Given the recent – lengthy and heated – discussion on female character clothing; I thought it might be appropriate to start yet another thread on the subject.
What is “normal clothing” on Golaria?
More specifically, what is the traditional costume of the men & women of the various nations, tribes, ethnicities, races, and even social classes wear?
Good question! I'd like to have some historical time periods to draw upon when I'm randomly doodling.
Indeed, that would be interesting...
I assume we will have an idea from various pictures in the many sourcebooks and supplements to come about Golarion and its people...
There was already a thread (that i didn't mark) about possible analogies between Golarian (Golarionish ? Golariite ?) civilizations and our world's ancient ones. It can help until we see more...
That makes me think...
In most of the RPGs or video games i play, i often appreciate and collect the conceptual designs from supplements or websites.
Although the fully finished illustrations can be glorious, i always feel more inspiration in the conceptual sketches.
As an artist, in enjoy drawing more than painting.
I hope Paizo will give us such images...
A Golarion coffee table artbook ? Hey why not a Golarion Collector Edition ?
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As Golarion is divided in dozens of very different lands, we should see quite a bit of different styles, even if fashion is stated by the two big ones (Cheliax and Taldor) plus Absalom. The Gazeteer gives us an idea with the portraits of each human "race", which its not hard to relate to our world's cultures.
What it seems like is:
Varisians (Gipsies)
http://www.ballet.co.uk/images/bolshoi/iz_donq_malhasyants_gypsy_air_700.jp g
http://k43.pbase.com/g3/46/599946/2/54635325.DSC_3661ALBC_FF.jpg
Vudrans (Indians)
http://www.udel.edu/PR/UDaily/2008/sep/Shobanalg.jpg
http://www.dia-networks.com/en/common/images/lightbox/o/sari02.jpg
Urfen (Vikings)
http://www.dkimages.com/discover/previews/973/85015197.JPG
http://wychwood.wikidot.com/local--files/kit-female/wynflaed.jpg
Taldor (victorian)
http://www.teaspirit.com/teabagladies/uploaded_images/lady_in_victorian_bla ck_dress_having_tea-756019.jpg
http://www.st-marys.hull.sch.uk/sites/history/images/Victorian_fashions.jpg
Cheliax (western medieval europe)
http://www.realmcollections.com/pl1577/german-gown-inset.html
http://www.realmcollections.com/pl1679/country-maid-skirt-with-bodice.html
Garundi (Northern african)
http://api.ning.com/files/m8Up8XKxg7KsEAo1hO2uzUkxN1xKUqCG4Cr0zoTQDpQ_/Trad itionalAfricanWoman.jpg
http://www.janzour.com/Libya%20early%20pictures/1913%20%20Vintage%20Tripoli %20Libya%205.jpg
Keleshite (Persian)
http://farm1.static.flickr.com/83/219425858_e4fe186794.jpg?v=0
http://www.gutenberg.org/files/22117/22117-h/images/ill1-20_th.jpg
Id expect variations. For example, Nidalese people may wear variants of Chelish clothing that is darker in tone, maybe with more headdresses (that create shadows over the face or even dark silk veils?). In the Chelish capital, you'd see jewelry related to its infernal patrons
What you people think?
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This should totally become a repository thread for pics and inspirational information.
I'd expect a lot of countries to have fashions that run close to real life historical trends, albiet always a bit different. Some places on the other hand, like Nex and Geb, I imagine as having completely alien and/or unusual clothing design trends. Lots of vertically oriented stuffed coifs and such. Jean "Moebius" Girard-type stuff here and there too. Metal skullcaps for the whole family. Going to the ball? Don't forget your chitin headdress and fishscale gown!
Me, I'm waiting for spectacles made of think slices of obsidian glass. Hey, someone in Mystara had them! AND he wore them at night.
What you people think?
I think, you should learn how to link... ;)
(Look at the BBCode tags you can use: Button)
I would do it but have to go...
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Speaking of Golarion fashion: Embedded gems.
They look cool, whether it's for practical application(if you know who I mean) or just for decoration(Merisiel). But there's also a little element of squick to it too, y'know? Kind of like how someone can be perfectly alright with pierced navels, noses, tongues, eyebrows, but stick some metal in the forehead, chest, or between teh shoulder blades and Especially if those gems are clear enough to see through.
Do we have any real world examples of this? How does that usually work out? I had assumed Merisiel just had it adhered to her forehead until(memory gets fuzzy here) either A: a certain villain came along or B: one of the devs said otherwise. How widespread do you think the trend is? What crowds usually go in for it? Etc.
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Had to perform necromancy again because of the new art for The Pactstone Pyramid in today's blog.
