The problem I have with batman and this short of comic book characters in general is that their powers and abilities aren't really consistent. When being with his JLA friends batman becomes essentially superhuman but when ambushed from some thugs in gotham he actually faces the danger of getting knocked out. Contrary to that dnd pc's are pretty consistent in what they can do.
Another option could be to say they only get their level bonuses above 6th level to attack, ac and saves if they have an appropriate armor or weapon. You could say only if the have at least a +4 armor or weapon can they enjoy the full 20th level bonus. Though this makes them more dependant on their equipement, its also essentially makes them awesome human beings that can perform godlike tasks only because of the excellence with which they use their powerful magic items.
Maybe if you have a witch or sth? I haven't experimeted that much with running multiple scenarios for level 1 pc's. I remember a kind of chance encounter with a barghest causing huge problems for 1st level party of 4 and it wasn't like the barghest was especially lucky or that the fighter didn't have magic weapon oil. Even a giant phantom armor could end up being really dangerous at these levels. As for CR 6 I am really having trouble imagining a mudlord losing from a 1st level party.
John Lynch 106 wrote:
The issue with that is the +level to everything requires everyone to be at least at the batman level. If you want to play a different character (such as someone who has more weaknesses) you're out of luck/stuck at low level/forced to not roll dice for certain checks/have to create houserules in PF2e. That's a problem for people who don't want to always play Batman or better.
I actually agree with you, but I also understand why Paizo is doing this.The way I see you have two conflicting interests. One is allowing you to make the character you exactly want and the other is making the game fun and playable. There is no right and wrong here. Paizo decided to go the batman-basic-competence-at-everything route for playability and adventure design reasons and personally I understand their decision.
Also now can easily play the typical sword and sorcery hero, who is good at everything, which in former editions wasn't that easy and for some classes impossible.
For me ultimately, only playing the game multiple times, will allow me to decide if Paizos decision was a smart one.
I didn't say so in my post, but that's also kinda weird to me. I can see it maybe working if they need less than 3 action to do certain things, like full attacking for example.But yeah them having 1 less action because they are minions, I could see this being the case for creatures who are dominated or even charmed or even controlled undead, but what difference has an animal companion vs a normal animal to the point one can take 2 action and the other 3.
Or maybe being immune to death effects means you are immune to energy drain?
Heh its funny I find myself calculating its racial bonuses to saving throws. They are +5 fortitude, +4 reflex, +9 will. Pretty obvious the are trying to make up for the differences in his abilities.
Also its interesting that now the enervated is permanent of a critical failure, I think stuff like that will make people really care about their rolls. (Which is a good thing as far as I am concerned).
Fargoth's Hiding Place wrote:
I think it just that its the most direct way to say that a +1 multiplies the base weapon damage.
Fargoth's Hiding Place wrote:
It may be pavlovian but my experience is that the possibility of extreme results actually keeps the players engaged, its a balancing act really make it too swingy and it looses its tactical interest make it not swingy enough and it becomes like chess.Unfortunately having never actually used a gunslinger in my games I have no say on that specific point.
gustavo iglesias wrote:
To be fair high level characters with the high level magic items are equivalent to high level monsters.
I don't think the example with grey mouser is supposed to stack levels its basically adnd multiclassing so that character was sth like level 18 in adnd(which is even less in pathfinder).
Also there is a difference between tolkien Balor and dnd Balor. As there is a difference between adnd balor and pathfinder balor. In any case the tolkien balor can't cast greater teleport or cast implosion and proprable could be assigned an ac lower than 36.
But in any case, semantics aside the main point of your post stands. Fafhrd wouldn't be able to deal with a pathfinder balor head on.
Wow i was going to respond to thflame that arm wrestling is propably just a strength check and actually strength is weird ability and many times the results shouldn't even be random. Like a 20 strength dude should just win vs a 10 strength dude.My houserule in 3.5 and pathfinder was to double the ability modifier in ability checks.
Out of seer curiousty what tricks can you pull in an arm wrestling match?
I was always a believer in monsters following the same rules as pc's and I disliked 4th editions treatment of the matter.
What path does PF 2.0 seem to be following?
Count me in against encounter powers, though I don't see stances as encounter powers. They should last as long as a fighter holds them and require some kind of effort.
Mandatory feats for monsters or better said for racial hd (vs class hd) has been one of the worst ideas for 3.5. 3.0 had no feats for monsters. I think I mentioned this in two different threads of old.
