This happened in our last PFS game and we still haven't decided on how to handle the situation for Saturday's game. Our silly rogue with a climb speed went over a wall and ended up engaging with some wights while we walked around. He died... dummy.
Here is the thing - he got turned into a wight. We killed the baddies (including our turned wight friend) and now we don't know if we can bring him back. He has enough fame (54 fame) to purchase a Resurrection Plan.
Resurrection Plan: :
The Pathfinder Society is invested in keeping its most successful agents in the field. You can purchase a resurrection ritual for 25 Fame. If you are in a rush to return to life and cannot wait the day for this ritual to be conducted, you can instead purchase a casting of the raise dead spell for 50 Fame.
But can you resurrect him? Resurrection ritual requires "the target’s body to be present and relatively intact" unless it's heightened to at least 7th level (9th level with no body at all). The fame reward does not give a level. It is assumed, but not explicitly stated, that if you use this on an 11th level character it is heightened to 6th. Raise Dead has similar language but can't be heightened to perform without a body.
Resurrection Ritual: :
Source Core Rulebook pg. 415
PFS Note All characters have access to resurrect
Cast 1 day; Cost diamonds worth a total value of 75 gp × the target’s level; Secondary Casters 2
Primary Check Religion (expert); Secondary Checks Medicine, Society
Range 10 feet; Target(s) 1 dead creature of up to 10th level
You attempt to call forth the target’s soul and return it to its body. This requires the target’s body to be present and relatively intact. The target must have died within the past year. If Pharasma has decided that the target’s time has come or the target doesn’t wish to return, this ritual automatically fails, but you discover this after the successful Religion check and can end the ritual without paying the cost.
Critical Success You resurrect the target. They return to life with full Hit Points and the same spells prepared and points in their pools they had when they died, and still suffering from any long-term debilitations of the old body. The target meets an agent of their deity during the resurrection who inspires them, granting them a +1 status bonus to attack rolls, Perception, saving throws, and skill checks for 1 week. The target is also permanently changed in some way by their time in the afterlife, such as gaining a slight personality shift, a streak of white in the hair, or a strange new birthmark.
Success As critical success, except the target returns to life with 1 Hit Point and no spells prepared or points in any pools, and still is affected by any long-term debilitations of the old body. Instead of inspiring them, the character’s time in the Boneyard has left them temporarily debilitated. The target is clumsy 1, drained 1, and enfeebled 1 for 1 week; these conditions can’t be removed or reduced by any means until the week has passed.
Failure Your attempt is unsuccessful.
Critical Failure Something goes horribly wrong—an evil spirit possesses the body, the body transforms into a special kind of undead, or some worse fate befalls the target.
Heightened (6th) You can resurrect a target of up to 12th level, and the base cost is 125 gp.
Heightened (7th) You can use resurrect even with only a small portion of the body; the ritual creates a new body on a success or critical success. The target must have died within the past decade. The ritual requires four secondary casters, each of whom must be at least half the target’s level. The target can be up to 14th level, and the base cost is 200 gp.
Heightened (8th) As 7th level, but the target can be up to 16th level and the base cost is 300 gp.
Heightened (9th) You can use resurrect even without the body as long as you know the target’s name and have touched a portion of its body at any time. The target must have died within the past century, and it doesn’t gain the negative conditions on a success. The ritual requires eight secondary casters, each of whom must be at least half the target’s level. The target can be up to 18th level, and the base cost is 600 gp.
[/b]Heightened (10th) [/b]As 9th level, except it doesn’t matter how long ago the target died. The ritual requires 16 secondary casters, each of whom must be at least half the target’s level. The target can be up to 20th level, and the ritual’s base cost is 1,000 gp.
Raise Dead: :
Source Core Rulebook pg. 362
PFS Note All characters have access to raise dead
Traditions divine
Cast 10 minutes (material, somatic, verbal); Cost diamonds worth a total value of the target's level (minimum 1) x 200 gp
Range 10 feet; Targets 1 dead creature of 13th level or lower
You attempt to call forth the dead creature's soul, requiring the creature's body to be present and relatively intact. The creature must have died within the past 3 days. If Pharasma has decided that the creature's time has come (at the GM's discretion), or if the creature doesn't wish to return to life, this spell automatically fails, but the diamonds aren't consumed in the casting.
