Spect_Spidey's page

Don't forget there is a fifth class with the Barbarian download as well.

You could use the old Dragonlance idea with a wizard. Where his first adventure could be a test to gain access to a magic academy or his test to become a full fledged wizard.

Thanks for the hard work EdOWar. I hope to test some of these BB type classes out.

I have a question for anyone who has received these. How big is the dwarf compared to the other miniatures? Does the scale seem to be right?

I just got my set of these today and they are terrific. I am definitely buying some of the boosters after getting these.

I'm in Kingsport, TN, and unfortunately driving an hour and a half one way for PFS is just a little much for me. Too bad it's the closest one... *sigh*

Hmm. I am just across the stateline in Virginia. I was beginning to think I was all alone in this area. LOL

Thanks for the replies so far. Was season zero was written for 3.5? If so is it hard to convert them to PF? Does it make them too easy?

I think another thing is that you didn't actually have to fight the 5 goblins. When I ran this adventure, my group talked to the goblins. Violence doesn't solve everything. LOL

I really like the whole idea of the Pathfinder Society and have decided to use it as a back drop for the campaign I am starting for my wife and son. I am currently running them through the 3 free intro scenarios from season three. But I would like suggestions on what are some other good low level scenarios from PFS that I could use in their campaign? Specifically ones that cater to levels 6 and under. Thanks in advance for any suggestions.

Spect_Spidey wrote:

The beginner box itself seems counter productive to this. It becomes a bait & switch or a quick dollar idea. A product is released, BB. It is slick, streamlined, and lean, a fantastic product. I purchase it and I want more. So I start to look for adventure paths, only I found that to get any more I got to get a more complex bogged down set of rules.... Upgrading to the CRB takes away all of the advantages that the BB presents to me which is easy of play...

The name "Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Beginner Box" is a pretty big clue that it's designed as a starting point for the Pathfinder Roleplaying Game, and not a standalone product. (If our intent had been what you want, we'd have called it something like "Pathfinder Basic.") There's no bait-and-switch going on here—it's just that you're coming to it with expectations contrary to anything we've said.

Maybe bait & switch is not the best phrase to use. But what has been produced is a product that is sleek, well laid out, and easy to use. The next step, CRB is none of those things in my opinion. Don't get me wrong, I love the Beginner Box. And the adventures and such that I have skimmed through all seem to be top notch. But I feel that if you want people to move onto the CRB that it needs an overhaul. It needs to be streamlined and laid out better. I also think that to be a beginner product, the BB should have had all the rules but limit choices. For example AoO, CMB, etc should be in the rules but the number of feats, traits, spells, etc limited. It would allow the players to learn all the rules, but not overwhelm them with all the customization options for their character. This would lead to a natural progression to the CRB. If I have played for 5 levels with all the rules, then I am not as intimidated by the CRB. Because I learned all the rules, the next step would be to start adding in all the extras. As a stand alone product, the BB is great. As an introduction into the CRB, I think it fails. It doesn't come close to preparing a player to move into the full rules.

Spect_Spidey wrote:

I know these are not out yet, but the Beginner Box Heroes are. So does anyone have any size comparisons to any of the other popular mini brands, such as D&D, Reaper, Gamesworkshop, etc?

Base-wise, the diameter is exactly the same as D&D Minis (DDM). Height-wise the 4 Paizo minis are all the same height or 1mm taller than the humans in the DDM. Overall, these are 35mm high minis. One note though, is that Merisiel is as tall at the humans, but she is slightly crouched. If she were to be standing fully upright, then she would be the tallest (which is in accordance to Pathfinder elves).

Thank you for the reply. What about mass/density wise? Do they seem to be larger than the DDM? I haven't seen any pictures side by side, but I get the impression that the Pathfinder minis would make the DDM ones seem scrawny. How do they compare size wise to the Pathfinder metal minis?

I know these are not out yet, but the Beginner Box Heroes are. So does anyone have any size comparisons to any of the other popular mini brands, such as D&D, Reaper, Gamesworkshop, etc?

Spect_Spidey wrote:

The beginner box ... becomes a bait & switch or a quick dollar idea. ... the BB has basically become a quick dollar for Paizo from my purchase.

