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Can someone help walk me through the Craft rules as they are used in Organized Play; particularly as it relates to variant abilities like the Inventor feat?
More specifically, I wanted to "invent" the formula for a kusarigama. Unfortunately, I failed my check and only made 1cp worth of progress. Is there anything stopping me from trying again with a new roll in the same downtime block?
If not, do I need to waste two days upfront as with Crafting? Inventor makes no mention of needing to, but I wanted to make sure before proceeding in the wrong way.
Venture-Agent, Online—VTT
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Something has gone fundamentally wrong with the specific case you're trying.
You are a genius at Crafting, easily able to determine how things are made and create new inventions. You can spend downtime to invent a common formula that you don’t know. This works just like the Craft activity: you spend half the Price of the formula up front, attempt a Crafting check, and on a success either finish the formula by paying the difference or work for longer to decrease the Price. The difference is that you spend the additional time in research, design, and development, rather than in creating an item. Once it’s complete, you add the new formula you invented to your formula book.
The GM might allow you to invent uncommon or rare formulas, typically with an increased DC. You need the Alchemical Crafting feat to invent alchemical formulas and the Magical Crafting feat to invent magical formulas.
The Inventor feat only allows you to create Common formulas without GM permissions. For Organized Play, when GMing a session, you don't give permission to legalize permanent character options like that, instead it comes down to what is im the sanctioning documents, PFS FAQ, etc.
There's nothing in the character optioms about a ruling allowing Inventor to be used to create Uncommon or Rare formulas in that campaign. It is not a method to gain Access to anything you don't have Access to.
For the general rules written up about Crafting in downtime in PFS:
Crafting: Rules for crafting equipment appear on pages 236-237 of the Player Core. Use DCs from the DCs by Level table GMC pg. 53, CRB pg. 503 with the following adjustments:
Common: None
Uncommon: Apply the hard modifier from the DC Adjustments table GMC pg. 53, CRB pg. 504
Rare: Apply the very hard modifier from the DC Adjustments table GMC pg. 53, CRB pg. 504
A few other limitations on crafting:Characters can Craft uncommon or rare items only if they have access to the applicable formulas.
Crafting requires that you spend 2 days in preparation before making Crafting checks (or 1 day, if you have the item's formula). Crafting tasks can be continued across as many Downtime days/units as necessary to complete the item.
Characters may stop crafting and pay the remainder of the Price required to finish the item at any time.
Only one crafting project may be started during a Downtime unit.
Inventor doesn't say something about those campaign rules, but it does say it works just like the Craft activity, so if trying to use Inventor to create a formula that doesn't have Access issues, it reads to me that you'd use all the same rules as Craft.
Venture-Lieutenant, Finland—Turku
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For crafting, failure doesn't mean that you earn 1 cp of progress, failure means you wasted the downtime days you spent, but you can salvage the raw materials (half of the price of the thing you attempted to craft) and don't lose any of it. You can try again, so the real issue here is that you just wasted downtime. (critical failure would have had you waste half of the materials/cost)
Hammerjack is correct about not being able to even try to invent kusarigama, though: you can't "cheat" access requirements like that. Unfortunately, the only way to gain access to Kusarigama (AFAIK) is by purchasing the Avid Collector - Treasure Vault boon (Or since it was originally in the Fists of Ruby Phoenix AP, it's probably on the chronicle sheet), which may be a bit expensive for simply a melee weapon.
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For crafting, failure doesn't mean that you earn 1 cp of progress
I knew that. That's what I get for posting late at night.
Hammerjack is correct about not being able to even try to invent kusarigama, though: you can't "cheat" access requirements like that.
To be clear, it was not my intent to try and get around anything. I already have the appropriate boon for the weapon. Since I DO have access to it, I should be able to invent the formula, right? That way, if I lose my weapon, I can more quickly craft a new one, using only one day of downtime rather than two.
...but it does say it works just like the Craft activity, so if trying to use Inventor to create a formula that doesn't have Access issues, it reads to me that you'd use all the same rules as Craft.
What if I have a formula for the formula? Can I knock a day off of it then?
Do things that effect Crating, like Junk Tinker, have any impact on Inventor? Can I save a day by incorporating junk ink and quills, moldy papers and such?
Venture-Agent, California—Silicon Valley
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To be clear, it was not my intent to try and get around anything. I already have the appropriate boon for the weapon. Since I DO have access to it, I should be able to invent the formula, right? That way, if I lose my weapon, I can more quickly craft a new one, using only one day of downtime rather than two.
Three points:
- With access, you can just buy the weapon. No need to waste downtime.- Also with access to an uncommon item, you can just buy the formula for it. PFS Formula Rule here.
- How would you even permanently lose your weapon in PFS?
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To be clear, it was not my intent to try and get around anything. I already have the appropriate boon for the weapon. Since I DO have access to it, I should be able to invent the formula, right? That way, if I lose my weapon, I can more quickly craft a new one, using only one day of downtime rather than two.Three points:
- With access, you can just buy the weapon. No need to waste downtime.
- Also with access to an uncommon item, you can just buy the formula for it. PFS Formula Rule here.
- How would you even permanently lose your weapon in PFS?
It's more to make my Invento feat do something, and to end up with a shoddy weapon that penalizes anyone except for my Junk Tinker.