Does a character sitting on the ground incur combat penalties?

[Mzuz]

I looked around and couldn't find anything on these or other forums, but my question is this. Would a sitting(on the ground) character be considered flat-footed? or Prone? For while they are not laying down, as per the prone description, I would say that they would be about as able to defend themselves as someone laying on the ground. Now, as mentioned briefly above, this isn't someone who is sitting on a chair, who would a bit higher off the ground and has a little more space to say...draw a weapon or try to hit something, or even move away from an attack. This is a character who is sitting on the ground.

or possibly, do people think that it'd just be flat-footed? As it'd be hard to defend yourself?

I'd like to know what everyone thinks. I had this come up just recently and I told them I'd just let combat proceed normally this time, but wanted to see if I could find anything that might help me with a solid answer.

Or am I just being too nitpicky, could be!

[Drahliana Moonrunner]

If you're sitting on the ground that means you're not meeting the default assumption of actively defending yourself.

Which means you incurr AOO's from everyone around you, and you have volountarily given up your dex bonuses so sneak attacks would apply.

And as a final plus, everyone who's standing that's attacking you gains the +1 higher ground advantage to hit.

Keep in mind that combat assumes constant motion. your character is not simply standing around between your initative phases, the assumption is that you're moving, dodging, and actively defending yourself.

[Mzuz]

Well, what happened is enemies got the drop on the party as they were planning at their camp. One of them, still have no idea why, was sitting outside on the ground and did not see in incoming enemies, thus during the surprise round, he was attacked. I said he was considered prone, since he was sitting on the ground and would incur those penalties. There was much discussion and to just keep things moving I made a quick decision. But, yes. I see what you are saying.

[Jhaeman]

I very well could be wrong, but I don't think sitting or kneeling is specifically discussed in the rules system. In the past, I think I've applied half the penalty that applies to being prone (-2 instead of -4 to melee attacks and AC) as a reasonable compromise.

[David knott 242]

Since "seated" is not a defined condition in Pathfinder, your best bet it probably to treat a character sitting on the ground as though he were prone. There is very little difference in his range of options from being completely prone.

[Drahliana Moonrunner]

Mzuz wrote:

Well, what happened is enemies got the drop on the party as they were planning at their camp. One of them, still have no idea why, was sitting outside on the ground and did not see in incoming enemies, thus during the surprise round, he was attacked. I said he was considered prone, since he was sitting on the ground and would incur those penalties. There was much discussion and to just keep things moving I made a quick decision. But, yes. I see what you are saying.

Context matters. The way you phrased could just as easily been a player said. "I'm going to sit down now." while a raging battle is occuring around him.

In your situation, the character is essentially flatfooted and prone.

[Mzuz]

Yes, Drahliana, a better, more specific explanation would have been better from the start. Great! I think I have it all well in hand and will let my players know the ruling on that moving forward during tomorrows session. Thanks for the help!