I am all about monsters following the rules that make sense. The absence of feats can be rationalized as the difference between hd that have a racial source and hd that have a class source.
It seems we have different ideas of what the "problem" is.
I think the problem is the bookkeeping of managing the spellslots and writing down what spell you have memorized for each slot. Spontaneous casters just need to know the spells they know and the slots, so there is much less bookkeeping. Having less slots mitigates that.
My guess is you think the problem is, vancian spellcasting not being effective because you memorized spells that ended up being useless or spent all the same slots memorizing a spell you believe will most likely be useful, but that ends up being repetitive.
The thing is your problem is also a feature since it promotes resource management and making/guessing the right choice.
I like Vancian spellcasting too, but isn't arcanist also Vancian? From what I know about Vance's books arcanist spellcasting is a closer fit. Or not? (I am not sure)
I guess they are going away because having straight up bonuses to your attack, saves and ac is hust too useful to pass up. In 3rd edition the dm was forced to grant such items to keep players able to numerically keep up with the monsters.
If you do away with this you can have items that grant you choices or different tactics or allow for different approaches and strategies and still be prefered over the straight up bigger bonuses stuff. Having more choices and cool power is fun or at least more fun than having big bonuses on your stat (unless those bonuses actually mean sth).
This actually makes it easier that more than a small pool of items will see use, it doesn't make it a certainty and I am sure there will be some ones that are prefered, but there is a difference between a "no brainer" and "slightly more useful".
First of all sorry for not replying, I got a cold and have been sick for 4 days now.
Yeah, I too have found it very enjoyable in a game to roll random treasure, it really is something people need to experience to understand. The great thing is, that it seems it will be much easier to do this in this edition.Your 1/3 spread is in pathfinder 1.0? As an asidde would you use automatic bonuses and then roll the treasure randomly?
It does seem that the big six are almost gone. Recently it has been said the cloak of resistance and ring of protection won't be in the core, propably.
Yeah I searched for the quote but coudn't find it.
I guess this means even low level spells have a chance at success now. I am inclined to believe this is a good thing.
I know I am making A LOT of assumptions, but as an example:
My first impression was " It's 4th edition you gain your level or half your level to everything, bleh not for me"
So this is the last part of my tough monster posts.
Pixie CR4 between its stealth +16, constant invisibility and range its really hard to even know the direction of its charm monster, sleep or memory loss attacks. So glitterdusting it, will be problematic and see invisibility will be the better solution and despite it having dispel magic 1/day at caster level 8 it has no spellcraft to know what you casted. Ofcourse it still flies, has dr 10 cold iron, sr 15 and can cast shield for an ac of 22. Its also has entangle and persisten image 1/day. The balancing factor is that it has 18 hp. (Also see the will o wisp.)
Purple worm CR 12 I would actually claim this is perfect for its CR. Its countered with freedom of movement and a delay poison. Its poison needs 3 consecutive saves but a person with +14 fortitude save will take an average of 7,5 strength damage during the 6 rounds, so its not that impressive.
Raksasha CR 10 mentioned only for its use as a spy manipulator. Its has dr 15/piercing and good, sr 25 and can cast mage armor and shield. Offensively its really really weak. However its not supposed to fight the pc's, its supposed to use its +24 disguise, +20 bluff, +18 stealth, change shape and supernatural free action fast detect thoughts to gain as much info on the pc's as possible for the big bad. In that role its very good.
Remorharz CR 7 Has burrow, tremorsense 60 ft and perception +16. I assume its bite deals no fire damage since it isn't included in statblock and the description specifically states “contact with its body”. +2 one handed weapons can withstand 5-6 hits which should be enough. Its impressively immune to both fire and cold. Getting bitten grabbed and then swallowed whole can deal a total of 63,5 damage vs non fire resistant opponents. The fact that it makes animal companions, shapeshifted druids and monks cry catapults it to tough monster category. It has int 5 so it can understand stuff.
Rertriever CR 11 +7 initiative, fast healing 5, construct traits, 50 ft speed, 5 attacks at +19 and a 6th +16 touch attack each round that can deal 12d6 (or 6d6) elemental damage or petrify, dc 19. It has to use a different ray each round. It also has discern location at will and is under the constant effects of spider climb and water walk.
Rhinoceros, Wooly CR 6 pretty good trample(2d6+13, dc 23) and diehard. Still not very impressive, but I think its worth mentioning.