It's actually something I've been wondering about: Is the current fashion among the Osirion people reflective of Ancient Egyptian fashion(as shown in that cover, though probably more concealing on average than what's presented there) like their ancestors, or is the modern Keleshite fashion more prevalent(something closer to Kyra, I suppose)?
I guess the revivication of Osirioni culture might play into that too.
I'm really curious, since Ancient Egyptians had cool hats.
Just sayin'.
I think Taldoran would be more Elizabethan than Victorian...
Lady's Court dress
Another court gown
Though it could also go Italian Renaissance for inspiration.
For the noble gentleman.
And for the lower classes.
Taldoran peasants
Making waffles
A bit of a Taldoran dandy.
Chelaxian would be a bit more Tudor or medieval German...
A gown
In some cases very Gothic.
A man's bag sleeved cotte.
A cotte and chauses
And a bad hat or two.
Further north, it is all about tunics...
Long tunic.
A Norman tunic
A simple tunic
This is a Flemish tunic, so a bit more civilized...
Part of it is knowing the lingo...cotehardies, side-less surcoats, houppelandes...
CJ
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Costumes and architecture are very important in my games. I have tons of notes on aesthetics and cues for each of the main cultures. My players can tell the difference between a Korvosan Chelaxian, a Magnimarian Chelaxian and Taldean with a quick description. I'm tempted to post my run-down here, but I'm curious if there are official guidelines for the artists. "When depicting a Chelaxian...blah blah". I'm excited to see if the Paizo peeps respond.
Edit: The links have been interesting, but I don't think a direct correlation between European Medieval and Renaissance clothing should be made. Without the concept Christian modesty, and more power assumed by women, clothing probably wouldn't be as prurient. Take fabrics and ornamentation of the Renaissance and apply it to an early-Roman silhouette (with more layers) and you're closer.
...whether it's for practical application(if you know who I mean)...Actually, I can't figure out what you mean here...unless they're spell storing repositories, which would be sweet. I can see decorative, but what practical applications were you talking about?
I'd guess cognizance crystals. It's a psionic thing. You store extra power points in them for a rainy day. :)
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I would like to know more about this. This is one area I think almost all campaign worlds tend to fail on or just over look and really shouldn't. As was said with out the influence of the church clothing would have been different. Then add in the influence of the gods of the setting and I think things would be pretty different.
I would like to see what you did but of course a offical word would also be nice. But I would like to see both.
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I would like to know more about this. This is one area I think almost all campaign worlds tend to fail on or just over look and really shouldn't. As was said with out the influence of the church clothing would have been different. Then add in the influence of the gods of the setting and I think things would be pretty different.
I would like to see what you did but of course a offical word would also be nice. But I would like to see both.
As a future Architect, cultural gaming architecture has always been important to me. As a DM, I would love to see a world with a culturally based fashion ideal. It really helps to define looks.
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...whether it's for practical application(if you know who I mean)...Actually, I can't figure out what you mean here...unless they're spell storing repositories, which would be sweet. I can see decorative, but what practical applications were you talking about?
Rise of the Runelords spoilers:
I thought it was a nice, if extreme, fluff explanation for keeping pesky enemies from swiping them out of orbit around his head.
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...whether it's for practical application(if you know who I mean)...Actually, I can't figure out what you mean here...unless they're spell storing repositories, which would be sweet. I can see decorative, but what practical applications were you talking about?Rise of the Runelords spoilers:
** spoiler omitted **
And notice how contemporary Karzoug is. 10,000 years in the ground and he's wearing a couture robe by the same designer that dressed Seoni, Ezren and Kyra. I guess severely cut heavy silks with Byzantine details never go out of style. ;)
I definitely saw Taldor as more of a Spanish stock than English, Cheliax is more English than anything else especially with the mixing of Ulfen in there.
All things considered I would have to go more Italian Renaissance for Taldor.
So are you thinking early-Tudor for Cheliax?
CJ
I guess severely cut heavy silks with Byzantine details never go out of style.
The same can be said for neon cycle shorts.... Wait a minute, how come I'm the only one wear-
D'oh!
tfad
And notice how contemporary Karzoug is. 10,000 years in the ground and he's wearing a couture robe by the same designer that dressed Seoni, Ezren and Kyra. I guess severely cut heavy silks with Byzantine details never go out of style. ;)...whether it's for practical application(if you know who I mean)...Actually, I can't figure out what you mean here...unless they're spell storing repositories, which would be sweet. I can see decorative, but what practical applications were you talking about?Rise of the Runelords spoilers:
** spoiler omitted **
You know details like this would help re-enforce elements of the setting.
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Speaking of Golarion fashion: Embedded gems.
