Do the higher bonuses from circle of protection apply against conjured creatures, such as those brought forth by rituals rather than by the shorter term summoning spells?
They do not seem to possess the summoned trait.
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You ward a creature against a specified alignment. Choose chaotic, evil, good, or lawful when you cast this spell. The target gains a +1 status bonus to Armor Class and saving throws against creatures and effects of the chosen alignment. This bonus increases to +3 against effects from such creatures that would directly control the target and against attacks made by summoned creatures of the chosen alignment.
You ward a creature and those nearby against a specified alignment. Choose chaotic, evil, good, or lawful; this spell gains the opposing trait. Creatures in the area gain a +1 status bonus to AC against attacks by creatures of the chosen alignment and to saves against effects from such creatures. This bonus increases to +3 against effects from such creatures that directly control the target and attacks made by summoned creatures of the chosen alignment. Summoned creatures of the chosen alignment can't willingly enter the area without succeeding at a Will save; repeated attempts use the first save result.
A creature called by a conjuration spell or effect gains the summoned trait. A summoned creature can't summon other creatures, create things of value, or cast spells that require a cost. It has the minion trait. If it tries to cast a spell of equal or higher level than the spell that summoned it, it overpowers the summoning magic, causing the summoned creature's spell to fail and the summon spell to end. Otherwise, the summoned creature uses the standard abilities for a creature of its kind. It generally attacks your enemies to the best of its abilities. If you can communicate with it, you can attempt to command it, but the GM determines the degree to which it follows your commands.
Immediately when you finish Casting the Spell, the summoned creature uses its 2 actions for that turn. A summoned creature can't control any spawn or other creatures generated from it, and such creatures return to their unaltered state (usually a corpse in the case of spawn) once the summoned creature is gone. If it's unclear what this state would be, the GM decides. Summoned creatures can be banished by various spells and effects. They are automatically banished if reduced to 0 Hit Points or if the spell that called them ends.
Uncommon, Conjuration
You call upon the powers of Abaddon to grant you the assistance of a daemon. You call upon a daemon whose level can be no more than double daemonic pact’s spell level, two daemons whose levels are each at least 2 less than double the spell level, or three daemons whose levels are each at least 3 less than double the spell level.
Critical Success You conjure the daemon or daemons, and they require nothing in return for their service.
Success You conjure the daemon or daemons, who serve you willingly, but require a sacrifice in the form of spilled blood (either another creature’s or your own).
Failure You don’t conjure any daemons.
Critical Failure You don’t conjure any daemons, and the self-sacrifice required to perform the ritual leaves you drained 1 (or drained 2 if the spell level is 5 or higher).
I would say Yes, generally, although I'm sure there are exceptions out there.
Yes, but in the published adventure paths there are numerous creatures conjured through rituals, yet none of them have the summoned trait, nor are they limited to two actions for being minions.
Yes, but in the published adventure paths there are numerous creatures conjured through rituals, yet none of them have the summoned trait, nor are they limited to two actions for being minions.
Welcome to yet another example of NPCs not following PC rules for the sake of (encounter) balance.
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Yeah for some reason those sorts of encounters seem to bend the rules a bit.
I similarly just ran an encounter where the villain has an attack dinosaur, and yet she has no ability to command this creature, and it doesn't have the Minion Trait.
Maybe it has something to do with encounter design? I'd probably still say that a Protection spell would work against the creatures conjured by your ritual.
But I also wouldn't fault a GM for ruling otherwise.
Welcome to yet another example of NPCs not following PC rules for the sake of (encounter) balance.
The old "encounter design" logic? I was hoping for something with more meat. Helpful even. (Thanks for the rules quotes, Nefreet.)
NPCs and monsters follow basic rules too. They make Strikes, have limited movement, are defined by traits, etc. Things like that still matter even if they are built differently. They don't break rules any more than PCs do unless specifically stated.
Fact of the matter is, none of them have the summoned trait, and so I remain unconvinced. Per the mechanical rules, I see no reason they should be impacted by CoP.
If they were, the spell would be broken as nearly every fiend--or other creature not of the material plane--that the PCs are likely to encounter is typically conjured in some fashion.
The trait makes for a nice clean line in the sand, unlike winging it would otherwise.
Yeah for some reason those sorts of encounters seem to bend the rules a bit.
I similarly just ran an encounter where the villain has an attack dinosaur, and yet she has no ability to command this creature, and it doesn't have the Minion Trait.
Maybe it has something to do with encounter design? I'd probably still say that a Protection spell would work against the creatures conjured by your ritual.
But I also wouldn't fault a GM for ruling otherwise.
Was the villain using Command an Animal, or perhaps a unique ability in its statblock to control it? If not, then it sounds like you might have run the encounter wrong.
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She is paired with a standard Compsognathus, Creature –1, "which she has begun training to fight with her" (quoted from the text).
The compsognathus "fights the PCs until it’s injured", or until the Bugbear is slain.
Basically identical to your dilemma with conjured creatures lacking the Minion Trait.
Do NPC enemies always list all of the skills that they actually have - as though they were built as PCs?
My understanding of the creature creation guidelines is to not list anything that isn't important to the encounter. So yeah, some NPCs may end up with special abilities that their listed skills and feats wouldn't indicate that they should have.
Is that really a big deal?
Do NPC enemies always list all of the skills that they actually have - as though they were built as PCs?
My understanding of the creature creation guidelines is to not list anything that isn't important to the encounter. So yeah, some NPCs may end up with special abilities that their listed skills and feats wouldn't indicate that they should have.
Is that really a big deal?
That's not how I read the building creatures and building NPC rules. I saw that NPCs face more scrutiny than monsters mechanically due to being more comparable to PCs, and that you don't need to be precise in regards to the number of skills an NPC gets, which could mean you can cut corner on skills I suppose. I generally cut the other way and give NPCs bonus lore skills if they are doing something that their normal skill set doesn't accommodate. Like, for the situation described by Nefreet I would've given that NPC Dinosaur Lore to explain how it did that. Then again, I don't have word count limits or editors so it's probably easier for me to have longer NPC stat blocks in home games.
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Do NPC enemies always list all of the skills that they actually have - as though they were built as PCs?
My understanding of the creature creation guidelines is to not list anything that isn't important to the encounter. So yeah, some NPCs may end up with special abilities that their listed skills and feats wouldn't indicate that they should have.
Is that really a big deal?
How do you propose using Command an Animal without a listed Nature skill?
That also drastically changes the enemy's action economy, since non-Minions are 1-for-1.
How do you propose using Command an Animal without a listed Nature skill?
Make an untrained Nature check (also known as a Wisdom check).
I would suppose that often NPCs with creatures are consider a "party", not a single entity who's acquired a buddy. This should be reflected in the XP as well. Essentially it's backstory more than mechanics supporting the presence of the dinosaur (or other combatant acting as a full combatant).
On that note, I might consider Summoned creatures (for the purposes of CoP) to be those entities that are subsumed under the banner of a primary creature rather than a distinct agent on their own. Otherwise yes, a majority of extraplanar entities could be considered summoned (at least on Golarion, not so much in say the Forgotten Realms where Gates are so numerous).