer, for now mostly single target. That's a new (or long forgotten) role for me.

I'm also enthusiastic about making him a paragon of ratfolk of sorts. By this I primarily mean I want to take as many of the ratfolk racial feats and options as I can. I intend to get him the claws and burrowing eventually.

The whip thing was kind of a last minuted find to ditch bombs. I wanted to be distinct from the other alchemist in our group, and I don't love bombs much (Yes. I know they're quite powerful).

I suppose I could ditch the Dimensional Excavator Archetype, it hasn't yet mechanically impacted my character, and it was the last random tack on. The progression of pit spells just seemed a useful option to have, thematically appropriate on the "clean up" side of the character, and it's something I've wanted on a character for a while now. But, I do know that including it does technically violate the RAW of archetypes.

That's it for starters. Thanks to anyone who gets through all the word vomit. Any tactical or build tips would be appreciated. Thanks in advance, but please no multiclass.


This is completely for shiggles. Throwing this out both for those who love "pet" class features, but also as a theory crafting challenge for those of you who may hate them, but like to crunch the numbers.

I'm wondering if it's possible to build a character who has all the different "pet" class features and is able to still contribute effectively in a group. I get that these builds are usually disfavored for the complication, book keeping headaches, and uneven play time; like I said, this is just theory.

So, a build with a familiar, an Animal companion, an Eidolon, and a phantom I think. Bounus points if you can get specifically a mount that is seperate from the AC. Also curious if you can get a spirit familiar separate from a standard one. So, minimum 4 critters, max 6? Are there more I'm missing. The various multiple same class feature critter archetypes, are I think a no go for this build (excepting maybe as a way to do mount and AC). Also be cool if each critter/pet fulfilled a specific role as a helper/ally/tool.

Whatcha got?


So, in the process of posting on a different thread, I had one of my random thoughts.

In my current game group, everyone is part of a couple. There's my husband and I, the married couple who host, and our other two friends (formerly married, now divorced).

As gamers our community has come a long way, but the old stereotypes do still crop up. The old stereotype of a gamer is the socially awkward, single, young guy, and a female at the table was practically rarer than a unicorn. Obviously, for those of us who've played for years (or decades) we know this cliché is overstated, but we all also knew (or were) some of those guys.

Now, none of my group is super young any more. We're not elderly either, but all in our 30's to 40's. Is this just a symptom of where we are all at in our lives, or is our group odd? I doubt there are any studies out there, so this is mostly looking for anecdotal insights. How common is it to see couples at the gaming table, much less an entire group of couples?


The topic has come up in a few threads recently, one for a group woefully under WBL, and a couple of others who've mentioned going over.

I feel like I have a decent understanding of how and why being significantly under WBL can impact a party's ability to handle encounters appropriate to their CR.

My question is, where is the threshold of significance for when a party exceeds WBL? In my group, we take turns GMing, as none of us is a "pure" GM at heart. Some, more than others, really like to sprinkle in lots of treasure and magical items. At what point does this generosity lead to the party being "to strong" in terms of average encounters?

I don't think this really has anything to do with using ABP or not, as I'm not sure it's even too much of a problem in our games. We're happy to utilize or hold onto just about any odd or fun "suboptimal" items. More just curious, as to when it might become an issue.


*******SPOILERS!*******

Probably the whole dang thread, and I still can't figure out how to format the spoiler block/tab/button/thing. If you have never played Crypt of the Everflame, and you intend to, and hate spoilers, STAY AWAY FROM THIS THREAD!

Okay, I've tried my best, for the rest of you I have a few questions. Quick background in case it's relevant. Home game; home brew; gestalt; sandbox game; rotating GMs with same group of characters; level 2; prefer RAI/RAW, but use some 3pp and houserules.

Current GM is relatively new on the GM side, so decided to use a module for us. None of us has ever played any modules before.

Question 1: What level(s) is this story intended for? We've been okay so far, and GM says he hasn't nodded anything yet except for place names to put it in our world. The shadow did scare us for a moment though.

Question 2: Seems like a decent story/module, but is it known for plot holes and/or editing issues? Is that a problem with modules in general, or an intentional gap left for GMs to fill?

Question 3: Specifically, we're most of the way through the first floor. GM has shared a confusion/frustration point, so I'm not metagaming or trying to get free answers or spoilers. Asking to help the GM. In the room with the pool of water, with all the keys at the bottom, he misdrew the map the first time, so we only found 1 door. We got the prompt from the disembodied voice "Magic is the key", and we found the one magic key in the pool. It didn't open the locked door. We went on, and explored/cleared most of the rest of floor 1. In the room with the smoking cauldron and the Shadow, we found the burnt key. Headed back to the pool room, to now discover there are actually 2 doors. Burnt key worked for one, magic key still no for the other. We explored the rest of floor 1 and have found the stairs down. GM has revealed there is a corridor and more things behind the door we can't open yet, and confirmed the magic key is for something beyond that point. He says he's read through everything, and that there is no indication of how to open the second door in the key/pool room. Has he overlooked something, or is this just a typo/oversight from the module? He's prepared to make something up or fudge it, but we're looking for an answer. As I said, I don't want any spoilers for lower levels, so if the key or solution is on floor 2 or 3, just say that. If there's something specific the GM just missed though, please clue me/us in.

