If Batman needs Robin, the Vigilante needs…

[LMPjr007]

Introducing the Sidekick (Archetype)

Some vigilantes don't work alone. They fight their battles with a stalwart companion at their side, a person who shares their convictions and studiously trains under the vigilante's tutelage. Perhaps one day this young person will rise up to replace her mentor. Perhaps she will move on to take the fight to another locale. Whatever the case, the sidekick battles with and learns from another vigilante, whether an older NPC or another player character.

A new Archetype for use with the Pathfinder Role Playing Game Open Playest of the new Base Class, The Vigilante. Download the Sidekick (Archetype) Playtest Here and tell us what you think!

[Blayde MacRonan]

I don't know if it's just my copy or not, but the Take Up the Mantle ability isn't complete. In fact, it ends mid sentence during the second paragraph.

[Bandw2]

or just get the leadership feat...

[Shadowborn]

Blayde MacRonan wrote:

I don't know if it's just my copy or not, but the Take Up the Mantle ability isn't complete. In fact, it ends mid sentence during the second paragraph.

The last line of the take up the mantle ability should read: "The former sidekick must still take the necessary steps to gain renown in her social identity."

[Shadowborn]

Bandw2 wrote:

or just get the leadership feat...

This is an archetype. It's meant to be a PC, not a cohort. Though a vigilante with a cohort for a sidekick could work. I wonder which ability would be appropriate to switch out for that?

[Bandw2]

Shadowborn wrote:

Bandw2 wrote:

or just get the leadership feat...

This is an archetype. It's meant to be a PC, not a cohort. Though a vigilante with a cohort for a sidekick could work. I wonder which ability would be appropriate to switch out for that?

That was not obvious from his post, and well, i'm at work.

[Extra Anchovies]

Hm. First, it needs to say somewhere that you need to have a mentor to take this archetype; it's mentioned in the fluff that they fight alongside someone else, but having a mentor isn't actually required anywhere. Unless that's intentional.

Oath of Loyalty is pointless, IMO. A sidekick following his mentor's directions should be fluff, not mechanics. Any player who needs to be forced to have their character obey their mentor won't be playing a Sidekick in the first place. But it replaces Renown so at least I don't lose anything that I'd ever miss... or even notice.

I like luck pool. You'll want to specify that each point spent grants a stacking +1 bonus. The recovery method could be gamed by making a Perception check every round and/or casting Resistance on yourself and trying to save against it every round, so you'll want to gate the recovery somehow (maybe they can only recover 1 point per 10 minutes when not in combat?). It replaces Loyal Aid, which is fine, because a PC who stays in one area long enough will have a few allies regardless of any ally-granting class features.

Emulation is neat, especially gaining access to talents. Needing to meet prerequisites is annoying but kind of necessary. Would be nice if they could get two feats at 10th and three feats or two talents at 15th, with the action cost staying at a single move action.

Taunt is nice. Might want to say that the target is sickened until they attack the sidekick or until 1 round has passed, whichever comes first. Also this ability doesn't specify the level at which it comes online.

Harm's Way is alright but not particularly useful.

Take Up the Mantle isn't any good unless you change your mind about trading away the Startling Appearance chain.

Overall, the archetype is good. I'd take it for sure, but only because it gives up a mix of class features that aren't particularly great and gets some things that would be actually useful in normal play. The only things I'd miss at all are the Startling/Frightening/Stunning appearance line, and even those are very situational because it's not all that common for players to be able to get the jump on enemies that aren't just mooks.

[Valantrix1]

Batman doesn't need anyone, and if he does, there is leadership.

[Shadowborn]

Extra Anchovies wrote:

A lot of good stuff...

Thanks for your feedback. I'll see if some updates can be made to the material in the next day or so, including adding Mentor to the 1st level abilities to help clarify the relationship between sidekick and mentor.

[Kazaan]

Valantrix1 wrote:

Batman doesn't need anyone, and if he does, there is leadership.

There's a reason Batman trained various Robins over the course of his career. He needs a sidekick because it is his ultimate insurance against himself going bad. Batman has plans to counter any and every other superhero going rogue; he has a plan to stop Superman, Flash, Wonder Woman, everyone. But what happens if Batman goes Rogue and someone needs to stop him? Where's Batman's plan for Batman? Robin. Batman has trained Robin to know his fighting style and gadgets inside and out. Robin's ultimate job is to stop Batman if Batman goes over the edge.

That having been said, a Cohort would be nice because, if your main character dies, you already have a backup character ready to go.

[Purple Dragon Knight]

Batman definitely has the paranoid drawback

[Create Mr. Pitt]

I'm four different characters, table!

[Shadowborn]

Create Mr. Pitt wrote:

I'm four different characters, table!

Only if you're playing both the sidekick and the vigilante PC that is her mentor. You could, you know, let another player have one of them.

[Purple Dragon Knight]

Why have one secret identity, when you can have many.

Why not I say? :)

[LMPjr007]

Resurrecting this old thread now that Ultimate Intrigue added to Exhibit B of the Pathfinder Compatibility License. So those who wanted to check out Sidekick (Archetype), a new Archetype for use with the Pathfinder Role Playing Game Open Playest of the new Base Class, The Vigilante. Download the Sidekick (Archetype) Playtest Here and tell us what you think!

[Mark Thomas 66]

The sidekick could be a feature of the Vigilante archetype that gives a variant leadership. At which point the sidekick is a living class feature like the Paladin's mount or Ranger's animal companion.

[Shadowborn]

Mark Thomas 66 wrote:

The sidekick could be a feature of the Vigilante archetype that gives a variant leadership. At which point the sidekick is a living class feature like the Paladin's mount or Ranger's animal companion.

That could make for an interesting archetype.

Honestly, I'd really like to see the finalized version of the vigilante and give the sidekick another go-over afterward, but I suppose people can pick it apart now if they'd like.

Also, Louis, that link just takes me to the message board main page.

[Here4daFreeSwag]

Good to see some free sidekicking stuff, return. ;)

Quote:

Shadowborn wrote:

Also, Louis, that link just takes me to the message board main page.

You should go with the very first link on top; the one that goes to rpgnow. ;)

[LMPjr007]

Here4daFreeSwag wrote:

Good to see some free sidekicking stuff, return. ;)

Quote:

Shadowborn wrote:

Also, Louis, that link just takes me to the message board main page.

You should go with the very first link on top; the one that goes to rpgnow. ;)

Here you go!