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Hello y'all,

Ok, I know there are few details I might be missing. But I started to spin on an idea, maybe someone can give advice, how could this be accomplished.
I have a max-craft wizard (Let's avoid the level and such, just focus that the crafts a lot, for simplicity. But if some required detail is needed, can bring it out).

A thought I started to do, is that one of my companions is quite an able fighter, also wearing a full-plate. It's currently just masterwork, but will be enchanted soon. I thought, is it possible to perhaps make a construct of the armor (maybe just even medium animated object. So I could tell the animated object few keywords, that the fighter says, that the armor "dons itself on him", so that he does not need help and maybe cut the preparation time. So when it dons itself, the fighter is just wearing armor. But if not wearing, the armor can just guard or do simple tasks. No real fighting intended, but if worst comes to be...

But well, there is one catch. If I choose to, I can tell the armor to not un-don himself and perhaps just keep the meatbag inside him and if I even want to, walk into water to drown the carrier. Or just make him attack some innocent person and blame on the carrier of the armor (because, come on, full suit of armors don't walk). Not saying that the one inside is my "companion", but not drawing it out either.

I once read something similar somewhere, but can't find it anymore and maybe there is a clever way to resolve it. Ofcourse I know, the cost is going to be a bit high, but that is currently secondary.

Are any of the Archetypes worth it, or is it like in case of Paladin, that the best (strongest) is the main class without changes?

You can combine Diplomacy and Bluff together to make someone think they came up with an idea you implanted. So you could lead someone else to suggest the idea you want to see implemented, and make them honestly think that it was their own idea in the first place.

Pull the strings on your puppets without them realizing they have strings attached in the first place.

Could You clarify it a bit, by what You mean by this?

And you do not want to make inquisitor of Norgorber? Infiltrator archetype. This would explain the behavior of your character.

I do believe the mesmerist will serve my purpose more with the story I have thought for him. But to know this...this is great. I can also use this in the future if required. As this guy seems to be able to navigate alignments pretty well.

You'll probably want either invisibility or vanish because those are so useful when you need to sneak past someone where there's no cover. Mirror image is an excellent defence spell which you can get.

Those are indeed spells I would aim towards and are useful in a lot of situations. In general, the best spells I know are invisibility and fly (Once my sorcerer halfling just flew over the enemy town while invisible- enemy, who had the town well guarded and really, REALLY hated magic. I had to get to the other side, down a cliff).

One thing that also concerns me is damage. Basically, I cannot always cast spells every encounter, so I should also keep a trusty blade or bow nearby. How should I approach this?
For RP purpose, I thought about the Sword Cane. It's fun to play out, but I'd also want to keep my AC and damage up, while in an encounter.
Or does someone see a much more clever way, other than just regular weapons?

I am going to throw my vote behind the Mesmerist as well. I would also make the suggestion to not have your alignment be evil, since the first time one of the paladins in the party uses their detect evil ability, you are hosed.

I have thought about that. But then again, I could just keep using the Undetectable Alignment every morning (When they cannot see). Then again, I know that alignment does not put 100% into stone, what You should do and act. Rather some more vague identification.

You can either play the Mesmerist as a mind controller/debuff caster type, or more of a melee type with limited spells...the class plays kind of similarly to a bard.

I am a big fan of the caster focused variety...play a Kitsune, make Cha your primary stat and Dex your second...focus on getting your Enchantment DCs as high as possible (Always use your stare on someone before casting on them, Spell Focus, Greater Spell Focus, Max Cha, etc)...max all your social/face skills.

I also fancy a more caster character. But what would be great spells or stares for a Mesmerist? There are quite a few spells and such, but it did seem a bit limited in overall (below average), or it could just be me.

It's worthwhile to at least dip into some kind of Rogue or Ninja so you can get those Talents. I played an Arcane Trickster once and found he was superb at doing all kinds of Roguish non-combat stuff.

True, Rogues do have some nasty talents that would be of use. But I'm not so sure about multiclassing things.

I would also check mesmerist, the class has many tricks to bluff, sneak or disguise your way into social acceptance. It's may more debuff focused than bard.

I see a lot recommended this. I'll take a deep look into this character.

Heck, you can just write Neutral on your character sheet and play their slow descent into evil over the course of the game. It'll save you a lot of trouble and potential PvP conflict in the long run.

The sinking into madness and evil is a good story driver, which I definitely will try at one point. But this character I want to try to make him come with the sole purpose of somewhat using the players to achieve his goal.

As someone who's written pages and pages of backstory for many of my own characters, I can testify that in most cases the other people at the table simply don't give a rat's ass. They're too busy doing their own thing with their character to bother paying attention to what you're doing, at least until it's time to split the loot.