Thanks in advance.


I see this come up a lot, on several threads.

When, if ever, is the size of the damage die better for a high damage build than multiple attacks and/or bonuses?

At the earliest levels (maybe just 1), when bonuses are still relatively small, I can see it mattering. But pretty quickly isn't it your ability, magic, class, and feat bonuses that make up the majority of your damage? Since all of these (except bonus dice from precision effects) get multiplied on a crit, even crit builds don't seem to care much about dice size.

Are there builds where the die size matters? Obviously a d8 is nicer to have than a d6 if you don't need to invest resources, but aside from that . . . .?

Just wondering.

Edit: oh! Maximized spells maybe. Is there such a thing as maximized weapon attacks?


On the advice given on the original attempt of this thread, I'm remaking/moving this thread from conversion to advice. For the sake of not having to retread old ground, I'll attempt to copy and paste, and properly credit the posts from the other thread.

************

Hi folks. For starters, I legitimately do not know if this should be a conversion, advice, or possibly even product discussion thread, and I have no idea how to make multiple category threads without duplicating. If I'm in the wrong spot, sorry, and please feel free to tell me how to relocate, do it your self, or asks the mods to.

This is a pure fan boy, passion project of mine; but the community often seems on board to help with this kind of thing, and maybe this will be useful to other fans or story tellers.

****** SOME SPOILERS AHEAD **********

The entire series of Kate Daniels is worth a read, but I particularly loved the 3rd book "Magic Strikes". In that book, the main characters (and several of the supporting cast) get pulled into a magical gladitorial type tournament known as the Midnight Games. For various story reasons, the owners/designers of the games are fixated with the number 7. The grand tournament they hold annually involves an elimination style event with teams of 7 members, each of whom must fit a certain role.

This isn't even the most important part of the book, but the specialized team concept has been locked in my brain for over a decade now. Each role speaks to a different combat style and/or weapon/offensive choice. The 7 roles are as follows:

Shield - Defensive fighter

Shiv- Fast fighter (the character in the book dual wields military combat daggers)

Sling - Ranged fighter (guns, bows, whatever)

Spell - Magic user/caster

Stone - not defined, but implied that it's the big guy/gal

Stratego - not defined but implied captain/leader/strategist

SwordMaster - seemingly duh (only weapon specific role; maybe because main character is a sword user)

My questions/objectives are several fold.

1. Can anybody find any already published/established game system rules for a Kate Daniels world setting? I don't want to reinvent the wheel, and all of the series, characters, creatures, and mechanics would be fun to play with.

2. Anything by the authors to better define these roles? I'm reaching out, but the chance of getting an answer is likely slim. Anything with the creative input and authority of the authors would be ideal though.

3. If the above two can't be met (or if folks just want/like alternatives), how would you define these roles? What is required for a fighter (generic term, not the class) to qualify for a role? What actions, weapons, or styles might be restricted or excluded from a role? These answers can be fluff, but game mechanics that fit the roles are ideal.

In the book, several one off characters from other teams seemed like they could qualify for multiple roles. Obviously these terms are pretty broad in several places.

Is defensive waiting to strike back, using a shield, guarding others, or all of the above?
Is fast initiative, multiple attacks, precision damage, or other quick take down options?

All feedback, ideas, questions welcome. Anyone with superior search-fu, please feel free to provide links.

Thanks in advance to all.


Short of building something custom with ARG and race points, are there any rules which let one hybridize the races, or mix and match more than one racial feature?

I'm not super clear on how the heritage feat/trait works. I know changelings can get some pieces through alternate racial traits.

But say I wanted to blend an Undine with Kitsune. Really any potential combo.

Tangent: Are there any rules that allow for variant ability bonuses on any ? Not above houserules, but like to see if there is something published (and theoretically balanced) first.


This is just for lols or theory crafting. We've done the threads on dream teams, mechanically optimized, thematically awesome, or synergistically amazing. Now I want to see the opposite.

Come up with a team of 3 to 5 characters. Each one must be a different class/archetype/build. Choose either mechanically inferior/difficult, poor compatibility, or complicated and time sucky as all get out, as far as the group goes as a whole. Full builds not necessary, and some of the classes may be ones you love (conceptually or in play), but as a group these 5 should be some type of disaster. Get a little masochistic and let the nightmare commence :)


Apparently it's been longer than I realized since I played a druid.

