Sileven's page

@Sileven I'm going to have to say my gut reaction was no on the racial weapon group idea. It is unbalancing because we are already using EitR rules and the fact that any wizard could become a weapon master in a range of different weapon is unfair to those who depend on weapon superiority (like fighters).

But I did say I wanted more diverse characters. This new rule would have more people using elven blades without to overwhelming the game balance. So yes. I thought about it and I agree.

WOW! Thank you. Earliest it will impact this build is Rogue Finesse Training at level 3. Which is still really early. I don't expect that to matter again until the second Fighter Weapon Training at level 9 and then the projected additional Weapon Focus feat at level 15. LONG lead time on that.

Assuming I'm selected, of course. Won't really matter to me if not. <grin>

Reusing a fallow alias to apply. hustonj, here.

Elven archery Fighter/Rogue with the Chance Encounter trait, as suggested earlier.

I have a question that absolutely will not alter my submission, though it will alter his advancement if selected:

Do you support the unofficial Fighter Weapon Groups of racial weapons?

Those weapon groups, when I have seen them used before, consist of the weapons listed in a race's weapon familiarity entry and any weapons with the race name as part of the weapon name.

So, for elves (as the case at hand), that would be longbows (including composite longbows), longswords, rapiers, and shortbows (including composite shortbows), and any weapon with the word “elven” in its name (such as Elven Leafblade, Elven Thornblade, Elven Curve Blade, and Elven Branch Spear).

Racial weapon groups tend to be much smaller than most Fighter weapon groups but are also far more diverse. The above includes ranged weapons, light blades (that aren't listed in the Light Blades group, BTW), a heavy blade, and a spear. That diversity has a lot to do with them not being adopted in many places, and I am FINE with such a group not being available. But if you don't ask, you'll never be told "yes," right?

As an example of how this might NOT lead straight to the cheese you're probably thinking of, several of the EitR Archery Feats I plan to take specifically require Weapon Focus (bows), so tripling up (Weapon Focus, Weapon Training, Finesse Training) can't happen as early as you might expect (and can only happen for melee weapons, anyway), though doubling up obviously will as it is intended to for Fighters.

I received a PM asking me to come back and be explicit. I came back, scanned through the messages, and found the call remarkably easy.

We had a player agree that the point of the game is for everyone to have fun, for everyone to enjoy themselves, who then stated clearly that despite this there is no responsibility on that player to do anything other than what that player feels is right for their character. Ever.

As for enabling said player, there were multiple times when I would come home from work, check the forums, and he had made multiple action posts, all already resolved by the GM, during the day. He was having his selfish play promoted and supported before anyone could offer alternate paths or complain.

As another aspect of empowering the player, the GM has chosen to semi-solo them in a way that he explicitly said we would likely interact with that character again over time, and in a way that potentially prevents us from properly advancing the plot without said character.

Yes, I see nothing here that looks like it will be fun and entertaining for me. I hope I'm wrong, and that you all manage to have a rip-roaring good time, but I'm done. I have negative reasons to keep myself in a place where I can expect to see this uncooperative, selfish style of play dropped in my face again, and I certainly have no reason to look forward to working through a plot which won't complete without that play.

I do hope you can enjoy yourselves, because that's the whole point. But I'm done.

Yep. Done. Good riddance.

Edit: Extraolation.

I've given ground every day I've played this game to try to let you enjoy it. Now you not only refuse to acknowledge the cost you've imposed on others, but you also refuse to bear any of the burden.

You're a selfish child with whom I am no longer willing to waste any time trying to interact.

And the GM has empowered you every step of the way.

I don't care what YOU can justify, or how you define our character's thought.

This is NOT Zarque's story. It is the GROUP's story.

DarkLightHitomi is not writing fiction that goes the way he wants it to go.
We're all supposed to be working together to write a story that doesn't go quite the way any of us want or expect.

One of the few hard and fast rules of table-top-role-play gaming is that it is about working for EVERYONE involved to have FUN. For everyone involved to enjoy the experience.

No one player should ever dominate any aspect of the game, because it violates that rule.

I don't have a 1st Ed PF book at hand, but my 2nd Ed book is right here. Page 7. Sidebar. "The First Rule", final sentence: "The true goal of Pathfinder is for everyone to enjoy themselves."