If the spell is successful, the creature returns to life with 1 Hit Point, no spells prepared or spell slots available, no points in any pools or any other daily resources, and still with any long-term debilitations of the old body. The time spent in the Boneyard leaves the target temporarily debilitated, making it clumsy 2, drained 2, and enfeebled 2 for 1 week; these conditions can't be removed or reduced by any means until the week has passed. The creature is also permanently changed by its time in the afterlife, such as a slight personality shift, a streak of white in the hair, or a strange new birthmark.
Heightened (7th) The maximum level of the target increases to 15. The cost increases to the target's level (minimum 1) × 400 gp.
Heightened (8th) The maximum level the target increases to 17. The cost increases to the target's level (minimum 1) × 800 gp.
Heightened (9th) The maximum level of the target increases to 19. The cost increases to the target's level (minimum 1) × 1,600 gp.
Heightened (10th) The maximum level the target increases to 21. The cost increases to the target's level (minimum 1) × 3,200 gp.
Creatures with the undead trait are "destroyed" at 0 Hit Points. Someone argued this just meant they skipped the "dying" stages, but all NPCs do that anyway. The GM concluded that we brought back a pile of his ashes. It also mentions "soul-corrupting evil magics" and both resurrection and raise dead "Attempt to call forth the dead creature's soul". Additionally both state that "Long-Term Debilitation" are not removed. Undeath may or may not be a long-term debilitation.
undead: :
Once living, these creatures were infused after death with negative energy and soul-corrupting evil magic. When reduced to 0 Hit Points, an undead creature is destroyed. Undead creatures are damaged by positive energy, are healed by negative energy, and don’t benefit from healing effects.
So these are the questions all this raises:
* Do we have a body?
* Is undeath a “long-term debilitation” or is his soul too corrupted to res?
* What level is the resurrection ritual heightened to if purchase with fame?
We really like to go by RAW or official clarifications as much as possible. Since it's PFS reducing table variation is pretty important. But there is enough ambiguity there opinion is still a factor – I’d just like to avoid focusing on subjective trains of thought if possible.
Thanks for reading, and I appreciate any constructive replies!
TL;DR:
PC died and turned into an undead (wight):
Reasons they can't be resurrected
* Undead are destroyed and there is no body
* Undead souls have been corrupted
* Resurrection does not remove long-term debilitations
Reasons they can be resurrected
* Undead being "destroyed" is just flavor text not game mechanics, there is a body
* "Soul Corrupting Magic" and/or "Bringing back a soul" is just flavor text not game mechanics
* Fame reward does not list a level and can be heightened to any required level (for level reasons, or lack of body reasons)
We were playing a Pathfinder Society game this past Saturday. Our silly rogue with a climb speed went over a wall and ended up engaging with some wights while we walked around. He died... dummy.
Here is the thing - he got turned into a wight. We killed the baddies (including our turned wight friend) and now we don't know if we can bring him back. He has enough fame (54 fame) to purchase a Resurrection Plan.
Resurrection Plan:
The Pathfinder Society is invested in keeping its most successful agents in the field. You can purchase a resurrection ritual for 25 Fame. If you are in a rush to return to life and cannot wait the day for this ritual to be conducted, you can instead purchase a casting of the raise dead spell for 50 Fame.
But can you resurrect him? Resurrection ritual requires "the target’s body to be present and relatively intact". Raise Dead says the same thing.
Resurrection Ritual:
Source Core Rulebook pg. 415
PFS Note All characters have access to resurrect
Cast 1 day; Cost diamonds worth a total value of 75 gp × the target’s level; Secondary Casters 2
Primary Check Religion (expert); Secondary Checks Medicine, Society
Range 10 feet; Target(s) 1 dead creature of up to 10th level
You attempt to call forth the target’s soul and return it to its body. This requires the target’s body to be present and relatively intact. The target must have died within the past year. If Pharasma has decided that the target’s time has come or the target doesn’t wish to return, this ritual automatically fails, but you discover this after the successful Religion check and can end the ritual without paying the cost.