Standard druid never gets access to beast shape IV via wild shape?
Did they used to in D&D 3.5?

I know druids are very powerful, but becoming an elephant that can't trample seems a bit silly. If they did get it in 3.5, does anyone recall what level that came online?

Also, with elementals and plants, no big deal, but are there any options that open up the magical beasts, or is it exclusively animals? Some magical beasts seem more thematic for druids than others.


We read all the time about folks running "low-magic" campaigns, but that means something a little different to everybody. I know that ranking systems are basically arbitrary, and in no way definitive. What I'd like to do though, is come up with a list of all the classes from "most magical" to least, or the other direction.

I count 42 classes; 11 core, 12 base, 3 alternate, 10 hybrid, and 6 occult. If I'm missing any, please let me know. Not interested in 3pp for this thread, as it's already unwieldy enough. Also, no desire to factor in race, traits, equipment, or universal feats. Only what the class has to itself should be weighed for consideration. Archetypes can obviously also throw a monkey wrench here. I'm not saying no to them, but the basic class features take precedent.

The goal here is to get a list of 1 to 42, but I doubt we'll all agree. So,the secondary goal here is to get people's ideas on what "feels" magical to them. For instance: who's more magical, a cleric or a druid? I expect we'll see several ties and or opposite views. What I'm really curious about, are the non casting classes that still have SLAs or (su) abilities. How magical is ki, or rage powers?

Where the archetypes will really weigh in is on the 4th level casters (maybe some 6th). Can the class realistically lose it's spells and still feel like the same class? Ranger comes to mind as a yes. Others, I'm not as sure of.

Prejudicial to be sure, but I'd say arcane magic will weigh more than other magic types. Game history wise it's just the oldest, and what most other magics get compared to. Divine vs. occult/psychic vs. natural? Kind of a toss up. For me, most to least, I think arcane, occult, natural, divine. Reasoning that you start with innate access to an omnipresent mystical force, and the more intermediaries you have between you and that force, the less magical you are. Along that same line, I think spontaneous might have an edge over prepared.

Spells trump all. SLAs with spells greater than spells only. 9th level casters over lower. SLAs probably trump (su) abilities. "Traditional" flavor of the class should likely also factor in. So, the innate magic of a sorcerer would make that class more magical than the studies of a wizard.

Very rough start:
1. Sorcerer 2. Witch 3. Arcanist 4. Wizard . . . . . . . 42. Fighter

Feel free to fill in and change or suggest your own order.


Not sure I can TL/DR this post, so I will try to bold the important parts.

******
For starters, I know, terrible thread title. I've had this bubbling in my brain for a bit, and pieces of theses thoughts have cropped up in a few of my recent posts. Also, I know I'm talking about "theme" characters again. It's apparently a keyword for me; you could start a drinking game . . . . . Please don't; I don't wish alcohol poisoning on anyone.

First question: Are there any alternate rules for making modular choices with class features? I know there are alternate racial features for races, and there are archetypes of classes. But is there any other way to kind of pick and choose class features? I feel like VMC might be this, but I know almost nothing about it. I suppose 3pp sources could also be acceptable, as long as they balance well.

Second question: How do or would modular options affect game design and class balance? If you make a house rule or GM fiat this issue, how much impact might it have? I realize that game designers put tremendous effort into the development of their systems. That time translates (generally) into an expertise that most of us players, and many GMs can't match, and for this we give them our time, attention, and most importantly perhaps money (they gotta eat too).

I'm wondering how much modular rules hamper or help design from a character balance perspective. I can see the danger with min/maxers or power gamers. (Please avoid offense if this is how you identify as a gamer. Math and mastery are not bad traits. Selfishness, over-competitiveness, and condescension are. That's the personal context I know these terms from.) Those types of players find ways to beat any system though. How much does this issue effect game design overall?

As I've mentioned before, my other go to game system is the diceless Marvel Role-playing Game. You build with points, so all character options are basically modular. I love the freedom of that system to build exactly the character I wish. With Pathfinder, I love the solid mechanics, the setting and theme, the art, and all of the creative and pre-made content. White Wolf, I love conceptually. I feel like they try for a balance between creative freedom, story, and mechanics; but the formatting/editing of their materials makes me not enjoy that system as much as I feel I should. Is this issue a big enough one that it defines a system? Is it not possible to "have it all" in this case?

Third issue: Is there any correlation between a themed build and min/maxing? There's nothing wrong with optimizing, but we've all seen the players who take it to the extreme to the detriment of character or story development. As I define theme though, it is where concept/flavor and mechanics intersect. A big part of many themes is the combination of powers or abilities.

