For example, if I had a leather armor +5, its AC value would be 2 and its enhancement bonus would be +5.
Shroud of water, when I use burn on a water wild talent, extends its AC bonus to both the shield and the Armor form. For the easiest argument, let's say in this situation I'm simply level 2 and I've invested 0 burn into the defense.
Leather armor = 2 Armor bonus, 5 enhancement bonus
Shroud of Water = 4 armor bonus
What is the final bonus to my AC for these two? is it 9 or is it 7?
CBDunkerson is right. The enhancement bonus on your armor only applies to the armor, not your shroud. The shroud of water is basically like casting mage armor on yourself.
To clarify, magic armor provides an enhancement bonus to it's own Armor bonus. Leather Armor +5 provides the wearer with a +7 armor bonus.
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quote=D20PFSRD]
Shroud of Water
Element(s) water; Type defense (Su); Level —; Burn 0
You surround yourself with a shroud of water, ice, or both that protects you from harm. The shroud can either cover your body, functioning as armor, or float around you and block attacks, functioning as a shield. It grants either a +4 armor bonus to AC or a +2 shield bonus to AC, and you can change the type of bonus as a standard action. This bonus increases by 1 for every 4 kineticist levels you possess beyond 2nd. By accepting 1 point of burn, You can increase the bonus by 1 until the next time your burn is removed. You can increase the bonus multiple times in this way, but it can't be increased by more than 50% of its starting value.
When you change the shroud to grant a shield bonus, any bonus in excess of this limit doesn't apply, but it remains if you change the shroud's bonus type again. Whenever you accept burn while using a water wild talent, the water coalescing around you allows your shroud to grant both the armor bonus and the shield bonus for 1 round. You can dismiss or restore this effect as an immediate action.
It grant an armor or shield bonus, an armor or shield grant an armor or shield bonus, the two bonus don't stack they overlap.
Basically I'll need to be watching how I invest in it, because if I put enough burn into it there's a possibility that the armor bonus of the shroud would be able to out-do the combined armor bonus of my armor. Very corner situation where I can squeeze out a little bit extra AC, but there ya have it.
Why not just use it as a freebee shield AC since kineticists aren't proficient with real ones and it still leaves your hands free.
Why not just use it as a freebee shield AC since kineticists aren't proficient with real ones and it still leaves your hands free.
Yeah, that's my current use. What i'm saying is that sometimes, after I've invested 1 or 2 burn into it, the armor bonus of the armor half might be greater than the armor bonus from my armor. In this situation, my AC will be slightly higher on turns where I invest burn in any water wild talent.
But you can't look at just the armor bonus difference. You have to look at your actual armor+shield bonus vs just water armor.
But you can't look at just the armor bonus difference. You have to look at your actual armor+shield bonus vs just water armor.
I think we're on different wavelengths(heh) here.
Whenever you accept burn while using a water wild talent, the water coalescing around you allows your shroud to grant both the armor bonus and the shield bonus for 1 round. You can dismiss or restore this effect as an immediate action.
I will always be using the shield bonus. It is in situations where I've accepted a burn while using a water wild talent that I must compare the AC bonus of the armor half and the AC bonus of my regular armor, and if the shroud's armor is greater than my AC improves for that one round.
I will always be using the shield bonus. It is in situations where I've accepted a burn while using a water wild talent that I must compare the AC bonus of the armor half and the AC bonus of my regular armor, and if the shroud's armor is greater than my AC improves for that one round.
Except that you can't gain both the shield bonus and the armor bonus from Shroud of Water at the same time. So it will only give you a benefit if the difference in armor values is greater than the total bonus that could be provided by the shield version.
I will always be using the shield bonus. It is in situations where I've accepted a burn while using a water wild talent that I must compare the AC bonus of the armor half and the AC bonus of my regular armor, and if the shroud's armor is greater than my AC improves for that one round.Except that you can't gain both the shield bonus and the armor bonus from Shroud of Water at the same time. So it will only give you a benefit if the difference in armor values is greater than the total bonus that could be provided by the shield version.
I'd hate to sound rude, but have you read the ability?
People seem to not be understanding my thought process.
Normally: I have AC 4 from, say, chain shirt, and AC 2 from shroud of water shield. This is a total bonus of +6 AC from shield/armor.
When I spend 1 burn the shroud, the bonuses available from shroud of water become 3 and 5. I can choose one, but the armor won't stack with my regular armor, and my total ac in that situation would be 5. Thus, I choose shield still, and my total AC is 7.
However, when I spend 1 burn on any water talent, the shroud of water ability specifically states that for one round, I benefit from both the armor and the shield bonus of the shroud. This means the +5 overlaps the +4 of my regular armor, and the +3 of the shield is added to that to make the total armor bonus be +8.
That situation is what I was talking about, and what I need to be tracking.
That makes sense. Thanks for spelling it out.
Ah yes forgot about the double up when you accept burn. My bad. But yes you wont benefit from the armor gains until it fully surpasses the armor + enhancement AC from your actual armor.