Everyone. Not me regardless of the how others feel about it.

I clearly stated an opinion, and then you ignored the previously stated opinion in order to manipulate the vote to your advantage. Part of the behavior I was mentioning.

I don't enjoy actually arguing while playing a game whose design includes the assumption that we are cooperating.

---

And I'm not talking about Zarque being a showboat. I'm talking about the player being a showboat. When you have to be the one who goes to solve everything, you actually stop other players from doing what they designed their characters to do. Sil's not designed to do much, so low direct impact, but you never stop stealing the spotlight from other players.

That's not cooperative story-telling. Not even close.

Nobody but Zarque wanted Zarque to have the staff.

Telling us that you don't care what we want is just a perfect example of why nobody trusts the character.

I've come close to walking away from this table because of how you play your character a couple of times. It is directly contradictory to what I'm looking for when I play this game. It is uncooperative, showboating, and disruptive, with no alterations based on the other players disliking the behavior.

The elf just shakes his head as the snake goes through his conspiracies. He shrugs as Khamul provides his version.

"Yes, we're certainly interested enough to keep working to stop whatever the problem really is."

Sil takes the time to scrub himself, and then his gear, and only then will he take the time to eat.

"I don't think we've got much. That big beast was behind the wall, right? Already covered that. Yeah, check with the sheriff and Quink. I've got nothing better."

Yeah, he's got Fey sight, but no meaningful skills to leverage it with! Still useful.

"Another skulker? Yu would think a burg this size had used up their allotment by now, wouldn't you?"

"Night's rest? I'm thinking a hot bath and scrub, with some serious time cleaning my gear!"

"So, yes, this thing has been killing. No, stopping this thing doesn't solve the problem. But there's nothing other than a funny voice suggesting possession or control to go by for finding the boss. A funny voice that tried to recruit us."

The elf laughs. "Yeah, I think I've heard more than enough of THIS drivel. Gag time? It feels like gag time."

Time relaxing with family is too rare to ignore or avoid. Enjoy the trip.

As far as my wife's health goes, this is like surgery 26 or so. Her recovery after the knee replacement and after her heart valve replacement were both far more stressful than this has been! <wink>

I appreciate the well wishes, but this is just a normal part of life with her.

And her medical is the primary reason I stayed active duty US military long enough to retire. Now, we have arguably the best health care insurance available in the US today. (Medicare hospitalization [Part B?] with the military TriCare as a supplement.) Gaining permanent access to TriCare only cost me 20 years of my life. As a consequence of that cost I get a little salty when people call it an unearned benefit . . .. And, yes, we have to pay the same MediCare premiums as everyone else.

Sorry, wife had surgery today. Last night was getting things ready. Today we spent roughly 15 hours out of the house so she could spend roughly 3 hours on the table. Looks like everything is good. They drilled bone out of her sinuses (making the two above her eyebrows into one big sinus, for example) and scraped a lot of infected tissue and debris out of her sinuses as well. Mostly, the point is to reduce the discomfort later. Reduce the number and severity of sinus infections, for example.

Sil, seeing an opportunity, returns to form, not considering how little success he had been having using both weapons . . ..

Thornblade TWF vs prone, w/ risk: 3d6 + 6 + 4 - 2 ⇒ (3, 2, 1) + 6 + 4 - 2 = 14 Really? Really?
Piercing: 1d6 + 2 ⇒ (5) + 2 = 7
Leafblade TWF vs prone, w/ risk: 3d6 + 6 + 4 - 2 ⇒ (6, 5, 4) + 6 + 4 - 2 = 23 Well, this one's a threat, apparently.
Piercing: 1d4 + 2 ⇒ (2) + 2 = 4

Followed the examples of my peers and did NOT include his dex loss in my calculations this time.

Leafblade TWF confirm vs prone, w/ risk: 3d6 + 6 + 4 + 4 - 2 ⇒ (6, 4, 6) + 6 + 4 + 4 - 2 = 28 That +4 to confirm from the weapon makes that improvement by 1 on the die roll look much, much bigger.
Piercing: 1d4 + 2 ⇒ (1) + 2 = 3 7 points total on the confirmation.

Guess going with both attacks was a good choice, since the first one was so bad.

Well, THIS should be easier!