I think most of us like to have a character who's good (maybe even the "best") at one or a few things. You're also probably going to have things you don't want for your character. I think those gaps/flaws/penalties help define a theme as much as the strengths. In the course of choosing options that help you express your concept, it's likely you're going to get combos where the numbers add up. I don't think this is inherently right or wrong, but does this make every thematic builder a little bit of a min/maxer? Allowing for differences in build and play styles, does that thought change how you might approach a build or character for yourself? For a group?

Thanks to those who have held on. All of this musing leads to the biggest question/issue for me.

BIG QUESTION: WHAT CHOICES DO YOU MAKE IN PLAY WHEN YOUR BUILD STICKS YOU WITH A FEATURE YOU DON'T WANT? There is amazing versatility in this game, especially if you allow for 3pp. However, as long ad you're working with a finite set of options, and trying to follow the rules for balance's sake, there is a limit to how well you can match a concept. When you've chosen the right race, the best traits and feats, the ideal class, and the most choice archetype combos, it's still possible you might be left with a feature you just don't like. Something that just doesn't fit who or what you want your character to be/do.

As I said above, limitations help a theme as much as what one can do. I know good practice is to try and avoid "one trick ponies". I think there is a difference between that though, and finding as many creative uses for what you do have or specialize in as possible. Also, when you limit yourself from certain abilities, I think it helps to encourage team dynamics. You don't always have the right/best or even effective answer, but maybe someone else does. Versatility is great, yes button, or off theme/against character not so much.

Rough example (NOT ABOUT QUALITY OR POWER OF CHARACTERS): thematically Superman < Green Lantern < Beast Boy. The powers of all three are hugely versatile, but each one is progressively more defined in his concept.

So, you have the power/feature/spell/whatever that doesn't fit. How do you handle that as a player? I get that you might be able to just ignore or not use it, unless it's some type of always on and detectable effect. From a role-play perspective that might be best. But what happens when you find yourself in a situation where that feature comes into play?

Can you avoid the temptation to use the non-thematic ability? How do you keep yourself from slipping into the ability, or using metagame knowledge that that ability is the quickest solution to the encounter? What about if it's a life or death situation for your character or a party member?

I want to be a team player, both as a player and a character, but I'd rather not have that particular conflict or option. I'd rather not have the ability, so it's never a choice between good tactics and good role-play. If that ability comes out in the emergency, it feels like a yes button or deus ex machina. All of the sudden you manifest this thing you've never had before, and then ignore again. Feels like bad storytelling (or at least a tired fantasy/anime trope).

Anyway, that's all the ramble. Thanks to those who saw it through. Any answers, thoughts, links, tips, or comments welcome.


So, based in part on feedback from another thread, I've spent the last several days reading up on the kineticist class. I'm not sure if it's the novel mechanics, my late hours, or if I'm just starting to get an old brain, but its left me with many questions. This thread is likely to meander all over the place, so other questions or ideas welcome, but please number off. If you're answering, please reference the number. My thoughts aren't well organized on this one at all. To be clear though, I do think I like the class, or at least its intent.

1. For the standard class: Con, Dex, Wis, Int/Str, Cha? About that order for stat priority yes? Thinking main stat, ranged attacks, buff crap Will save, skills or melee/carry capacity, dump unless wanting to be face.

2. Is the elemental form (or whatever it's called) infusion worth it? I guess reach and CMB/D bonus, but no stat boosts on an already ranged class just seems like not worth much. What am I overlooking?

3. In general, one perk of the class is that many talents boosted by burn become either all day buffs and/or toggle capable pseudo-SLA's for the day. Is that an accurate understanding?

4. From a build/theme perspective, does the capstone seem like a bit of a slap to those who stay with one element all the way through? Looked at the single element archetype, and its capstone while potentially devastating for damage, just seems so much less versatile or flavorful. I know there are always superior/inferior options, just feels like a better balance or trade of could have been achieved. (Segue: where do I find the alternate capstones I see people mention?)

5. Purely a personal preference thing, but favorite element is earth. Lots of good options for it, but I felt a little let down in the upper level talents. I'm not sure what I'm wanting. Maybe something akin to upper level druid type earth spells. I know there's earthquake, but jet feels a bit to random at times. I'm thinking something like Clashing Rocks(?), or an ability to make/sculpt/use small mountains. Maybe something with crystals/gemstones. Did I miss something awesome in the lists?

6. In general, awesome highlights of other elements? Preferably upper level.

7. If all blasts count as magic, and magic overcomes DR, doesn't that make the rare metals infusion pointless? I'm pretty sure I'm getting my levels and rules for DR mixed up, but can someone help unravel that?

8. Unless its just to have a melee fall back, why kinetic blade?

9. Does the hurricane whip infusion get the initial full circle attack (possibly hitting 24 squares/enemies) or is it just to provide a broader threatened area for a round?

10. Has anyone tried any of the 3pp elements? Were they decently balanced and fair to play?

11. Is there some way to swap out or avoid a basic kinesis? For instance, if I want an electrical theme, without having to have the ability to play with the wind/air. I know sorcerer could do this one better, just trying to understand the possibilities and limitations of this class.