I'm not afraid of my alignment coming out out-game. We usually don't peek at our character sheets. So as not to meta-game and only one having an overview of us is the GM. I can always leave it empty in case of doubt. Problem is that our players somewhat listen quietly what is happening and from time to time, some specific people accidentally start metagaming or suspecting. And I want to avoid doubt, so they would trust me as I would be a real good guy (Even out game).

Try Wit archetype bard. Will scoff at opponents.

I did check on it. In overall good, but seemed to be rather slow. Then again, it's a choice.

Maybe have a look at the Vizir archetype, though that would mostly be for flavor - the regular Consummate Liar benefit of +1/2 Levels to Bluff is better if you "just" want to lie and not throw mind control at party members.

Totally cool Archetype. But I'm worried if I want to manipulate a player, it gets too obvious. To play off that my words are quite compelling is too giving away. Though we in-game will do as a character would, I would like to keep my inner-evil an ultimate surprise, so to say. Possibility is to use it on NPC without PC knowing.

In all and all, it seems I have once more gained knowledge and must be thankful for You all. Mesmerist seems to be a class that slipped my sight and I will look into him.

Hi all,

I'm thinking on building a manipulative evil player character. Perhaps some may lend their advice.

We're in a campaign, where the others are 2 Paladins (1 melee, 1 range) and 1 Cleric (ranged) (You can guess the alignment for them). What I thought about, is making an evil character (Not required to be chaotic-evil, but quite low on the scale of goodyness).
The main idea is, that I want to be a guy, who is quite likable by the group and very friendly. In presence of them, I act real good an majority of the time (Except when info needs to be forced out from NPC somehow, but never in front of the "good people"). I'd have a goal like to kill a main person somewhere (but the target is not like the main plot driven character, as that would ruin the GM world, I will settle with a neighboring Kingdom- perhaps the King to become the new King). All depends how I talk with the GM, little of importance here.

So, basically I want to be a evil guy in disguise in the middle of a bunch of good guys. Play facade that I'm a good (or neutral) person also. But after quite some games (not 1-5, but a very long target), when we finally achieve my goal, I shall reveal my true intentions. Kind of using them to achieve my goal (but not per say convert them evil- as my goal is not to kill them, rather just use them. While still helping them). I would not want to reveal my alignment or intentions before- just have to act cool and good.

I searched some info. Right now, the start is level 5 (but I want to also scheme ahead). In that group, I found very useful a spell Undetectable Alignment. Because if those guys can detect evil, I better hide it well (I know there is also a ring, but it cost a lot of gold). From there, the Bard seems to be quickest to cast it. And it won't be sad to waste 1xlvl1 spell every day. Also he has the most skill points, so I can focus on bluff, diplomacy, sense motive, stealth and so on. The idea is to become the info gatherer and sneaky person of the group (Hard for them to sneak in those bulky metal shells).

From Bard, I stumbled upon the Archetype Negotiator. Would allow take 10 on skills and rogue talents. But big drawback is losing Inspire Courage, which is really good for a party.

But I'm not sure, if just going full on into Bard Negotiator is a good idea. As right now, I know one of the Paladins has Diplomacy 12 (Ofcourse he is an Aasimar also- GM little nerfed him).

We have to roll stats, so I can't think that ahead, but again- ideas are welcome where to focus most (and feats). Possible one feat is Weapon Finesse (Combat)

Has anyone got such experience or ideas, how execute this in the best and evil way?
(If info needed on the good guys, I have more, just ask)

Hi all,

Okay, so hear me out. We have combined our forces with orcs, ogres and goblins. Doing a siege to an Ogre/Orc castle. I have a plan and I'm wondering, how it actually works- the damage, attack rolls and so forth.

Plan: I'll take a catapult. I take a goblin. Equip goblin with something like longsword. Put goblin on catapult. Fire catapult at enemy.

Now, what happens? Do I roll a regular ranged attack (BAB + DEX)?
Does the goblin just go in like a live ammunition, or does he by some miracle get an attack by any chance? Either by flying directly into it, or fly-by swing?
Does the catapult do regular damage, or how does it affect the result?

I don't really care what happens to the goblin (can die), but again, wonder what actually will happen and how.

Any info or similar experience is all welcome.

You get exactly what it says and no more.

Quote:

smite evil 1/day as a swift action (adds Cha bonus to attack rolls and damage bonus equal to HD against evil foes; smite persists until target is dead or the celestial creature rests)

So:

Charisma bonus to attack rolls
Damage bonus equal to number of hit dice

That is all. A celestial/fiendish creature is not a paladin and doesn't gain the same ability.

Okay, good. Double-checking, so basically it can choose a target and hit it. Once hit, it keeps getting bonuses against that target (As long as either exist).

Hi all

Now I'm about to ask something that is confusing to me right now. I have read about it, but maybe someone can explain it fully/finally.