Rust Monster CR 3 mostly annoying since it can relatively easily destroy treasure
Satyr CR 4 Main feature is his 60 ft aoe suggestion for a dc 18. If you save you cannot be targeted again. Then he can cast fear at dc 18. Also has suggestion at will (dc 17). Has +18 perception and +17 stealth. DR 5/cold iron. Again its all balanced by his abysmal full attack.
Sea serpent CR 12 Oh my a higher cr behir. Again it attacks (with its 20ft reach), hits, grabs and constricts. Next round it rolls it +35 grapple, deals bite and constrict damage and then swallows whole. If only its bite hits it totals an average of 153 damage(with swallow whole damage). All of this is stopped by freedom of movement, but then again at this level the whole party wont be protected. Has immunity to cold, fire resistance 30 and a weird ability that allows it to run 300 ft in water and gain a +40 on its stealth check.
Shadow CR 3 A swarm of shadows is a typical party killer. Their touch attacks deal str damage without any save, as you level your hp increase faster than your strength or touch ac. A cleric can kill them with channel energy and protect people with death ward. It also has perception and stealth +8.
Shark dire CR 9 20 ft reach bite +17 (4d10+15/19-20), grabs at +29, has critical focus, bleeding critical and swallows whole. Perception +25, keen scent and blindsense 30ft.
Spectre CR 7 not as bad as the shadows or wraiths in my opinion but generally dangerous for the same reasons.
Stirge CR ½ Especially good in being annoying. Has a +7 touch attack and if it hits it deals 1 con damage in the end of the round. Easy to kill and escape from, but they will leave the party constitution lower than normal. Even at 3rd level where lesser restoration is available 8 stirges could put a serious dent in the partys resources.
Tiger/Dire tiger CR 4/8 it pounces, grabs and rakes. Also has respectable stealth in tall grass.
Treant CR 8 seems average but has some interesting and tactics. It can create two new treants albeit with only 1 slam attack and 10ft move. It can also sunder stuff very effectively as can its other treants. I can imagine a situation where if its brought to less than half its hp it can start using full defense while making the other treants inflict the broken condition to the partys weapons (not destroying them though).
Wasp swarm CR 3 A flying swarm.
Wight CR 3 Has very high perception(+11) and stealth(+16!). I don't see how they get to such high stealth. It can deal 1 negative level per slam and anything it kills becomes its spawn. Still it barely belongs in this list since its slam attack is only +4 (1d4+1).
Will o wisp CR 6 Natural invisibility, immunity to magic, flight, ranged attack and +25 stealth makes them almost impossible to deal with. However their fluff suggests other wise. “Will-o'- wisps only use their electric shock ability under extreme duress, preferring to let other creatures or hazards claim their victims while they float nearby and feast." So it seems their main stick is luring travelers to natural (or unatural) hazards, so they can feed from their fear.
Wraith CR 5 Like the shadow or the spectre its an incorporeal creature whose touch attacks target a resource other than hp. Unlike the shadow or the spectre it allows a save and deathward doesn't stop it. However since it deals con drain the fortitude save to resist it becomes ever smaller and since it deals a little damage you can actually drop from hp loss.
Yeth Hound CR 3 high initiative, perception and stealth. Its 300 radius dc 12 bay causes people to become panicked. Its bite attack is solid and alsocan cause the shaken condition(or cower people if they are already panicked). To top it off it has dr 5/silver.
Zombie, Human CR ½ Has dr and 12 hp. The fast variety is scarier.
Things I didn't include:
Erinyes already many devils and unholy blight and 1 person fear didn't impress me much.
Dretch already many demons, it might be worth mentioning for being able to cast stinking cloud.
Shadow demon. I guess I should have included it since its really hard to deal with and it will reliably deal 22 damage per round.
Medusa she can disguise and trick the party into not averting their eyes, but even so her disguise modifier isn't that big compared to the party's. She can also use full defense but her ac will still be low.
I also didn't include templates, since they have to be evaluated in a case by case basis (made a small exception fro zombies for no reason :P).
My picks for MMI for monsters strong for their cr. I reached B and also did dragons.
Aboleth CR 7 with project image at will, programmed image at will, and a dc 22 dominate monster.