More questions and ideas will follow I'm sure, but that's what shook loose at the moment.

Thanks in advance for the help.


Hi folks. For starters, I legitimately do not know if this should be a conversion, advice, or possibly even product discussion thread, and I have no idea how to make multiple category threads without duplicating. If I'm in the wrong spot, sorry, and please feel free to tell me how to relocate, do it your self, or asks the mods to.

This is a pure fan boy, passion project of mine; but the community often seems on board to help with this kind of thing, and maybe this will be useful to other fans or story tellers.

****** SOME SPOILERS AHEAD **********

The entire series of Kate Daniels is worth a read, but I particularly loved the 3rd book "Magic Strikes". In that book, the main characters (and several of the supporting cast) get pulled into a magical gladitorial type tournament known as the Midnight Games. For various story reasons, the owners/designers of the games are fixated with the number 7. The grand tournament they hold annually involves an elimination style event with teams of 7 members, each of whom must fit a certain role.

This isn't even the most important part of the book, but the specialized team concept has been locked in my brain for over a decade now. Each role speaks to a different combat style and/or weapon/offensive choice. The 7 roles are as follows:

Shield - Defensive fighter

Shiv- Fast fighter (the character in the book dual wields military combat daggers)

Sling - Ranged fighter (guns, bows, whatever)

Spell - Magic user/caster

Stone - not defined, but implied that it's the big guy/gal

Stratego - not defined but implied captain/leader/strategist

SwordMaster - seemingly duh (only weapon specific role; maybe because main character is a sword user)

My questions/objectives are several fold.

1. Can anybody find any already published/established game system rules for a Kate Daniels world setting? I don't want to reinvent the wheel, and all of the series, characters, creatures, and mechanics would be fun to play with.

2. Anything by the authors to better define these roles? I'm reaching out, but the chance of getting an answer is likely slim. Anything with the creative input and authority of the authors would be ideal though.

3. If the above two can't be met (or if folks just want/like alternatives), how would you define these roles? What is required for a fighter (generic term, not the class) to qualify for a role? What actions, weapons, or styles might be restricted or excluded from a role?

In the book, several one off characters from other teams seemed like they could qualify for multiple roles. Obviously these terms are pretty broad in several places.

Is defensive waiting to strike back, using a shield, guarding others, or all of the above?
Is fast initiative, multiple attacks, precision damage, or other quick take down options?

All feedback, ideas, questions welcome. Anyone with superior search-fu, please feel free to provide links.

Thanks in advance to all.


I had a bit of an epiphany. I'm sure some of you will think "well duh", as maybe this was obvious to some of you. I've struck upon an aspect of character/class design that I think appeals to me and many others; though certainly not all.

The classes that I enjoy the most, and that I'm wondering if they actually see more play, are those with some kind of baked in thematic choices in the core build.

I'm thinking of Cleric (deities and domains), Fighter (specific weapon and style builds), Sorcerer/Bloodrager bloodlines, Wizard schools, Cavalier/Sammurai orders, Inquisitor inquisitions, Oracle mysteries, Summoner eidolons, Hunter companions, and Shaman spirits.

Classes that make you make choices about theme or identity at level 1 (maybe 2). It feels like these were archetypes before archetypes were even a thing. For players like myself, who try and play something that "feels" different with each character, it seems these choices offer more replay value to certain classes. Obviously, archetypes did a lot to help with this issue for most/all classes.

I should also give honorable mention to Druids, Rangers, and Shifters. They all have mechanics that help establish a theme; but with each there is some factor that makes it a bit less ideal (Druid fewer defining choices and too much power/versatility; Ranger to mechanically gimped by the favored choices being so nice; Shifter mechanically sub par).

Witches too could make the list, but I feel like the patrons don't come with enough mechanics tied to the flavor.

I just don't know the occult classes, but with all the rest not on my list, I feel there are one of two problems (for my character building process). Either the class has too much in the way of options/versatility, or the class as a whole already is one theme.

In the first case you have (most of) the remaining classes. Features like Rogue talents, Barbarian rage powers, Alchemist discoveries, and their ilk offer nearly endless customization. Mechanically this is great. Creatively it can also be good; but the lack of those defining thematic choices seems to lead too often to the same traditional, optimal, or familiar features selections. This with the Witch too.

The second problem comes from classes like the Vampire Hunter, the Vigilante, and maybe the Omdura. There is a strongly built in theme to the class as a whole. To be fair the Druid can have this problem too. Even Bards and Scalds have this issue somewhat. Strong mechanics and archetypes go a great way towards mitigating this issue, but those first three are still hard for me to get excited over.

Weirdly too, the Gunslinger manages to represent both problems/extremes to me, without being able to find its way into the happy middle of the original classes I listed.

