| Tofu Ninja |
| 1 person marked this as FAQ candidate. |
I had some questions about riding other player characters. I have seen other threads posted about this and there seems to be no consensus.
Is riding other player characters allowed assuming they are willing?
Can medium bi-pedal races such as human be used as a mount for small races? I assume they are considered ill-suited and take a -5 on ride check but are there any other problems?
How does initiative work in this case?
How does movement and full attack work for the mount and the rider?
Who is in control, is the rider in control of everything or do they act independently?
What ride checks would the rider need to make? Just to stay in the saddle or more?
For example, can a small halfling PC ride a medium human PC, providing they have the strength, an exotic saddle, and the necessary ranks in ride?
ProfPotts
|
The Ride skill lists griffons and pegasus as potential creatures to ride, and both are intelligence creatures, so riding intelligent creatures is certainly possible. The pegasus entry may be the most helpful, as it says that basically all the rider does is need to make a Ride check each round to fight at the same time the pegasus is fighting (but, one assumes due to the pegasus having an Intelligence of 10, is otherwise just a passenger).
So I'd say that the 'mount' does everything normally, and the 'rider' (on their own independent initiative count) makes a Ride check - succeed and they can act normally, fail and they spend the turn just hanging on for dear life). If they want to do a 'mounted charge' ('cos lances are nice) then I'd guess the rider would need to ready an action to attack as the mount charges.
| MeanMutton |
I had some questions about riding other player characters. I have seen other threads posted about this and there seems to be no consensus.
Is riding other player characters allowed assuming they are willing?
Can medium bi-pedal races such as human be used as a mount for small races? I assume they are considered ill-suited and take a -5 on ride check but are there any other problems?
How does initiative work in this case?
How does movement and full attack work for the mount and the rider?
Who is in control, is the rider in control of everything or do they act independently?
What ride checks would the rider need to make? Just to stay in the saddle or more?
For example, can a small halfling PC ride a medium human PC, providing they have the strength, an exotic saddle, and the necessary ranks in ride?
There really aren't very clear rules on most of this, frankly.
| Tofu Ninja |
There really aren't very clear rules on most of this, frankly.
I think that's part of the problem, the rules don't mention it at all.
This does not seem like an unreasonable thing for people to want to do in a fantasy game, especially seeing as this is not the first thread about it.
There really should be some rules about it.
| Dave Justus |
The mounted combat rules in pathfinder are pretty weak to start with.
Trying to have one PC be the mount for another takes the already weak rules and absolutely crumbles them.
From a rules point of view, the term mount is not really well defined at all, including what qualifies for a mount.
Normally of course two creatures can't share the same space, with mounts being an exception, so much of an exception that not only can the share space, but a rider actually has the same space as the mount when riding.
My ruling as been that if PCs want to take advantage of the special rules that apply to mounts, the 'mount' PC must in all respects behave like a mount, not a PC. In other words it moves on the initiative of the rider, and goes where the rider directs, if the mount PC isn't willing to do this, then it isn't a mount, and the rider is in an illegal space.
In general I prefer to discourage this, as the rules are really not very suited for it, and I do flat out disallow humanoid bipeds as mounts. Shapeshifting into a suitable creature is a possibility though, and I do allow it under those circumstances.
Theconiel
|
There is this:
You are skilled at riding mounts, usually a horse, but possibly something more exotic, like a griffon or pegasus. If you attempt to ride a creature that is ill suited as a mount, you take a –5 penalty on your Ride checks.
I would just say that a PC (or any other biped) is ill suited as a mount. Actions that don't normally require a Ride check still don't require a Ride check. Actions that do require a Ride check can still be done, but at a -5 penalty.
| Gwen Smith |
I usually treat it like the regular mounted combat rules minus the Handle Animal check:
- Your mount acts on your initiative count as you direct it. You move at its speed, but the mount uses its action to move.
- If your mount moves more than 5 feet, you can only make a single melee attack.
- If your mount charges, you also take the AC penalty associated with a charge. If you make an attack at the end of the charge, you receive the bonus gained from the charge.
- You can use ranged weapons while your mount is taking a double move, but at a –4 penalty on the attack roll. You can use ranged weapons while your mount is running (quadruple speed) at a –8 penalty. In either case, you make the attack roll when your mount has completed half its movement. You can make a full attack with a ranged weapon while your mount is moving.
- If you have your mount move both before and after you cast a spell, then you're casting the spell while the mount is moving, and you have to make a concentration check due to the vigorous motion (DC 10 + spell level) or lose the spell.
- With a DC 5 Ride check, you can guide your mount with your knees so as to use both hands to attack or defend yourself. This is a free action. (I use this as "stay on the mount while doing something else" for intelligent mounts.)
Basically, the main problem I see is players wanting to use another PC as a mount and still have the PC count as an independent character. You can't do both. As the mount, you are either doing your own thing or doing what the guy on your back tells you to you. As the rider, you are either directing the mount or you are just along for the ride.
In regular combat, characters can't "interleave" their actions so that you take a full attack in the middle of someone else's move action. (You can take a standard action by readying, but that's not important here.) Mounted characters do exactly that: ranged attackers on horseback take their full attack in the middle of their mount's movement. If the players want the characters to use this ability, then the ridden character has to be treated like a mount.
In regular combat, another character's actions don't usually restrict my actions, but in mounted combat, my mount's movement can restrict me to a single attack, impose a penalty on my attack, etc. If you don't want to have the ridden character's action impact yours, then you can't use them as a combat mount.
And so on.
There are benefits and limitations to being mounted. You can't take the benefits without the limitations, and as the GM, I wouldn't enforce the limitations without letting you take advantage of the benefits.
Oh, and don't forget about encumbrance penalties on the ridden character...
| Tofu Ninja |
Another question that may need to be addressed if riding a fellow PC is allowed - if the rider has Mounted Combat, would he be able to use a Ride check to negate a hit against his "mount" once per round?
That is a question that came up in the other threads as well, it's kinda strong, it's not balanced well for this situation, avoiding an attack based on a skill check seems too strong to me. On the other hand I guess it sort of makes sense, having a little person on your back might make it easier to avoid being hit, they would have better vantage point to see attacks coming and direct you to avoid them.