Angel, Planetar CR16 true seeing, perception +27, regen 10 (evil), at will invisibility, stealth +20, spell like abilities like dispel magic, blade barrier, flame strike, power word stun, waves of fatigue and 1 per day waves of exhaustion. level 16 cleric with holy word, greater dispel magic, heal, righteous might, death ward, wind wall, shield of faith.
Archon, Trumpet cr14, stealth +20, 10/evil, 14 level cleric with notables like heal, divine power and shield of faith
Assassin vine CR 3 Grab, Constrict, needs a 20 perception check to notice it and has free action entangle.
Azata, Bralani CR 6 perception +15, stealth +14, dr 10/cold iron or evil,sr, weak attacks, at will blur and mirror image, 2/day lightning bolt and cure serious
Azata, Ghaele CR 13 see invisibility, stealth +17, greater! invisibility at will, dr 10/cold iron and evil, holy aura, at will dispel magic, major image and cure light, no power attack!, CR 13 cleric with holy word, heal, flame strike, death ward, divine power, divine favor.
Basilisk CR 5 dc 15 flesh to stone gaze, perception/stealth +10, thankfully it has int 2, initiative -1 and you can use its flesh to unpetrify companions.
Bat swarm your introduction to the most annoying type of monster
Bebilith CR 10 dr 10 good, huge creature with +16 stealth, can easily players armor, has web, intelligent and inflicts one of the worst rot effects in the game. DC 23 fortitude save, needs two saves to remove, last for 5 rounds and deals 2 con damage on each fail. Perhaps balanced by roleplay since its made to hunt demons and like to chew on demon flesh.
Behir CR 8 can easily charge bite, grab and constrict for 32 damage. In the 2nd round it can easily deal 34 damage after swallowing whole the target.
Dragons all of them have high numbers and some stat blocks have good spell picks. Notable among them.
Ancient Black Dragon has acid pool which could mean 40d6 damage on the whole party. Has heroism and mage armor
Blue dragon great wyrms get Sandstorm, which IF remains centered on the dragon can be a tactical nightmare for even optimized parties. Visibility is 5-50 feet, a range smaller than what the dragons spells and breath weapon need to function. Damage per round is 2d6 which is annoying for everything withour dr, range is 1200 feet and the ability has infinite amount of uses and 1 hour duration.
Ancient white dragon maybe not worth mentioning but his heavy snow conditions forces the party to fly and also poses a problem of dealing with a 50 ft fog like area in which the dragon can see.
Young brass dragon just for his annoying sleep breath.
Young copper dragon slow breath for enough rounds to last the whole combat, uncanny dodge and grease at will.
Ancient gold dragon his breath weapon s strength damage can one shot the party's arcane caster and thief/slayer, while reducing archers and melee fighters dpr. Also has a generally solid spell selection.
Young silver dragon just because of his paralyzing breath. DC 18 is low for CR 10 though.
(I actually created this thread about a week ago but for some reason it was deleted. Did I do sth wrong?)
here is what is wrong:
Toff invites the pc's because he really wants someone to win this tournament while he still is headmaster and at the same time he has stolen sth like 40k from the reward.
and here is
how to fix it:
Personally I think it would make more sense for him to agree with the pc's before hand for them to accept 90k as a reward so that the next headmaster won't know his covert dealings.
In 3rd+ edition there are several problems with dnd's fantasy economy. I think older editions never bothered enough to have problems with it, it was just stuff happens make sense of it.
I any case the problems are:
So magic items are weird in that they have arbitrary set prices AND in that they have arbitrary set cost AND in that people buy them only at half price AND in that the people interested in them are beyond the normal world.
In any case the only two reasons for magic items to cost gold are so that adventurers have something to do with the gold they find plus incentive to find it (that' s tradition) and the fact that baldurs gate had items which costed gold.
To answer the original post. Money is never an end to itself, adventurers don't have more money than their locality because no commoner or even noble would want a +5 sword in his hands, and their is no money or amount of magic items they should have, wealth by level is drawn from encounters and monsters also are under not deific law to each have its challenge ratings treasure.
All that doesn't annoy me because the whole game is an abstraction. A realistic economy, no scrap that, a realistic world doesn't work like that.
Creating a functional banlist is pretty time consuming. I have one in 3.5 combined with some small houserules.
I have't played and researched pathfinder enough to create a good banlist. This is what I have so far. Most of it is subject to change and beyond that, it has relative not absolute power. If somebody has a concept he really loves and is ready to work with me bans may be ignored.
its utterly broken, maybe a rule that allows you to have created a specific amount of gp=>items depending on your WBL, with the in game reason that creating a magic item is an art form and a person can't have infinite inspiration.