I guess I'm just wondering how people feel about this. Are there features on some classes I'm overlooking that make them more theme friendly? Where do the various occult classes fall in this topic? Are there archetypes you feel really make this no big deal, or any classes that even archetypes don't help? (Keeping in mind this is not about mechanical optimization). Do you just not care about theme, or are you really good about making the thematic choice always mechanics be d*mned?


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I'm sure opinions will vary, but in general, when is this okay or not okay? My thoughts and questions are no more or less important than anyone else's I know. With pushing towards 200,000 threads though, and more every day, some conversations fall down the line that still have life. I know those that are gone for years should probably be left to lie, but what about just a few weeks ( maybe months)?

Especially in General discussion where there are ideas and topics visited again and again, my search fu isn't that strong, and any given topic is likely to have dozens of lovingly deceased thread ancestors. When is it better to just start a new thread on an old topic, and when is it okay to bump?

Obviously I have some topics I'd like to continue or see new input on. I just don't want to be rude or (overly) annoying.


I know that the alignment system leads to some of the wiliest and most heated of debates. Not looking to spark that. Feel free to just say you or your group doesn't play evil and we'll move on. What I'm curious about is how you or your groups handle running or playing an evil character, party, or story.

As a general rule, I don't play evil characters. Both myself and my group, we're perfectly content to be typical heroic good guy types. I have played in some entertaining evil campaigns though. In my experience, if you only have one or two evil characters in an otherwise neutral or goodly group it doesn't really work for good story telling or group cohesiveness.

The only way I've ever seen it work is if we set out to do a themed evil campaign. We also had to have a common enemy to bring us together, otherwise the inherent selfish/destructive nature if evil didn't seem to make sense for a group. The final thing that made it work for us was an intentionally stated level of absurdity. As people none of us wanted to condone any truly evil acts, so we handled it by making the whole thing a farce.

The characters may have been serious in their evil pursuits, but as players, we made a point to laugh and embrace the absurdity. All the necessary bits about consent, and comfort were taken into account. Basically think of a very blue (evil not vulgar) comedy set where the subjects of the joke ( the characters ) weren't in on it.

I'm curious about other people's experiences. Have you played an evil character that was fun? Did you play in a mixed alignment group? If so, how did you all make it work. If you've done an all evil campaign, how do you handle the division of fun with dark characters vs. "Oh my God! We're saying some truly awful things!"

I guess part of this is what good actors who play great villains have to deal with.


Okay . . . . . so I really stink at subject lines.

For the TL/DR crowd: Any advice on how to build a strong-man, earth elemental magic using character, with a tiger motif, and a penchant for using stupidly big hammers?

* * * *

For the rest of you with a bit more patience (or a strong masochistic streak), bear with me while I try to explain myself and de-clutter my brain.

I've made and attempted this type of character in other systems and older editions, but never had a chance to see it get any play time.

I'd like to make a character who can step up as the "strong-man" of the group. He doesn't need to win any DPS competitions, but he should be able to make a decent damage contribution in combat; enough so that the mechanics support the idea of hulk-esque blows and effects, but just being the heavy lifter/pack mule could also scratch the itch. I'm leading with this because it's the biggest mechanical issue and my search-fu isn't that strong.

Theme is most important. PFS not necessary, but RAW is preferred. Not opposed to RAI and/or 3pp if it furthers the concept.

I'd like the character to be able to use "earth" magic. Specifically rocks, tremors, and crystals, NOT so much Acid or plant spells. Think earth benders from Avatar.

I'd also like him to have a totemistic tie to tigers. Could be an AC, but more preference for shape shifting, or anthropomorphic. Ideally this boosts STR, as well as whatever skills, utility, and flavor it can add to the character.

Race wise, in the past I've considered a 3.x racial variant on elves (Wild or Wood elf I think) that got to swap a Str bonus for the normal Dex. I like the idea of an atypically brawny elf. I've also liked the Goliaths (sorry only knew them from 4e D&D). Have considered a tigerish Catfolk, but don't know if there's any RAW way to get one a STR boost. Also like Oreads.

Classes I've tried are Druid, 4e Warden, Barbarian, and Shaman. Magus seems a fit for weapon and magic together, but I don't know for sure.

However the character builds, I'd like him to be able to use whatever the biggest (damage die) hammer is. Maul, sledge, Earth-Breaker? Dice rarely like me, so the consistent decent base damage and smash appeals to me more than the high crit or broad crit range weapons.

I realize there's a very likely chance here that my concept is a little too spread out to really work well. I'm not looking for super optimal, just ideas to polish him up, or make the parts cohese well enough to contribute in a group of average level experience and game mastery.