Thornblade AoO vs prone, grappled, w/ risk: 3d6 + 8 + 4 + 2 - 2 ⇒ (3, 2, 6) + 8 + 4 + 2 - 2 = 23
Piercing: 1d6 + 2 ⇒ (5) + 2 = 7

As the opponent starts to leap, Sil lets out a low curse, moving to stab at him even as Grenz grabs him, dragging him to the ground, where he provides a much simpler target.

Well, both the 22 and the 23 are better than we were missing with earlier!

If not already flanking with Grenz, Sil steps a little further around the opponent to get there before attempting, again, to cut into his form . . ..

Elven Thornblade w/ Flank: 3d6 + 6 + 2 ⇒ (3, 4, 5) + 6 + 2 = 20
Piercing: 1d6 + 2 ⇒ (1) + 2 = 3
Elven Leafblade w/ Flank: 3d6 + 6 + 2 ⇒ (2, 6, 3) + 6 + 2 = 19
Slashing: 1d4 + 1 ⇒ (2) + 1 = 3

20's have been missing all day.

I even told myself to include the defense rolls, and then didn't.

Defense 1: 3d6 + 8 ⇒ (2, 2, 5) + 8 = 17
Defense 2: 3d6 + 8 ⇒ (6, 4, 3) + 8 = 21
Defense 3: 3d6 + 8 ⇒ (4, 4, 5) + 8 = 21

So, he takes the war razor hit. Would need a 16 on the 3d6 to avoid it. Given the alternate rules set, +13 is basically an auto-hit.

One long weekend and taking 3 generations to the Ren Faire later . . ..

Sil steps slightly around the opponent, trying to set-up a flank. "You're mouth is almost as bad as hers." Sil makes no physical indication who he might be talking about, as his hands are busy trying to cut into this thing.

Elven Thornblade: 3d6 + 6 ⇒ (6, 1, 2) + 6 = 15 Flank of 17 - Miss
Piercing: 1d6 + 2 ⇒ (1) + 2 = 3
Elven Leafblade: 3d6 + 6 ⇒ (5, 6, 2) + 6 = 19 Flank of 21 - Unknown
Slashing: 1d4 + 1 ⇒ (2) + 1 = 3

Well, if Grenz's 20 missed, I don't have much of a chance, really.
Even dropping back to attacking primary weapon only, I would need a 13 to beat the 20.

The elf closes with the opponent, his stomach lurching as he moves.

Fort DC19: 3d6 + 6 ⇒ (4, 3, 6) + 6 = 19

Somehow, he manages to maintain his focus despite the stench, bringing his first blade to bear and attempting to stick the stench in the gut.

I figure there would be enough movement to prevent a full-attack.

Thornblade: 3d6 + 8 ⇒ (1, 4, 4) + 8 = 17
Piercing: 1d6 + 2 ⇒ (2) + 2 = 4

Sorry, this weekend my wife took a trip to see her Momma, but didn't tell me until Thursday night. Been helping with the grandkids, what she normally does.

initiative: 3d6 + 6 ⇒ (3, 6, 6) + 6 = 21

The elf stands ready, blades out.

"Missing? I think that's much more significant, and more likely to represent the puzzle's solution. I wonder whose truth they have in mind, though."

"Anyone know what the Thassilonian word for zodiac was? Or oracle? Or teller of fortunes?"

"The beast could have fallen through the hole above, for all we know. I do know I have no interest in waiting for the dissection. Anymore of the tunnels we should be checking, or is it time to report back and get a bath?"

He frowns as he turns to look at whatever the halfling might be pointing out. If he sees any auras, he'll share the information honestly.

The elf makes an ugly face as he starts trying to scrape the gore off his clothes, armor, and weapons. "That's just nasty. This is going to take forever to clean up!"

Fort DC 16: 3d6 + 6 ⇒ (2, 1, 5) + 6 = 14 Heh.

Sil slips around the corner, setting himself and Grenz up to have an easier time dividing this thing's attention, before he unleashes upon it.

