In the opening scene of Temple of the Twelve, the heroes are attacked by a Thaumtech Cairncarver.
The gunners have "gunnery +12."
What? How? What does this mean?
Gunnery Check = 1d20 + the gunner’s base attack bonus or the gunner’s ranks in the Piloting skill + the gunner’s Dexterity modifier + bonuses from computer systems + bonuses from the captain and science officers + range penalty
So the entire crew is around level 2 based on the "2 ranks" next to everything the entire crew has. Gunnery is BAB or Piloting (so probably +3 BAB), then DEX. So +4 DEX? That gives +7. How do they have +12? Where is this extra +5 coming from?
Does "ranks" mean the full skill, then DEX mod again? How are they getting such a high number?
I wish the enemy ship stat block was easier to read as "+12 gunnery" is obviously a typo and I wish I could reverse-engineer this myself.
EDIT: In fact, looking at the stats, I'm certain that they took their full Piloting skill and added their Dex Mod again and then the bonus +1 to Piloting checks by the computer. That would give them +8 Piloting, +3 Dex and +1 bonus Piloting.
Meanwhile if you give them a gun they shoot at +5. And the AC of space ships is lower because there's no cover in space.
The NPC ships all seem to erroneously treat gunnery checks as a Pilot skill bonus for the NPCs (using standard monster skill bonuses, which get quite high for primary skills), rather than the correct rules of Pilot ranks + Dex.
I think it's a typo, as the Captain's gunnery is listed as "+7" earlier in the block, which is a much more understandable number. After all, Clara-247's gunnery is +6, and she was CR2 in a CR1/2 ship, so +7 for the gunners (or even +8) is reasonable.
Since it's pretty much impossible for someone's pilot bonus to be lower than their gunnery bonus (assuming max ranks), I think I'm going to just use the listed pilot bonus for the gunnery checks for when I run it tonight.
Although it IS a CR4 encounter for a tier2 opponent ship, so :shrug:
Not impossible; Piloting skill also includes things like class skill bonus and skill focus, which gunnery does not.
Since it's pretty much impossible for someone's pilot bonus to be lower than their gunnery bonus (assuming max ranks), I think I'm going to just use the listed pilot bonus for the gunnery checks for when I run it tonight.
Although it IS a CR4 encounter for a tier2 opponent ship, so :shrug:
But gunnery checks don’t use piloting bonus, they use piloting ranks.
Yeah, it would seem to be a mistake that I hope gets fixed if they decide to reprint the CRB with the updated rules for starship combat.
Also, if you look in the alien archive, the few starships that exist in the book do seem to use more correct looking bonuses. There is a tier 6 ship with +10 gunnery, and the Novaspawn is tier 8 with +12 to gunnery. To use either skill formula to generate these gunnery bonuses, like in the CRB, simply wouldn't work for the ones in AA.
I noticed that it said Gunners(2). I wonder if it SHOULD have been +6, +6 (two gunners with +6 each), and someone goofed and totaled them, instead of keeping them separate?
It feels more right in this scenario, and honestly I think that's what I'm going to do when we run across it in the game I'm hoping to run.
Honestly I didn't notice the +12 thing, and stumbled across this while I was looking for xp and money reward stats for if my players defeat it, and possibly salvage it. I'm glad you guys did though. I'm definitely going to have to keep a sharper eye on some of these stats.