Beyond the combat and mechanical aspects, it would be nice to have enough skills, feats, features left over to help flesh out/justify some wisdom or charisma type skills/roles. I see him as your classic strong leader type, or possibly "right hand man". He doesn't have to be the star in these areas, but I'd like him to not suck at social interaction or skills that involve out of combat assistance for the party. Maybe some craft skills related to his magic with stone and gems.

I know a lot of this comes out in flavor and role play. I'd just like to find mechanics that support the descriptions. For reference to what I know and am familiar with. I have immediate access to the CRB and APG. For just about everything else, my primary reference/resource is D20pfsrd. I've looked at Nethys once or twice, but I get lost. (Tragic I know) I'm pretty comfortable with the basic rules and several 3pp contributions, but I know nothing about Mythic, Unchained, or VMC. Open to learn though.

If there's any questions about priorities; Earth Magic and the Tiger shape tie for first, being really STR is a close but definitive third, hammer is a must but doesn't need to be optimal, and then leftovers to flesh out. Any other questions I'll try and answer if/when they arise.

Any and all feedback is appreciated. If you could let me know what kind of level, role, niche, or build your advice leans towards that would also help. For instance, I tend to always build with level 20 in mind, but I usually see play to level 5ish, rarely to level 11ish. I've no problem with room to grow, but I'd like as many of the options or seeds to be established at level 1 as possible.

Thanks folks.


Wasn't sure how to title this thread properly, so please bear with me for a somewhat wordy explanation.

This is very preemptive. I'm in a group where we all share/rotate GMing duties. None of us are "pure" GM's at heart, so we pass the job around so that everyone gets a chance to "just play". I've got an idea for a puzzle encounter, and roughly half of our group really loves puzzles. Pick a playing motivation/preference, and someone at the table probably has it, but we're all pretty good about allowing for different types of fun and play.

What I'm looking for are tips or recommendations on how to get the group to actually take on and solve a puzzle, as opposed to avoiding it or finding some other work around. I know a pretty solid rule of GMing is to prepare for all of your plans to be for naught, but that's particularly gutting when you've put in a lot of time and energy into developing something cool, especially if you know you've got players who will enjoy the fruits of your labors. That being said, I absolutely do not want to fish hook or railroad the group either. I'm trying to find a balance.

To set the scene (as roughly framed as it currently is), I want to do a gridwork/logic puzzle. They probably have a proper name, but I'm blanking at the moment. Hopefully some of you remember this from school days.

Example puzzle: You have five people, each of them has a different pet, and each pet has a different toy. Using a series of clues, you have to figure out which pet, and which toy, belongs to which person. Usually this is laid out as a series of grids showing the possible combinations, and you mark off excluded combos from the clues, until the final answer presents itself logically.

I want to do something like this with a group of monsters having a dinner with each guest having a different entree, and each being served on a specific type of dish. Those details truly don't matter at this stage.

What I'm looking for are ways to encourage the party in game to stick with the puzzle, as opposed to just triggering a combat, blowing it all up, or time passing it all by trying every possible combination.

I know I can put in repeatable trap/magic damage. I can have some kind of event or threat looming, that makes in game time sensitive, I can dole out extra clues of promised rewards to make the puzzle more enticing. I'm just looking for inspiration, ideas, or mechanics to help make the puzzle the most appealing option. I don't want to bottle neck the story when this event comes; but I'd like to try and stack things so that solving the puzzle is the best or most logical choice.

Any and all ideas are welcome, as long as it's not "hate puzzle, that dumb". I'll try to answer any questions as I can. Thanks folks.


I'm not good at concise, but the subject is pretty much it. How many people are players in your preferred group.

I like a "fuller" team. 3 is really my minimum, but I played a few pick up sessions with just 2 before the main story started that went okay.

I guess I'm kind of basic/classic, but I love the 4 or 5 person party (more towards 5) for a broader coverage of ideas and features.

As a semi-occasional GM, I've got a story line that I really need/want 7 players for. It's a bit of a fan service to a book series I love (World of Kate Daniels anyone?)

I've played in a store game with ~15 for a few sessions that was "interesting". And, I have no desire to ever play solo, but that's just me.

So, . . . ., what do you all like? Or do you even care?


Hi folks. Don't want to violate any thread/forum rules, nor encourage imprudent internet oversharing. If I'm doing either of those, please feel free to smack my cyber-hand and call me a bad monkey.

With that out of the way, we're all gamers here. I'm curious about people's screen names. I assume that at least some of them are characters people have played, concepts they enjoy, and or references to some other beloved bit of nerd-dom. So, in that vein, if you care to share:

1. Where does your screen name come from?
2. If it is a character, have you ever played the character in any games (single, multiple, different systems)?
3. If it's something else, what?
4. (Only if it's not against the rules) Country of origin (just country), to help give a SMIDGE of cultural context to any ideas or references.


This is meant to be a purely nerdy, gush, list, and love type thread.

