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With Improved Overrun, you do not provoke an attack of opportunity for initiating an Overrun combat maneuver.
The player targeted said that the monster still provokes an attack of opportunity for moving into his space, or through threatened squares afterwards, or somesuch. When I said that would defeat the point of the feat (mostly), the player said that since it wasn't triggered by the action, any AoO damage wouldn't be applied to the combat maneuver check.
So with Improved Overrun, do you not trigger an AoO at all, neither for initiating the movement, nor for entering its square or moving onward? Or is the benefit of the feat that the damage doesn't ruin the attempt?
By the letter of the Rules you provoke an AoO when attempting an Overrun Combat Maneuver. You also provoke an AoO when moving through a threatened area.
The Improved Overrun feat allows you to negate the AoO for the Overrun Attempt (as is the case with all the Improved ___ feats), this leaves the AoO from Movement which will still be provoked.
So from what I can see, it should work as the player describes under the rules.
So with Improved Overrun, do you not trigger an AoO at all, neither for initiating the movement, nor for entering its square or moving onward? Or is the benefit of the feat that the damage doesn't ruin the attempt?
Well, as written, it would stop one of the two AoOs you would be provoking otherwise.
Orc tries to overrun without feat, runs up to Dwarf, Dwarf declines to step aside, Orc makes Overrun check, provoking attack. Dwarf hits him. Orc applies damage to his check, but still succeeds. Orc moves through Dwarf's square, provoking an attack. Dwarf hits him again. Orc keeps on trucking and runs to the hills.
Orc tries to overrun with feat, runs up to Dwarf, who cannot choose to step aside. Orc makes Overrun check, doesn't provoke, and succeeds. Orc moves through Dwarf's square, provoking an attack. Dwarf hits Orc. Orc is still healthy enough to fight or whatever.
One could even argue that Orc could use Acrobatics to avoid the AoO from movement, too.
However, I think the intent is for Overrun with the feat to not provoke at all.
Responding to a question about the Trample feat, JJ says you use Trample as part of an overrun, and:
It's also normal movement, so you provoke attacks of opportunity as normal (unless you have the Improved Overrun feat as well).
This implies that with the feat, you would not provoke from the movement involved in making the overrun. (At least, from the target of the overrun. I think if you ran past 3 other guys while overrunning the 4th, you would probably provoke from those 3)
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PRPG Over-Run no longer ´enters the square´ of your target, so that AoO never happens.
*IF* the target has a Reach advantage vs. you, it seems that you WOULD need to leave a threatened square before starting the Over-Run, so in that case it seems that per RAW the target would get an AoO vs. you before you start the Over-Run (but that is the same for ANY normal melee attack, and this AoO from movement doesn´t apply DAMAGE to the Over-Run DC as if they took and AoO provoked by the Over-Run maneuver itself).
Apart from this, I think the exact action order of Over-Run could be cleared up, as it seems like you are ´uniquely´ taking the Standard Action DURING a Move Action, yet that isn´t actually specified / allowed by the RAW. This also goes for Over-Runs allowed DURING another action such as a Charge - an action is being ´injected´ within normal movement in that case, which is a pretty wierd event rules-wise, wierd enough that it needs to be called out. Wierd exceptions to rules are OK, but it needs to be clear, other wise, normal rules re: sequential/modular actions ´SHOULD´ apply in all cases (which would make Over-Run kind of s~+!ty if your movement immediately stops in order to use it)
PRPG Over-Run no longer ´enters the square´ of your target, so that AoO never happens.
Moving through a square - "Overrun: During your movement, you can attempt to move through a square occupied by an opponent (see Overrun)."
Overrun: "As a standard action, taken during your move or as part of a charge, you can attempt to overrun your target, moving through its square."
In addition, the movement itself will provoke.
Standard example of two medium creatures (Orc and Elf) both wielding non-reach weapons (Longswords). For Elf to overrun the Orc, it must approach. It does so without leaving any threatened squares. When adjacent, Elf needs to perform an overrun to move through the Orc's square. Since Elf has the Improved Overrun feat, and succeeds on his CM, he does so. Now, at this point, the Elf enters the Orcs square, then exits the Orcs square, then exits the square on the far side of the Orc. All three of these squares are threatened by the Orc, so he may make an attack of opportunity against the Elf when the Elf leaves one of these squares.
If the Orc had a longspear, the Elf would have provoked when he moved out of the first threatened square in order to become adjacent. If the Orc made an AoO then, the damage would not be applied to Elf's combat maneuver, since it hasn't happened yet.
If Improved Overrun was intended to negate the provocation of both the combat maneuver itself, and the movement through the targets threatened area, I think it should be clarified.
Yeah, sorry... I was mixing up Over-Run with Bull Rush.
Still, Imp Over-Run says:
You do not provoke an attack of opportunity when performing an overrun combat maneuver.
Normal: You provoke an attack of opportunity when performing an overrun combat maneuver.
Over Run says:
As a standard action, taken during your move or as part of a charge, you can attempt to overrun your target, moving through its square. ...If you do not have the Improved Overrun feat, or a similar ability, initiating an overrun provokes an attack of opportunity from the target of your maneuver. If your overrun attempt fails, you stop in the space directly in front of the opponent, or the nearest open space in front of the creature if there are other creatures occupying that space.
THe Feat directly says that you do not provoke an AoO when performing an Over-Run.
Over-Run includes moving thru their space, which includes leaving threatened area (presuming they are armed).
So IF YOU HAVE Imp Over-Run, it doesn´t really matter whether the AoO for initiating an Over-Run is separate from that for leaving a threatened square, Imp Over Run says you don´t provoke when performing Over-Run.
If you DON´T have Imp Over-Run, the question would be if you could potentially provoke 2 AoO´s.
Since the description of Over-Run is clear that ´initiating´ the maneuver happens when you TRY TO LEAVE THE THREATENED SQUARE (and failure leaves you in your original square), to me that is clear that in this case the Maneuver AoO is identical to that for leaving a threatened square, the provoking action is exactly the same, and there is no way to separate them (one happens, and then the other happens after the first one). I suppose that could be clarified though.