When Summon Creature is used, they can apply Celestial/Fiend template.

• Good = Celestial
  
• Neutral = Choose template Yourself
  
• Evil = Fiend
  

Now, the confusion begins on the "Smite evil/good" Special Ability it gets from the alignment.
As far as I've read and understood, the creatue smite evil/good is not the same as the Paladins.
As such, it gets bonus to hit dice on attacking and bonus to damage dice on attacking. But now comes the question, what else happens?

• Paladin bypasses DR of evil target- Does this work the same way?
  
• Paladin gets Deflection bonus according to his CHA- I presume this does not happen?
  

Why do you miss mage armor? As an oracle you can cast in armor, up to medium armor without investment, and can for a feat use heavy armor instead.

Just my previous character was Sorcerer that casted it early. Though the armor part is great, true. But then the armor spell is quite useless, unless I cast it on the undead (If it does not wear armor already).

I think a fetchling would be interesting. Fetchlings are associated with the shadow plane, which has quite a few undead there (I think).

Will check it, already seems interesting and OP too :D

The spell Umbral Infusion can make your main undead stronger by infusing it with the power of shadow. The spell Flesh Puppet could be good to make your large undead, it's an evil spell, but it's permanent and even disguises the undead. Find a suitable giant terrorizing the land, kill it and use flesh puppet, tell everyone you converted it to the cause of good, or some such.

The Flesh puppet is a very cool spell. I do remember once reading about it, but forgot the name of it- so a lot of thanks to You, for referencing it. I can think also a lot of RP moments that can be associated with it. Though correct me if I'm wrong, but wouldn't creating Juju zombies and Animate zombies (Or create zombies) more spell/power efficient? Just appears at first glance.

The choice between Cure or Inflict is in addition to your spells you get for mysteries and what you choose. Someone suggested Summoning Undead, take Skeletal Summoner Feat and now you have that option with Summon Monster spells.

True, it would add skeletal creatures. But is the skeletal summoning worth it? Ofcourse flying creatures would be out from there (Skeletons cannot fly) but some are pretty good. But again, is it worth taking Summon Creature spell against something buffing/damaging?

I usually pick Shield of Faith as one of my spells. +2 Deflection to AX goes up at 6th Lvl. So that's +3 to AC.

*sigh* I miss Mage's Armor. But yes, it's quite a useful spell.

First thing that springs to mind: summoning the Undead might not be very efficient. Creating your own works better, if you're going to be Evil anyway.

I'm not going to be "literally evil". I'm more of a misguided, who doesn't massacre people. But the Create Undead requires lvl6 spell, which I will get only at lvl-12 (I'm starting 8)

As an oracle you get either the cure or inflict line added to your spells known at the appropriate level you just have to pick which one.

That line did slip my sight. You have my highest gratitude for it. Basically as I understood, I have to choose "Cure" or "Inflict" and whenever one spell with such description becomes available, I get it? And it does not take away my spells known?

Hi

So I'm starting a new character, and would like to hear opinions and advice building an character. I have read a lot about it and would like to hear any suggestions.

Basically what I'm building and why- A JuJu Oracle (Starting lvl8), that can summon undead creatures mainly. Points to bring out and why I chose them:

• Oracle- Seems best to summon dead (Cleric spell list, etc.).
  
• JuJu- Revelation- Spirit Vessels(Su) - 4HD/lvl undead pumped up to 6HD/lvl.
  
• JuJu- Revelation- Undead Servitude(Su) - Command Undead.
  
• JuJu- Spell to aim for is JuJu Zombie (Sounds OP).
  
• Curse- Sedentary- Flavour effect, that I'm crippled and an undead has to carry me.
  

For spells I aim to get Animate Dead and Desecrate. Also maybe Blessing of Fervor and maybe Cure/Inflict light wounds to heal me and my minions.
I would aim to command 1 strong large undead who carries me on his back and a small stack of other undead (That I would carry in my bag of holding).

Things I'm not certain, is what other spells would be great for such character and what kind of undead would be best to ride upon (Not like a horse, but something like a minotaur or similar).

What kind of race would be great for such deeds? As it should be something non-vanilla (For change) and unique/fun.

Also, what equipment would be best to aim for the start (Can put average as level per gold like in core rulebook, if estimate needed).

Any ideas or thoughts?

BTW, I've been assuming you want to make a quiver for the flavor; if not, just make some magic arrows straight out of the book and skip the customizations....

You are correct on the flavor part. The 3-stack thing I know my GM does not approve, as it's too OP in his book and I understand why.

So I see that if I want to make the quiver (or 50 arrows straight) into the flaming arrows, either way I'm making them +1 and flaming, which would be 8,000 gp, as You brought out.