Critical Success You resurrect the target. They return to life with full Hit Points and the same spells prepared and points in their pools they had when they died, and still suffering from any long-term debilitations of the old body. The target meets an agent of their deity during the resurrection who inspires them, granting them a +1 status bonus to attack rolls, Perception, saving throws, and skill checks for 1 week. The target is also permanently changed in some way by their time in the afterlife, such as gaining a slight personality shift, a streak of white in the hair, or a strange new birthmark.
Success As critical success, except the target returns to life with 1 Hit Point and no spells prepared or points in any pools, and still is affected by any long-term debilitations of the old body. Instead of inspiring them, the character’s time in the Boneyard has left them temporarily debilitated. The target is clumsy 1, drained 1, and enfeebled 1 for 1 week; these conditions can’t be removed or reduced by any means until the week has passed.
Failure Your attempt is unsuccessful.
Critical Failure Something goes horribly wrong—an evil spirit possesses the body, the body transforms into a special kind of undead, or some worse fate befalls the target.
Heightened (6th) You can resurrect a target of up to 12th level, and the base cost is 125 gp.
Heightened (7th) You can use resurrect even with only a small portion of the body; the ritual creates a new body on a success or critical success. The target must have died within the past decade. The ritual requires four secondary casters, each of whom must be at least half the target’s level. The target can be up to 14th level, and the base cost is 200 gp.
Heightened (8th) As 7th level, but the target can be up to 16th level and the base cost is 300 gp.
Heightened (9th) You can use resurrect even without the body as long as you know the target’s name and have touched a portion of its body at any time. The target must have died within the past century, and it doesn’t gain the negative conditions on a success. The ritual requires eight secondary casters, each of whom must be at least half the target’s level. The target can be up to 18th level, and the base cost is 600 gp.
[/b]Heightened (10th) [/b]As 9th level, except it doesn’t matter how long ago the target died. The ritual requires 16 secondary casters, each of whom must be at least half the target’s level. The target can be up to 20th level, and the ritual’s base cost is 1,000 gp.
Raise Dead:
Source Core Rulebook pg. 362
PFS Note All characters have access to raise dead
Traditions divine
Cast 10 minutes (material, somatic, verbal); Cost diamonds worth a total value of the target's level (minimum 1) x 200 gp
Range 10 feet; Targets 1 dead creature of 13th level or lower
You attempt to call forth the dead creature's soul, requiring the creature's body to be present and relatively intact. The creature must have died within the past 3 days. If Pharasma has decided that the creature's time has come (at the GM's discretion), or if the creature doesn't wish to return to life, this spell automatically fails, but the diamonds aren't consumed in the casting.
If the spell is successful, the creature returns to life with 1 Hit Point, no spells prepared or spell slots available, no points in any pools or any other daily resources, and still with any long-term debilitations of the old body. The time spent in the Boneyard leaves the target temporarily debilitated, making it clumsy 2, drained 2, and enfeebled 2 for 1 week; these conditions can't be removed or reduced by any means until the week has passed. The creature is also permanently changed by its time in the afterlife, such as a slight personality shift, a streak of white in the hair, or a strange new birthmark.
Heightened (7th) The maximum level of the target increases to 15. The cost increases to the target's level (minimum 1) × 400 gp.
Heightened (8th) The maximum level the target increases to 17. The cost increases to the target's level (minimum 1) × 800 gp.
Heightened (9th) The maximum level of the target increases to 19. The cost increases to the target's level (minimum 1) × 1,600 gp.
Heightened (10th) The maximum level the target increases to 21. The cost increases to the target's level (minimum 1) × 3,200 gp.
Creatures with the undead trait are "destroyed" at 0 Hit Points. Someone argued this just meant they skipped the "dying" stages, but all NPCs do that anyway. The GM concluded that we brought back a pile of his ashes.
undead:
Once living, these creatures were infused after death with negative energy and soul-corrupting evil magic. When reduced to 0 Hit Points, an undead creature is destroyed. Undead creatures are damaged by positive energy, are healed by negative energy, and don’t benefit from healing effects.
So I guess the first question is Do we have a body? If we do then the way forward is simple. Resurrection works. If his undead body was destroyed, however, we have issues.