I'm pretty sure Paizo is making very little, if any, money on the Beginner Box.

My point was not how much they were making on it. The point was that the BB offered something that I was looking for. An easy to understand well laid out simple rule system to role play with my family. But with no further products to support, it then becomes my only purchase.

It has been stated that the point of the BB was to attract new players to the full game. But I think this has become a misconception. It actually ends up more like a car salesman trick. You went to the lot looking for a no frills car to get you from point A to B. But while buying the car, the salesman advises you that you got to have the power windows/doors, GPS, etc. So now you have all these extras that you aren't going to use. So you can either buy it or find another dealer who will give you what you want. Basically, I want to buy my stuff from Paizo. And honestly, I probably would buy a corebook IF it was put together like the BB. I say take the core books streamline the explanations and trim the fat. Make that 500+ page rulebook more organized and have rules like AoO, CMB, etc. in a section that is optional.

I quite like it - simple, fast, elegant. However does small stature also entail smaller weapons? My other concern was is it this balanced well enough? +1 AC and +4 to stealth seems pretty good, tailored to the rogue class.

I tried to keep the format of the BB regarding racial advantages, about 3 to 5 per race. The options are selected straight from the reference but doesn't factor in the size rules which is why I opted for only the portion that is included in the BB. The full rules give these same bonuses plus +1 to attack rolls with a -1 to their CMB & CMD. I thought the +1 on attack rolls may be too powerful in the BB rules so I omitted it. Also this has not been play tested yet so it may need some tweaking.

This has not been play tested. Let me know what you think though. I designed this using the Pathfinder Role Playing Game Reference Document. I left out descriptions to keep the post size down. This is only for levels 1 and 2.

BARD
You confuse and confound your foes while inspiring your allies to greater daring. You are accomplished with weapons and magic, but your true strength lies in your ability to undermine your foes while supporting your companions.

1ST LEVEL BARD CLASS FEATURES
Fortitude Save +0 Hit Points 8
Reflex Save +2 Attack Bonus +0
Will Save +2 Skill Ranks 6

BARD SKILLS
Acrobatics Bluff
Climb Diplomacy
Knowledge (all) Perception
Sense Motive Stealth
Perform (new to BB)

ARMOR & WEAPONS
All simple weapons plus longsword, rapier, short sword, and shortbow. A bard can use light armor and shields. Medium and heavy armor would prevent a bard from using their bard spells.

CLASS ABILITIES
Bardic Knowledge: Bard adds 1/2 level (minimum 1) to all Knowledge skill checks and can use Knowledge skills untrained.

Bardic Performance: A bard is trained to use the Perform skill to create magical effects on those around him, including himself if desired. He can use this ability for a number of rounds per day equal to 4 + his Charisma modifier. A bard can do either of the following:

Inspire Courage
Fascinate

BARD SPELLS
Bard can cast cantrips ( 0 level spells). These spells are cast like any other spell, but they do not consume any slots and may be used again.

Summon Instrument
Daze
Dancing Lights
Ghost Sound

Bard can cast 1 first level spell per day at 1st level. Add 1 more spell if CHA is +1 or higher.
Level Spells Known
0 1st 2nd 3rd
1st 4 2 — —

Pick two spells from the following list.

Comprehend Languages
Alarm
Cure Light Wounds
Detect Secret Doors
Disguise Self
Summon Monster I
Feather Fall
Expeditious Retreat
Charm Person
Remove Fear

2ND LEVEL

Add +1 Attack Bonus, Reflex Save, and Will Save. 1D8 + CON Hit Points.

You learn 1 more 1st level spell and can cast 1 more 1st level spell per day.

ABILITIES
Versatile Performance
Well-Versed

Let me know what you think. I came up with this using the Pathfinder Role Playing Game Document.

Gnome:
+2 Constitution, +2 Charisma, –2 Strength

SPEED 20 Feet (4 Squares)15 Feet when wearing medium or heavy armor.

LOW-LIGHT VISION You can see twice as far in dim light as a dwarf or human.

KEEN SENSES You are good at spotting details. +2 Misc Mod to Perception skill.

SMALL STATURE You are smaller then most races. You get a +1 bonus to AC and +4 to stealth checks.