I'm curious what types of creatures folks like or have come up with that fit into the "magical beast" category. I get that those parameters can be pretty broad, so I'll try and narrow the scope a bit.

I'm interested in creatures that:
1. Start as or are inspired by a real world animal
2. Have or are identified by an in game spell or spell like ability
3. And/Or have some kind of elemental or other thematic template added.

Pokemon, Digimon, and there ilk are an easy reference point here, though specifically the ones where you can clearly see the underlying real animal inspiration.

Specific examples include (some of these likely D&D): Blink Dogs, Ash Rats, Shocker Lizards

Some home brew ones: Sleep Cat (our actual cat, she's scary), Shield Rabbit, Gravity Pug

Also would be curious about elemental templates that "just fit" certain creatures in your mind, either because they make perfect sense, or because they only make sense in your brain.

Things for me include: plant frogs, Wind (not winged) monkeys, fire stags, Earth Tiger

Any and all ideas welcome. Feel free to be as descriptive of general as you wish.


I'm sure I'm probably late to this topic, but I've been reading a few threads that just brought the question to the forefront of my mind.

What are the major differences between Pathfinder 1st and 2nd editions?

My husband looked into 2e several months back, but I haven't had the opportunity to really look it over. My biggest confusion came when he tried to explain the new character creation system to me.

I know folks are likely to have strong opinions about the superiority of one over the other, but please try to keep any vitriol or effusive praises in check. I'm looking for more of an academic approach to the subject. I'd like to get as clear an explanation as possible of 2e's build process, and what options it create's and or eliminates as compared to 1e. Some specific or mechanical examples are welcome, but I'm more interested in flavor and function than pure numbers crunching.

Thanks to any thoughtful respondents, and I'm sorry if this revives any old rant or tirade threads.


Just wondering if there are any feats out there that would let one dip into the Oracle the way Eldritch Heritage lets you dip into Sorcerer. Paizo or 3rd party is fine. If not, then maybe this becomes a homebrew question of what seems reasonable for pre-reqs for such a feat. Basically is there any way to acquire Oracle Mystery Revelations the way Eldritch Heritage will let you acquire Sorcerer Bloodline Powers?


This might be more of a homebrew or 3pp question, so those sources are welcome here too.

I'm wondering what fine size creatures or races are out there. I know that massive deviations from small and medium can mess with party balance. However lets assume an appropriate setting and amenable group. I love the feel of an Antman style character or background. Maybe a mouse instead. What I'm wondering is, is there some combination of race, feats, spells, or powers that could let me play as fine sized at least semi-consistently? Need to still have functional appendages and mobility. I'm not talking about movement rate. I'm okay if that sucks. Just don't want to be stuck as a polymorphed quill or other minuscule inanimate object. Bonus points and thanks the sooner/lower level this is acheiveable.


I'm curious to hear about any games people played where you had to get outside of you role-playing box. I know given enough time, most of us play a little of everything. But, if you look below the surface, there's often a common thread of flavor, mechanic, or play style most of us fall into. Have you ever challenged yourself, or been forced to get outside of your box? Sometimes these types of games can lead to great characters. Mostly interested in positive or intriguing experiences, but absolute disaster stories are welcome too.


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Hi folks. I'm brand new to message boards, so please bear with me. I'm 32, but for all intents and purposes, I might as well be 80 when it comes to this stuff. I don't know how to format posts or links, I don't understand a lot of message board slang or jargon, and abbreviations often go over my head. Brace yourself for a wordy first post (which I think might qualify as TLDR) (too long didn't read?); but I'll try to be concise.

Playing in a home campaign. We are gestalting. Please don't fuss, it was the best way for some of us to create the character concepts we wanted. We like rules as guidelines and framework, but this is definitely a roleplay/flavor focused crew. Anyway, I'm making a ratfolk character. For half of him I'm doing the ratfolk alchemist racial archetype (Plague Bringer). The other half is where I could use some help. I have a concept, but there isn't a specific class that jumps out with it. For a reference, if any of you remember the cartoon "Darkwing Duck", there were two villains. They were sisters. One was sort of an evil maid/cleaning lady, and the other was like a garbage woman. Their whole schtick was that the "clean" one would vacuum peoples money away, while the "dirty" one grimed people up and basically got them stuck in place. The whole clean/dirty, yin yang is the concept. I want to use spells that have a clean or dirty flavor. I DO NOT, want this to turn into a Prestidigitation thread. I know that that is basically the ultimate cleaning spell. I'm looking for other spells that fit the clean/dirty bill. Things like "gust of wind", "grease", "mudball", "aqueous orb", etc. This is where my lack of computer savvy bites me. I'm not having luck with searches on my own. It's theoretically possible that this is a new concept, but far more likely that I just haven't found the right threads yet. So, any ideas, suggestions, links, or comments would be appreciated. I don't want to have to try and re-invent the wheel. Thanks in advance.