Also, Someone pointed out later that weekend that Resurrection ritual can be used without a body when heightened enough. At 7th level you only need a small portion. At 9th level you don't need anything. And Resurrection plan does not specify the level it is cast at. If you were level 11 or above then I would assume it would automatically be heightened, or else it wouldn't work. He was level 5 when he died.
So the second question is What level is Resurrection Ritual cast at in PFS?
We really like to go by RAW and official clarifications as much as possible. Since it's PFS reducing table variation is pretty important. I say this b/c really I want to avoid discussing opinions and house rules are not a thing at all.
Thanks for reading, and I appreciate any constructive replies!
If you are a Primal Companion Hunter can you give the "Claws" evolution to a an Animal Companion who already has arms but not the "Arms" evolution? For instance can you give an Ape or a Trex Claws?
But RAW I would say no, it requires you to take the arms evolution. But by that rule set you also can't take any evolution that require a "base form".
Undetectable: This grants its bonded user the ability to become utterly undetectable while invisible. While invisible and in physical contact with this item, the bonded creature can't be detected or scryed by any method.
This is obnoxiously vague. As a DM I strive to play as RAW as possible to both avoid conflict and to give players a chance to make informed decisions. I hate using rule 0. I will, but not before I exhaust all other options.
So I come to the PF community to ask if anyone has any experience or precedence in this situation. The only thing I can find is a brief post by James Jacobs.
I think it is fair to say this stops spells like True Seeing, See Invis, etc. What about extraordinary abilities, like Scent, Blindsense, Blindsight, etc? How about a plain old fashion perception check? And if this does mean "utterly undetectable" does that mean that my PC Gunslinger can FRA the BBEG still wouldn't know where he is despite the noise and without "sniping"?
This is not about whether the increased AOO range stacks. IMO it does, but more importantly it has already been discussed in This Thread.
My question is:
Can you move AWAY from a target you are attacking as part of the AOO?
Snap Shot:
While wielding a ranged weapon with which you have Weapon Focus, you threaten squares within 5 feet of you. You can make attacks of opportunity with that ranged weapon. You do not provoke attacks of opportunity when making a ranged attack as an attack of opportunity.
Improved Snap Shot:
You threaten an additional 10 feet with Snap Shot.
Combat Patrol:
As a full-round action, you may set up a combat patrol, increasing your threatened area by 5 feet for every 5 points of your base attack bonus. Until the beginning of your next turn, you may make attacks of opportunity against any opponent in this threatened area that provokes attacks of opportunity. You may move as part of these attacks, provided your total movement before your next turn does not exceed your speed. Any movement you make provokes attacks of opportunity as normal.
By RAW it seems like you can. As per Combat Patrol you can "move as part of these attacks" but it doesn't say you need to move toward your target. RAI I think that is so a melee character can move up to someone to make their AOO - Its a combat patrol after all.
On a ranged PC though this can be either amazing or problematic, depending on your point of view. If you CAN move anywhere you want as part of the AOO does that mean you can dodge attacks because AOO's resolve first. For instance, if an allosaurus pounces you could you use this to move perpendicular to their charge - thus giving you an AOO and negating their attack. Or move out the AOE of a spell being cast near you?
You can place another spell upon your person so that it comes into effect under some condition you dictate when casting contingency. The contingency spell and the companion spell are cast at the same time. The 10-minute casting time is the minimum total for both castings; if the companion spell has a casting time longer than 10 minutes, use that instead. You must pay any costs associated with the companion spell when you cast contingency.
The spell to be brought into effect by the contingency must be one that affects your person and be of a spell level no higher than one-third your caster level (rounded down, maximum 6th level).
The conditions needed to bring the spell into effect must be clear, although they can be general. In all cases, the contingency immediately brings into effect the companion spell, the latter being "cast" instantaneously when the prescribed circumstances occur. If complicated or convoluted conditions are prescribed, the whole spell combination (contingency and the companion magic) may fail when triggered. The companion spell occurs based solely on the stated conditions, regardless of whether you want it to.