ILLUSION RESISTANCE You get a +2 saving throw bonus against illusion spells or effects.

To be frank, the point of the Beginner Box is to bring new players to the full RPG, and to our Adventure Paths. So once people are comfortable with the basic concepts from the Beginner Box, we want them to move to the full RPG as soon as possible; anything we do that keeps them from migrating to the full RPG is therefore counterproductive to our goals, and a "Beginner Box II", whether that's adding options for Levels 1–5 or adding levels 6 and higher, works against that goal. The goal is teaching you the full game, not giving you a reason not to learn it, or a substitute for it.

The beginner box itself seems counter productive to this. It becomes a bait & switch or a quick dollar idea. A product is released, BB. It is slick, streamlined, and lean, a fantastic product. I purchase it and I want more. So I start to look for adventure paths, only I found that to get any more I got to get a more complex bogged down set of rules. Now I have three choices. Upgrade to a complex bulky rules set that I may not be able to understand, run, or time to play using. Switch to another system. Or just continue to play the BB over and over again. With these options, the BB has basically become a quick dollar for Paizo from my purchase. I would love to get some of the Adventure Paths, but they aren't designed for the product I have so I don't purchase them. I honestly feel that if the goal of the BB was to get players into the full game then the wrong product was developed. They should have just released a new CRB with better explanations and layout. Don't get me wrong, I love the BB and it's rules. I am quite happy with it. But at the same time there is no way I am going to try and play an adventure path, campaign etc. with my family using the full rules. And I think alot of people will feel the same way. The BB is great and was bought for its presentation, layout, and simpler rules set. Upgrading to the CRB takes away all of the advantages that the BB presents to me which is easy of play, quick look ups, and just the right amount of options for character customization.

I prefer the Beginner's Box rules because I run the game for my wife and 8 year old son. Neither of which want to learn too many rules or options. The complexity of the Corebook and determining what feats, spells, ect. to keep in our game would detract from the limited time I have to design adventures for them. A second box set would allow me to make some higher level adventures, add more class/race variety and maybe a few more rules without having to teach them alot of new stuff. For example it is a whole lot easier to teach them that at level 6 a fighter can make an extra attack and casting a spell with an adjacent enemy can evoke an attack of opportunity than it is to try and explain combat maneuvers etc. It is basically me paying Paizo to do the work of simplifying and streamlining the game for me so I have more time to play. If I had to read a 500+ page rulebook AND determine what rules I wanted to keep and omit, I wouldn't have time to play. Which would mean I would have no reason to buy any Paizo products.

I completely agree. My wife and 8 year old son wouldn't play the full version of Pathfinder, too many options & too many rules. But this they can play and enjoy. I would love to be able to take them beyond level 5. I think to level 10 would be good for the next box. It could also include haflings, half elves, and gnomes. And add in another four classes. Maybe paladins, druids, bards, and sorcerers?

Heck when I discovered the Beginner Box, I read lots of reviews on it. I bought the PDF version and was so impressed when I finished reading it that I went right out and bought the retail version. I have not been excited about role playing in years, but this product has brought back the joy. I look forward to playing this whenever my family has a chance.

I am running the BB for my wife and son. I also created a character as a tag along to assist them. My wife is an elven rogue and my son is a human fighter. I created a dwarven cleric. This is how I plan to have things happen.

1. Black Fang's Dungeon
The dragon will fly off with my character. Remaining 2 party members will recruit a new party member and search for their lost comrade's brother.

2. Deadly Mine
They will locate their comrade's brother who advises on the history between the dwarf and the dragon. He points them to a crumbling tower where one of Black Fang's hirelings resides.

3. Master of the Fallen Fortress
Here they rescue their comrade only to find that he is deathly ill and they must locate a cure for him. Leading to:

4. Hollow's Last Hope
Story modified so that the cure is for their friend instead of a whole town.

I figure this should buy me a little time to come up with some original ideas along with helping to flesh out the area around Sandpoint.

Well played the BB adventure tonight with my wife and 8 year old son. It went pretty well except that my son was very greedy. He wanted all the items and at one point ignored a warning of a creature coming up behind him just to search through some treasure. LOL But we all had fun.