Advanced Players Guide
Empyreal and Sage wildblooded bloodlines
Antagonize (unsure about wether the errata fixed it)
Snap shot line*
Litany of Righteousness
Double barrled pistol (maybe)
Falcatas threat range never increases (so no improved critical etc.)
*Archery stuff, I am undecided about the power of archery in pathfinder. I prolly would like to see it in my games before deciding what to do with it.
Also I haven't looked carefully at the spells, so I might have missed many gems there.
Note that I do have a few houserules to go with this ban list. So things might be different than one would expect.
Optimization and roleplay are not mutually exclusive, but neither are they totally unrelated.
You generally choose which one you wish to lead with.
Lets say person A wishes to play a elven fey bloodline sorcerer. He finds out that half-elves get an awesome favored class bonus while elves don't, so he decides to change his race to half-elf.
Now person A1 during the game roleplays his half elven pc awesomely, gets totally in character and is great fun to have at the table. He reads half elven rp advice on the net and applies in the game any ideas he finds internet. Ofcourse what he really wanted to play was an elf so not everything flows perfectly, but still he is grea fun to have around. Not to mention he seems to have all these spells handy.
Person B1 on the other hand roleplays his character awesomely and because he does what he really wanted is actually better at it than person A1. That said he doesn't like being a push over, so he reads some guides in the net about which spells and feats are good to choose from. He goes with what fits his pc concept and easily pulls his weight in the game.
On the other side person A2 doesn't care about how his pc views the world. He cares about winning. Gaining levels as fast and as easy as possible, minimizing his chance to die and squashing the oposition. His decisions depend only on what gives him the biggest advantage in game. He may even craft his roleplaying story to eliminate any chance of being "forced" to do stuff that put him at a tactical disadvantage, so he has no siblings or parents or anything. If someone tells him that his pc is too powerful he may say that he wont use his awesome power but only in times of Great Need or that he could totally have made something soooo much worse. He changes his bloodline to arcane(sage) and his race to human. He tries to get his hands on dazing and persistent metamagic rods as quickly as possible.
Similarly person B2 is pretty fun to have around until at somepoint he decides that he wants to be able to wield a greatsword, because its cool. So he grabs a level in fighter. At another point he wants to be able to be more sneaky so he gets a level of rogue. He imagines himself as a very subtle charismatic type of dude so as his first level 2 spell he gets detect thoughts, because what's better than knowing what other people are thinking? Knowledge is power after all. With a sorcerer4/thief1/fighter1 party member who casts detect thoughts, the teams resident straight up fighter dies against a hard encounter, hoping that next time he will play with a sorcerer who casts haste.
I don't think anyone will have a problem with 1s and I do think almost everyone will have a problem with 2s.
So to sum up, most likely you will have to choose with which, optimization or roleplay, you will lead with, and at which point you will stop catering to them. But that doesn't mean you can't be good at both.
Me? I always lead with optimization, I try to roleplay and never metagame as much as I can and see, when I am going too far with a build.
As you said Euphoric tranquility requires a melee touch attack so its not that terrible, it actually reminds me of 3,5 Irresistable Dance. All in all a very powerful spell, borderline broken.
Regarding Cold ice strike, IMO damage dealing spells like fireball and cone of cold aren't worth it. Cold ice strike is a good spell but nothing more. Dealing 15d6 damage with a 6th level slot as a swift action at level 15 (how much damage does a fighter deal at that level?) is certainly nice but not broken.
As a master of many styles I would aim for crane style, tiger style and snake style.
Crane style is awesome for survival.
Tiger style gives you slashing damage, a great full attack action that combines well (which you lack because you don't have flurry of blows) and the ability to become take the power attack penalty to your ac(which is great since high to hit roll synergizes great with increasd damage).
Snake style gives you piercing damage and the ability to dodge ranged attacks relaibly. (Especially ranged touch attacks)The rest of its benefit are solid too.
After these dragon style increases your damage a bit but the intimidate effect is rather meh.
Mantis styles is good to take without its follow up feats for the +2 dc to stunning fist increase.
A sample progression:
1st Stunning fist, Unarmed strike, Crane style, Weapon focus(unarmed srike), Power attack
I am not sure but boar style and dragon style might combine nicely for fear inducing tactics