Mythic Contingency:
You can cast this spell on yourself or another willing creature as if the spell had a range of touch. A companion spell placed on another creature must be a spell from you, not from the creature, and affects that creature when triggered. The target can have only one contingency spell upon it at a time unless it also knows mythic contingency.
The question is: Can the companion spell used with Mythic Contingency be a "Personal" range spell when cast on another person?
My opinion is no - I think Mythic Contingency only changes the Contingency range from Personal to Touch, not the Companion Spell. The target of the companion spell would be invalid and couldn't be cast. I think Mythic Contingency only changes the Contingency range from Personal to Touch.
Some of my players argue that the Companion Spell is part of the casting of Contingency (which is touch).
I'm running a Mythic Game as my players requested (Regretfully) and I'm close to making a ruling my players will not enjoy. Before I do so, however, I want opinions/interpretations from the community.
Can you use Mythic Haste in combination with Amazing Initiative to gain a second full round action?
Full Round Action:
There are several "definitions" in the combat section:
A full-round action consumes all your effort during a round. The only movement you can take during a full-round action is a 5-foot step before, during, or after the action. You can also perform free actions and swift actions (see below).
A full-round action requires an entire round to complete. Thus, it can't be coupled with a standard or a move action, though if it does not involve moving any distance, you can take a 5-foot step.
In a normal round, you can perform a standard action and a move action, or you can perform a full-round action. You can also perform one swift action and one or more free actions. You can always take a move action in place of a standard action.
Mythic Haste:
Affected creatures gain an additional move action each round. the movement speed increase changes to 50 feet, to a maximum of three times the creature's normal speed for that movement type.
Amazing Initiative:
At 2nd tier, you gain a bonus on initiative checks equal to your mythic tier. In addition, as a free action on your turn, you can expend one use of mythic power to take an additional standard action during that turn. This additional standard action can't be used to cast a spell. You can't gain an extra action in this way more than once per round.
I think some might take the first two bolded sections to mean if you take a full round action you can't use the Move or Standard action from the Mythic abilities. I would disagree with that b/c I think they are the "Normal" and Mythic Haste/Amazing Initiative are the exceptions.
So my question then becomes: Does a Standard Action + a Move Action = a Full-Round Action? No where in RAW does it come straight out and say this is the case. But it does strongly imply that is the case (evidenced by the third bolded section).
I realize I could simply "Rule 0" that you can't gain a second Full-Round action, you simply get another Standard and another Move in addition to a Full-Round. But I prefer to have something with which to support my decision when I present it to the players. No one enjoys DM-Zilla. If anyone has anything to contribute to this topic, one way or the other, I'd appreciate your views.
If interested this is an example of why it has become an issue. But please, NO comments on the following spoiler. I'm just offering some context. I don't want it to derail the thread.
Medieval Machine Guns:
Our Mythic Party is currently level 13 and Mythic Tier 4. It includes a Gunslinger (Musket Master) and the support Wizard.
Once hasted (36 round duration thanks to Arcane Endurance, Orange Ioun Stone, and Rod of Extend) the Gunslinger will take two full round attacks using Mythic Rapid Shot and Mythic Deadly Aim.
His Path abilities give him 110-140 foot Move speed while hasted (Impossible Speed), the ability to move before or after a full-round attack (Fleet Warrior), and a range increment of 200 feet (Limitless Range).
If you don't see the issue yet let me explain. With TWO full-round actions his attack looks like 19/19/19/19/14/9 19/19/19/14/9 against TOUCH AC if the target is withing 200 ft. In addition he can move before or after each attack for 110 feet, a total of 220 feet of movement.
Each hit (which is basically ALL of them unless he rolls a 1 - No misfire for a level 13 Musket Master) does 1d12 + 27 damage. He has improved point blank and clustered shots so DR/Concealment is basically ignored. Assuming 5% miss rate he averages 318.25 damage a round not counting his 19-20 X 4 Crits. The BBEG's don't even get to open their mouths for an evil monologue before they are a puddle of goo.
I wouldn't care so much (Just throw in extra baddies) but he really out shines the rest of the party and no one came to watch "The One Man Show"
Now I realize that:
1) Gunslingers are overpowered. My mistake there.
2) Level 12+ is broken. PFS stops at 12 for a reason.
