Bladed Brush Combat, Buckler and Slashing Grace?

[Torbyne]

I was going over an idea for a eldritch guardian/mutation warrior and was considering how to make it dex based... so bare with me because i am unsure about a few of these connections.

To start with, an assumption i am making: Wielding a buckler, as in wearing it for an AC bonus, does not "occupy your off-hand" as in the hand is empty which is a requirements for things like Slashing Grace. There was some talk about this when the Swashbuckler first came out and this is how i remember the ruling coming out on it at least.

Now, if you take Bladed Brush you can use a Glaive as if it was one handed and your off hand was not occupied. then Slashing grace allows dex to damamge so long as your off hand is not occupied.

It seems to me that Bladed Brush is supposed to work with Slashing Grace and Slashing Grace is supposed to be compatible with using a Buckler... but does treating a two handed weapon as one handed and as if not using your off hand actually free you up to gain the AC bonus with it?

I was previously looking at using Shield Brace and a Nodachi with the character and going STR based but i am interseted to see if this could work as well.

Failing this combination working as is, would it work with Bladed Brush, Slashign Grace, Shield Brace and a buckler?

[SlimGauge]

Torbyne wrote:

Wielding a buckler, as in wearing it for an AC bonus, does not "occupy your off-hand" as in the hand is empty which is a requirements for things like Slashing Grace.

Your hand is not occupied, but is unavailable for wielding without forfeiting the shield bonus and taking the penalty.

Torbyne wrote:

Now, if you take Bladed Brush you can use a Glaive as if it was one handed and your off hand was not occupied. then Slashing grace allows dex to damage so long as your off hand is not occupied.

It seems to me that Bladed Brush is supposed to work with Slashing Grace and Slashing Grace is supposed to be compatible with using a Buckler... but does treating a two handed weapon as one handed and as if not using your off hand actually free you up to gain the AC bonus with it?

I would say no. The actual wording of Bladed Brush is "as if you were not making attacks with your off-hand for all feats and class abilities that require such a weapon (such as a duelist’s or swashbuckler’s precise strike)."

The buckler rules are not feats or class abilities. As far at the buckler is concerned, Bladed Brush does nothing.

[Squiggit]

Quote:

It seems to me that Bladed Brush is supposed to work with Slashing Grace

I'd disagree completely. Bladed Brush sports a fairly bizarre and obtuse wording that seems to only exist to specifically make it not work with slashing grace. It goes out of its way to avoid ever saying you have a free hand (the requirement for slashing grace to work) and instead only specifies that you treat the hand as if it were not attacking. Language that basically specifically designed to enable precise strike without anything else.

Might work if you took two weapon grace though.

[Torbyne]

Squiggit wrote:

Quote:

It seems to me that Bladed Brush is supposed to work with Slashing Grace

I'd disagree completely. Bladed Brush sports a fairly bizarre and obtuse wording that seems to only exist to specifically make it not work with slashing grace. It goes out of its way to avoid ever saying you have a free hand (the requirement for slashing grace to work) and instead only specifies that you treat the hand as if it were not attacking. Language that basically specifically designed to enable precise strike without anything else.

Might work if you took two weapon grace though.

Wow, I hadnt even considered that interpretation... But yeah, reading the two feats, you are not attacking with your off hand but it is still occupied by the virtue of a glaive being two handed to begin with. well this is just getting shakier and shakier with each post :/

[Snowlilly]

Bladed Brush wrote:

Benefit(s): You can use the Weapon Finesse feat to apply your Dexterity modifier instead of your Strength modifier to attack rolls with a glaive sized for you, even though it isn’t a light weapon.

Quote:

You can use weapon finesse with glaives.

Quote:

When wielding a glaive, you can treat it as a one-handed piercing or slashing melee weapon

Precise Strike wrote:

a swashbuckler gains the ability to strike precisely with a light or one-handed piercing melee weapon

Treated as a one-handed weapon; one-handed weapons do not occupy the off-hand.

Meets 1st preq for Precise Strike met

Quote:

and as if you were not making attacks with your off-hand for all feats and class abilities that require such a weapon

specifying the second condition for Slashing Grace/Precise (such as a duelist’s or swashbuckler’s precise strike).

Precise Strike wrote:

To use this deed, a swashbuckler cannot attack with a weapon in her other hand

There is no requirement that a swashbuckler's off-hand be unoccupied, only that it not be used to attack and that no shield, other than a buckler, is equipped.

Meets 2nd preq for Precise Strike met

Bladed Brush wrote:

(such as a duelist’s or swashbuckler’s precise strike).

Precise Strike specifically called out as working with Bladed Brush.

All that being said: Unhindering Shield will allow you to receive the AC bonus from your buckler while using a two-handed weapon.

Slashing Grace is more problematic since it has the additional requirement that the off-hand be unoccupied. Bladed Brush only states as if not attacking.

Nodachi + Shield Brace is less feat intensive unless you are set on going dexterity based. If looking for Dexterity-to-damage with the glaive, you may need a three level dip into unchained rogue.

[Torbyne]

i was just looking over an old concept and wondering if there were any new twists i could apply to it and came across bladed brush, luckily Fighters have enough feats to dump into something as weird as a heavily armored dex build. Nice break down by the way!

[Torbyne]

By the way, i like the intent of Unhindering Shield but am really annoyed by the line, "using any other abilities that require you to have a free hand or interact with your shield, such as the swashbuckler’s precise strike" because i thought that Swashbucklers could already get the AC from a buckler while using Precise Strike and this just confuses things further.

[Snowlilly]

Torbyne wrote:

By the way, i like the intent of Unhindering Shield but am really annoyed by the line, "using any other abilities that require you to have a free hand or interact with your shield, such as the swashbuckler’s precise strike" because i thought that Swashbucklers could already get the AC from a buckler while using Precise Strike and this just confuses things further.

You can get the AC benefit from Precise Strike while using a buckler. They are specifically called out in the Precise Strike ability.

Paizo occasionally makes redundant statements.

Unhindering Shield is a much bigger deal for monks and magi, as most fighters will take Shield Brace.