My players (7 x level 7) are about to take on a few white dragons, mostly young ones (CR 4 and 6) and a couple of adults(CR 9), and an old one (CR 13). They are in a castle made of ice high up in the mountains. They have allied with an adult black (CR 11). There will also be a Frost Giant(CR 9), and a half-dragon rogue 9, and some Huge Ice Elementals (CR 7). All these guys are spread across two main rooms - the large foyer and the massive hall. Any ice trolls, wererats and NPCs leftover from outside may join the fray.
I'm particularly looking for tactical advice to keep the dragons as fearsome as they deserve to be. The players will have had to fight their way to the castle doors before facing the dragons, though the dragon combat may spill outside again. So they should be down on some hp and resources, though probably still buffed. The dragons will have time to prepare and buff, though they don't have much in the way of buffs as written.
For the young ones they will ready actions to Breath on advancing foes. On their turn they will bite then burrow. They plan to stay out of melee range as much as possible.
Older ones will breath, then utilise a bite with Flyby Attack. Then stay out of range casting spells till ready to breath again. They may burrow if being attacked at range overly much. They are more willing to go into melee, particularly where they can outnumber and flank the PCs in melee. The adult black dragon will definitely want to report back to his boss.
The Old dragon plans on a single breath, then he will circle high above, and most probably leave the fighting to the younger ones.
I'm thinking of adding a level of Barbarian to the younger ones and have them fight to the death, though the older ones plan to fight another day - preferably planning and plotting revenge against the players at a later date (and in bigger numbers).
Any tips for this?
Oh, and the bad guys here would prefer to capture the PCs. They are from a rival gang, and the ransom or blackmail could be worthwhile.
So it shouldn't end up as a TPK... maybe.
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The old dragon should probably plan on making full use of his freezing fog ability. It will have a larger impact on the fight than a single breath weapon.
Also, if the dragons are prepared, have the old dragon cast resist fire on the younger ones. It would be a VERY logical spell for a white dragon to take and use. He can also feel free to toss a few mage armor spells on his allies, since he does not plan on fighting himself.
Have the adults pre-buff themselves with mage armor / shield. Not many first levels spells are meaningful for a dragon at this stage: both of these spells retain their full effectiveness. Your adult dragons just went from having a 27 AC to a 35 AC.
White Dragons may be stupid in general, but that old one has lived long enough to grow out of it. He can think tactically and should know what adventurers gunning for white dragon will usually bring to the fight. If he does get involved, it should be to drop #1 the person throwing heals or #2 the arcane caster. Melee's should be avoided / dealt with via breath weapons.
Some cool ideas
Thanks Artanthos. I've swapped some spells around, written all over the stats and I think I'm ready to roll.
I thought too, that if the first few white dragons attacked have Resist Energy Fire, the players will probably assume that they all do. How's that for effective spell casting?!
The black should use disguise self to look like a white. If hes in an ice cave the players won't even suspect.
And the frost giant and ice elementals won't mind getting blasted with ice breath while in melee with the fighters a target.
The black should use disguise self to look like a white. If hes in an ice cave the players won't even suspect.
And the frost giant and ice elementals won't mind getting blasted with ice breath while in melee with the fighters a target.
So long as I don't forget which White dragon is actually the black. That is a great idea, and I'm really disappointed in myself for not thinking of it - I like to play Illusionists.
I wouldn't be worried about the dragons, I'd be more concerned about the PCs. Level 7 dudes going up against 6 dragons? TPK. Unless the dragons are played like they are missing a brain.
Pulled from Chronicles: The Pathfinder Podcast forums:
On the subject of flying dragons:
Flying dragons are boring, and far less scary. Your flying dragon just needs to roll a single 1 and they are dead (Any immobilizing effect ruins their day as the party surrounds and begins the stomping.) There are a myriad number of ways to bring down a size huge creature.
Then you hit an ancient white dragon like mine... in its lair.
A white dragon's lair is a hollowed out icy mountain (Read: Glacier). Consider that, now consider that they can ice shape and wall of ice at will. So all the floors are difficult terrain. Consider that they know the layout of their ICY MAZE OF MIRROR WALLS. Now consider they have Dimension door. Consider their icy maze in conjunction with teleportation. Now consider you should actually USE the dragon's ridiculous wealth (remember, dragons are generally by definition high fantasy and thus have SIX TIMES standard wealth for that CR, putting them in the realm of player wealth.)
Now consider you're working with an ice monster. There's this spell called simulacrum. It gives you a big dragon looking target that shouts SMITE ME. Paladins hate this trick. Then you move into the mega-size flyby room and let them burn all their tricks to stop it from flying.
Oh and if you ever get in trouble, you can summon a freaking blizzard and just have better-than-invisibility... once every 1d4 rounds. (Note that blizzards are windstorms and thus make ranged attacks impossible within their boundaries. And you have snow vision.)
Right before death, you defensively D-Door to the lair under your lair because WE NEED TO GO DEEPER. Oh, and because this lair is a maze with elixirs of heal and potions of restoration hidden in the walls where only your dragon knows where they are. And now we get to the part where the white dragon is scary.
White dragons have a burrow speed, and a stealth score of +16. You'll never see it coming when its head pops out of the wall and it starts breaking everything. It has a 15 ft reach, in a maze of mirrors, and it can break through walls at 20ft per move action... and then immediately fill that space with a wall of ice. Oh, and you can come from the ceiling and the floor. Players don't have z axis because battlemats don't usually have them. Disabuse them of this notion.
Lairs are SO much scarier than derping about in the air.
The above is how you run a dragon. It's an encounter in an encounter in an encounter. You play defensively, because you're a dragon and you can bide your time. Your powers recharge. You don't have weapons/armor they can sunder. And when you've finally played cat and mouse for 20 rounds, and the players have had their strength whittled down to nothing and had a GRAND time trying to not die... you remind them why dragons are scary in enclosed spaces, and wall them into a star wars garbage disposal style room (Icing into the room every round growing in the walls.) They either teleport away, or you break through the final wall and show them why breath weapons are scary when they're coming through a 2x2 ft opening in the ice (Ice shape) and entering a perfectly conical room.
I wouldn't be worried about the dragons, I'd be more concerned about the PCs. Level 7 dudes going up against 6 dragons? TPK. Unless the dragons are played like they are missing a brain.
Thanks for the warning. I will be watching how they cope with the previous encounters and adjusting how many of which dragons I have when they get to them.
However, these guys are a good team, with awesome stats (4d6, drop the lowest, 7 times, drop the lowest, make sure you have at least on 17 or higher). They'll do okay. They have an APL more like 9 or 10, maybe even 11 when they work together well.
...and they know there are white dragons here and they will have time to buff. They have a Wand of Resist Energy - Cold.
They will be mostly fighting the CR4 and CR6 dragons, with the 2 adults (CR9) hanging back as the BBEG likes to do, burrowing into and out of the room to surprise the party from a new position. The CR 13 will be circling high in the skies above, watching and learning how the PCs act.
Besides, there are advantages in the Bad Guys capturing the party.
gave me some awesome stuff!
Thanks for that. =)
I have pasted and stored it in a document for later use.Fortunately for the party this encounter is in an Ice Castle not a lair, created as a temporary meeting room as a few bad guys are negotiating an alliance. The party has at least disrupted the meeting, and this may sow the seeds of doubt within the Old White Dragon that humans are not worthy of working with, and that Blacks aren't to be trusted.