3) There are counters. Grapplers, Sunder/Disarm, Etc. But that's not the point. If I just locked him down every fight that's a whole new problem.
4) This is related but off topic.
So lets not get off topic. The focus of this thread is Does a Standard Action + a Move Action = a Full-Round Action?. I just wanted to offer some context so you understand why I'm bringing this up. And while that example is by far my biggest problem, it doesn't stop there.
I've spent the last several years playing with the same dozen players in multiple basement campaigns. From this I've learned a lot about qualities of both Good DM's and Bad DM's (not mutually exclusive qualities in the same person) and have been thinking about what makes a DM great. What I decided is that often a DM is his own worst enemy, playing to his preference rather than to his player's personalities. With that in mind, and me on the Eve of my first campaign as DM, I created a Mission Statement to give each of my players.
My hope is that it will give myself a guide to work with while at the same time arming my players with a strong tool to they can use to promote an enjoyable game. Some of you may consider this ridiculous... no doubt you are used to a group of players who work well together. To you I say I am jealous, but the people at "my" table (while all great friends) are very different Role Players. We have a mixed group of hard-core in-character story focused role players, combat specialized min-maxing power gamers, light hearted humor driven social players, and everything in between. There is no avoiding the "mixed bag" that will be our group.
What I want from the PF community is useful feedback on my concept of a "Mission Statement". What would you change, add, or consider unnecessary (If used at all)? All constructive feedback is greatly appreciated! And if anyone cares, my campaign notes are hosted at Obsidian Portal Here (and a direct link to my Mission Statement). Your welcome peruse and get a feel for what I hope to achieve as a DM.
My Mission Statement:
The number one goal in this campaign is for everyone to have fun. Everything else comes second. No matter my successes, if this goal is not met I have failed at my job as a story teller. Unfortunately this means walking a very fine line. Every player is different – each with their own goals, desires, and preferred RPG style. In addition it is also hard to resist a DM’s natural desire to push their own agenda.
To help me overcome these challenges and achieve unilateral player enjoyment I will attempt to create a guide I can use as my compass in leading our adventure. Realizing that I am flawed, I promise to my players that I will use this guide to keep true to our primary goal. It is my hope that every player will remind me when I am not living up to this promise in order to promote open communication and structured enjoyment for everyone.
1 - IS THIS FUN? It’s a simple rule and should be the question I ask myself every time
2 - Remember Quantum’s Quote! Aside from rule 1, every rule following is a guide, not a law. Rules can sometimes discourage fun rather than promote it.
3 - There is no Accomplishment without Challenge. Without challenge or consequences then your real decisions and real successes have no weight. For instance a PC death should be meaningful.
4 - Reward not Punish. Being rewarded is fun, being punished is not. We are here to have fun!
5 - I am Not God. I have more control, knowledge, and power unfortunately. And that makes me a liability. It is my job to reign myself in.
6 - It is my job to Moderate conflict. It should be achieved through open communication and by treating everyone with respect.
7 - Remember the strengths of the PC. PC specialization (Assassination, Trapfinding, Perform, Spying, Professions, Knowledge Nobility, etc) should be relevant and useful. A Players effort should not be wasted or discouraged.
8 - Remember the weaknesses of the PC. The wizard and archer may enjoy fighting flying monsters, but the monk will have nothing to do. Avoid making players the Odd-Man-Out too often but don’t intentionally ignore a player’s blatant disregard for important talents.
9 - This is a social game. Its impossible to give each person 100% game time, but it is within my power (and is my responsibility) to keep each player engaged and entertained.
10 - Not all classes are equal. Some classes scale better, have a tool for every job, or both (* cough * wizard). I will strive to provide equal footing for every class. No one should feel weak just because they finally want to play a monk.
11 - It is fun Role playing! We all want to be a hero. It is easy and simple to give player’s heroic moments, and it adds so much to the game. Don’t skimp interesting skill checks, uses of class abilities, or other special talents!
12 - Rule 0 is a last resort. I promise to respect every player by hearing them out, talking openly, and considering every perspective. If I decide Rule 0 is in the best interest of the game I will ensure every player understands why, even if they disagree.