The reason why I considered the activation, is that the ranger would not always be wasting the arrows, if she did not want to use them (For what ever reason).

Either way, all of You give quite some good ideas and I thank You all for it. Cleared a lot for me :)

If the quiver is command-word activated, I would base its price on 1800 gp instead of 2000. But are you sure you want that? It means the ranger has to spend a standard action activating the quiver, which is a pain if you're in combat already. (That pain is what gets you the 10% discount.) Anyway, other than that possible tweak, the quiver I suggested should be priced exactly like a batch of 50 +1 flaming (or whatever) arrows, because the final result is the same.

So if I would like to make the 50 arrow quiver that has 50 charges of flaming arrows (Without command word), it would cost total of 2,000 gp to craft? Just clarifying.

Long informative and good info text

I'm a level 7 sorcerer who does not possess that spell (Just for info). I do understand that a DC+5 would be added, if I want to create without an real spell (or item), but a GM ruling in our game has limited that You need to cast the spell (But I have the staff for it, so that's ok).

The item cost is usually where it gets me, that how much it really cost to craft it. Usually I have a long discussion with the GM about it and we both have doubts.
I understand that the feat "Craft wondrous Item" will work in this case.

The idea Fuzzy-Wuzzy gave is also a good balance:

The only solution that occurs to me is to say that the quiver (a) only works on otherwise nonmagical arrows, (b) makes them +1 (at least) as well as flaming (or whatever), and (c) stops working after enhancing 50 arrows. That's just as balanced as making a batch of enchanted arrows and using them in an possibly-enchanted bow.

But now the cost is questionable. "Flaming" cost is 2,000 gp (+1 bonus). Though the page does say that if it's a command word item, it makes it the Spell*caster*1,800gp cost. So now I'm confused, which is actually correct handling? Though logical would be perhaps that for a quiver, the more expensive part is more logical. Any ideas or overruling?

Sorry if my confusion is confusing, just want to make it clear, so I could present it to my GM and all would be legit and fun.

PS: I do want it to be a command word item, but uncertain of the other limitations for cost reduction- race, skill, and such. As going for continuous would be only 200gp (around) extra. It does sound interesting. Would You happen to have some source for it, so I could dig into it a bit more?

You can craft a wonderous item that casts the spell and just eat the +5 to the crafting dc. It can cast whatever spell you want on the arrows inside and call it a day. No need to muck about with staff mechanics.

That would be a possibility. Though our GM expects the spell to exist in some way (Your slot, scroll, or other). Because otherwise it would not make much sense, how to infuse a spell You do not know.

Or did I get something mixed up here? Would appreciate some clearing up.

But if flaming adds 1d6, can I stack them by increasing the bonus cost to make it 2d6 or so? If usual cost is +1 bonus, I want 1d6 would be +2 bonus?

Crafting any magic item not already in the books requires GM approval. Even if the CRB guidelines give you a price estimate, the GM may want to charge more (or conceivably less) or disallow the item entirely.

I'm not positive what it is you're interesting in making. Is there a reason you don't just craft the standard flaming property into the ranger's bow?

Yes, it somewhat seems it is basically a flaming on the bow. But I don't want to put it on the bow. As the ranger is using it (And we're on a tight schedule and danger) and I'm uncertain for how long does she keep that certain model.

No, but if you can reliably UMD those spells from the staff you can use it to meet the corresponding spell prerequisite for an item you're crafting from scratch. That'll save you the +5 Crafting DC for skipping the prereq.

Thanks for the info!

But already if on the subject. Crafting magical is a bit new to me.
If I want to put the spell, that every time the ranger takes an arrow (And says a trigger word), it has the fire on them- is it possible (Or only limited amount possible)? Or is this something that has to be talked to the GM and agreed upon the item price and if possible like that?

I have read the item creation rules, and there a lot of grey area subject. Thus far, I have seen the current magical items and took those prices, but now I want to do something that might not be there.

Hi

So I made a Sorcerer in Pathfinder. I took "craft arms and armor", "craft wondrous item" and some more feats. I have a long term idea with it and so forth.
My sorcerer had a staff, that he used quite frequently and basically the staff has 2 spells left (It cannot be recharged). One of them, is fire on arrows (add 1d4 or so on a arrow holster). But now he found a new and better one. Can I somehow use the old staff, to create into (or use as a component) to create a seperate item Arrow Holster, that our ranger could use (Activated and so forth)?
I know that if I want to improve an item, I can deduce the cost of the previous item and create better one. But I have not stumbled something on re-forming a magical item into something new. My caster does not know those spells on the staff.
Has anyone encountered such task?
My GM does not know either and if not certain, rather denies this action.

tl;dr- Can I craft a magical staff into a arrow holster (With a specific spell) that someone else could use?