open-close pits?

[ankle biter]

Is it possible to cast "create pit" or the like and then use open-close to have the people caught permanently in the pit?
Create pit states that it is weightless meaning that it is within the weight parameters of open-close.....But open-close does not explicitly say that it can open/close either pits or holes.
To which I would point out that the pit can either be a dimensional door since it's displacing the creatures that fell in into an extra-dimensional plane, or a container since the pit is containing the creatures that fell in. Both of which state can be open-closed by the open-close spell

[Lost In Limbo]

The spell seems to indicate that Open-Close can only open/close things that could normally be opened or closed. So if you think someone could manually pull together the sides of a Pit like they were closing a bag, then go for it.

[Guru-Meditation]

No.

There is nothing to open or close in the pit spells.

[My Self]

What happens if you cover the top with something like Stone Shape or Wall of Force while there are creatures in the pit? What happens when the pit closes?

[Gauss]

Why is it people are always trying to turn Create Pit into 'insta-kill pit'? That is clearly beyond the scope of the spell.

My Self, there are many threads covering create pit and why it would/wouldn't work. The simplest answer is, it shouldn't be allowed to work even if you think it could work.

[My Self]

Gauss wrote:

Why is it people are always trying to turn Create Pit into 'insta-kill pit'? That is clearly beyond the scope of the spell.

My Self, there are many threads covering create pit and why it would/wouldn't work. The simplest answer is, it shouldn't be allowed to work even if you think it could work.

Fair enough. In-game, would it be best to say the pit doesn't fully close or that the wall/obstruction has an extradimensional hole (from the pit) that allows the person to exit?

Though if the entire room becomes legitimately buried, the person in the pit probably gets buried with the rest of the room. No?

[Gauss]

There is a significant difference between "cover the pit with a wall" and "fill the room that the entrance to the pit is in".

The second one is generally beyond the scope of most characters. The first is relatively easy to accomplish but should not result in 'insta-kill'. Many threads have discussed the first and one of the responses is "the entrance to the pit is moved to the new surface...ie the wall placed on top".

[My Self]

Gauss wrote:

There is a significant difference between "cover the pit with a wall" and "fill the room that the entrance to the pit is in".

The second one is generally beyond the scope of most characters. The first is relatively easy to accomplish but should not result in 'insta-kill'. Many threads have discussed the first and one of the responses is "the entrance to the pit is moved to the new surface...ie the wall placed on top".

Sounds good. Thanks for the response. Seems like you answered the OP with that one, too.

[Gauss]

Actually, the OP was asking an entirely different question. He wants to use the spell "Open/Close" to close the Pit. That is not possible. The pit has no door to close.

[My Self]

Gauss wrote:

Actually, the OP was asking an entirely different question. He wants to use the spell "Open/Close" to close the Pit. That is not possible. The pit has no door to close.

But as a balance issue, you noted that spells of that level (create pit) shouldn't be able to instakill enemies. Using a cantrip instead of a wall-creating spell would make the instakill more accessible, and allow it to fall under the same argument that it shouldn't be able to instakill.

... did I just argue that you were making an argument that supported my argument? Maybe I should just go sleep.

[Gauss]

LOL

[Crimeo]

I don't see why putting a wall over the pit would shift its opening, that doesn't seem supported anywhere.

However, a 1 inch thick or whatever wall of stone would just break when a creature of any significance was forced against it. Stone isn't very strong against that sort of force, snapping. Might do a small amount of damage, 2d6 or something. Should probably even get a strength check to brace and break it before your body does haphazardly too.

Iron wall isn't attached, so again only minor damage equivalent to what it says for falling on people, if not less.

If you can cast like 5 stone walls on top, okay well you deserve to kill the thing then.

[Gauss]

Crimeo,

Please re-read what I wrote. I did not say it would. I specifically stated that it was what some people in other threads came up with.

As I stated earlier, there are many threads on it. Rather than debating it all over again, I suggest looking up those threads to see how people deal with it.