5' step into flank

Primary Thornblade w/ Haste & Flank: 3d6 + 6 + 1 + 2 ⇒ (2, 6, 4) + 6 + 1 + 2 = 21
Slashing: 1d6 + 2 ⇒ (3) + 2 = 5

Secondary Leafblade w/ Haste & Flank: 3d6 + 6 + 1 + 2 ⇒ (5, 4, 3) + 6 + 1 + 2 = 21
Slashing: 1d4 + 1 ⇒ (2) + 1 = 3

Haste Bonus Thornblade w/ Haste & Flank: 3d6 + 6 + 1 + 2 ⇒ (1, 1, 1) + 6 + 1 + 2 = 12
Slashing: 1d6 + 2 ⇒ (6) + 2 = 8

WOW! 12, 12, _3_

Defense 1 w/ Full Attack & Haste: 3d6 + 7 + 1 + 1 ⇒ (6, 4, 1) + 7 + 1 + 1 = 20
Defense 2 w/ Full Attack & Haste: 3d6 + 7 + 1 + 1 ⇒ (2, 3, 6) + 7 + 1 + 1 = 20
Defense 3 w/ Full Attack & Haste: 3d6 + 7 + 1 + 1 ⇒ (6, 3, 3) + 7 + 1 + 1 = 21

2nd Round (of 4) of Haste used.

Cool. Thank you! I know Grenz goes before, but . . . I'm online right now.

Sileven's eyes go a little wide as Idun gives him a touch of magic, but he smiles as he moves forward to attack their foe.

Thornbalde /w Haste: 3d6 + 8 + 1 ⇒ (4, 4, 3) + 8 + 1 = 20
S: 1d6 + 2 ⇒ (6) + 2 = 8

I'm guessing at least a 3 attack set, so I'm going to provide 3 defense rolls
Defense w/ Haste: 3d6 + 7 + 1 ⇒ (4, 6, 5) + 7 + 1 = 23
Defense w/ Haste: 3d6 + 7 + 1 ⇒ (4, 6, 4) + 7 + 1 = 22
Defense w/ Haste: 3d6 + 7 + 1 ⇒ (5, 6, 1) + 7 + 1 = 20

Init: 3d6 + 6 ⇒ (2, 5, 6) + 6 = 19

"Okay, let's do that." Sil goes to sneak up.
Stealth w/ encumbrance: 3d6 + 4 - 3 ⇒ (2, 2, 4) + 4 - 3 = 9

No knowledge check to make, here.

As the message is delivered, Sil just shrugs. "I thought that was part of why he went scouting. To tell us how to prepare?"

Keeping his blades ready, Sil moves with the others, watching and waiting for the opposition they seek.

Perception: 3d6 + 7 ⇒ (2, 5, 4) + 7 = 18

Displeased with the idea of giving up on the whole reason we are here, currently. Agree that leaving part of the group here would be really, really stupid.

"Maybe. Problem is, do we attack a merchant caravan just to find out if a murderer trying to hide a body was lying to us or not?"

"He's in a forgiving mood right now, it seems." The elf indicates Grenz as he talks. "I'm surprised he's letting you walk away. Ever."

You mistake character observation for player perception.

Sil tries to look disinterested through all of this, instead of responding to this grisly show and discussion. These men are murderers and thieves, supporting the growth of a dark power for short-term, personal gain. We don't seem to know any more after this discussion than we did before, unless we want to become thieves ourselves.

The elf starts to out his face in his hands, but thinks better of it and simply watches the bad guys, waiting for somebody to start a refusal to cooperate.

The elf glares at the halfling. "Sure, BOSS."

"Something magical under there." Sil points as they look about the room.

Whose left, then?

Map shows going past the dead body, or the path we hadn't even started, yet. I figure we're going for the one we haven't started, yet, as we seem to have decided not to follow the other for now.

I think I prefer said option: bot those who have not responded and allow the exploration to continue.

Handling the rest of the exploration with a descriptive exposition should be easy, and quicker, but it just reinforces a lack of player involvement in the story.

Fortitude DC 10: 3d6 + 6 ⇒ (6, 5, 1) + 6 = 18

"That's okay. None of us thought to stop you, either." The Elf tries to console her as they clear the tunnel.

"HOPEFULLY, that's done either way. Which way next? Deeper here?" as he points away form the main intersection.

Yep, sounds like what was stated.

"And now it is taunting us . . .." He sighs.

Sil will go look, but not touch, to see if he can read the taunting note he expects to find.