They look cool, whether it's for practical application(if you know who I mean) or just for decoration(Merisiel). But there's also a little element of squick to it too, y'know? Kind of like how someone can be perfectly alright with pierced navels, noses, tongues, eyebrows, but stick some metal in the forehead, chest, or between teh shoulder blades and Especially if those gems are clear enough to see through.
Do we have any real world examples of this? How does that usually work out? I had assumed Merisiel just had it adhered to her forehead until(memory gets fuzzy here) either A: a certain villain came along or B: one of the devs said otherwise. How widespread do you think the trend is? What crowds usually go in for it? Etc.
There is a, relatively, new trend in the body modification industry where a specialized piece of jewelry, called a dermal anchor, is placed just beneath the skin with a post that accepts threaded ends of different shapes. The end result is a 'single point piercing' that looks like a gem, spike, ball, or disc stuck to the person, rather than a standard piercing which shows both entrance and exit. The important part is that dermal anchors can be installed, almost, anywhere on the body; forehead, chest, between shoulder blades, etc.
cheers
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I definitely saw Taldor as more of a Spanish stock than English, Cheliax is more English than anything else especially with the mixing of Ulfen in there.All things considered I would have to go more Italian Renaissance for Taldor.
So are you thinking early-Tudor for Cheliax?
CJ
I still see Taldans more as a Toreador style of dress.
For Cheliax I'm thinking more standard Fantasy dress and would draw my inspirations from Gondor/Rohan and the like.
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There is a, relatively, new trend in the body modification industry where a specialized piece of jewelry, called a dermal anchor, is placed just beneath the skin with a post that accepts threaded ends of different shapes. The end result is a 'single point piercing' that looks like a gem, spike, ball, or disc stuck to the person, rather than a standard piercing which shows both entrance and exit. The important part is that dermal anchors can be installed, almost, anywhere on the body; forehead, chest, between shoulder blades, etc.cheers
Damn. The results are cool, but the implementation still gives me the shakes.
I think I've actually seen the dermal anchor thing or something like it before. It was for something far more extreme than just decoration though(as in replacing 50% of a guy's face), and the anchors were probably bigger as well. That might be coloring my reaction. I'll have to look up the lighter version.
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I still see Taldans more as a Toreador style of dress.
For Cheliax I'm thinking more standard Fantasy dress and would draw my inspirations from Gondor/Rohan and the like.
the description of the Taldans and the custums they have (and thepicture of their "race" actually pictures the Gentlemenfrom England during the Victorian Age (quite Early).
I still see Taldans more as a Toreador style of dress.
For Cheliax I'm thinking more standard Fantasy dress and would draw my inspirations from Gondor/Rohan and the like.
the description of the Taldans and the custums they have (and thepicture of their "race" actually pictures the Gentlemenfrom England during the Victorian Age (quite Early).
I'm sort of assuming that putting the Taldan gentleman in Victorian garb is creative license on the part of the artist. I know that Golarion has printing presses and (limited) gunpowder, and magic. I'm not assuming it has the wherewithal to produce 19th century textiles.
CJ
This is one area I think almost all campaign worlds tend to fail on or just over look and really shouldn't. As was said with out the influence of the church clothing would have been different. Then add in the influence of the gods of the setting and I think things would be pretty different.
Mistress holds a very valid point there. Likewise, this is a fantasy world (and a high fantasy world at that). Fantasy and realism are, by definition, mutually exclusive, so is more often than not the case regarding historical accuracy; so while Golarian fashion may have resemblances to real world's (at one historical period or another), creativity ultimately supercedes accuracy.
Chief Creative Officer, Publisher
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I'm sort of assuming that putting the Taldan gentleman in Victorian garb is creative license on the part of the artist. I know that Golarion has printing presses and (limited) gunpowder, and magic. I'm not assuming it has the wherewithal to produce 19th century textiles.CJ
This is correct, but in some places (notably Andoran) you'd see a slight influence of 18th century clothing in the use of hose, ceremonial wigs in certain circumstances, clothing inspired in some sense from romantic paintings of the American Revolution and its heroes, but blended with D&D.
Cheliax is more medieval, without so much the "tailored" look to their fashion (except in the nobility), and the nuveau riche have a certain style and panache of their own (inspired by the most outrageously "satanic" look of Erol Otus "bad guy" art from first edition D&D.
The Linnorm Kings are Vikings. See especially Angus McBride's Vikings book for Osprey.
I'd say the smartguys from Numeria wear silver jumpsuits
Like this or this or even this
The local barbarians either wear very littleduring battle or weird colours in a more casual environment.
I agree with Taldorn being more Victorian than Tudor. Then again, I dig the "steam-punk" look in my fantasy games...