Hello, in my ongoing quest of understanding how the Creation of Magic items work i ran again into some questions.
My characters is currently residing in a Underground town and has decided that he wants to create some magic items..(he is a bard).
He will stay 2 days in this city before continuing to travel for 10 days.
On the first day in the city he wants to create a Quickrunners shirt
1000 GP= 1 Day of Work= 8 Hours.
However, he also wants to create an item, i call: "Sherlocks Pipe"
Its simple: If he has it between his teeth or on his lips, the pipe allows him to use "Detect evil" as mentioned in the Spell Description.
This means the base price is
1x1x2000x1.5= 3000 GP (That means he has to spend 1500 GP on its creation and 3 days on crafting)
A Cleric will provide the Spell, meaning he will be with me for the Crafting time. (Making the DC go up by 5)
However my Bard has a ring of Sustenance!
1.Is it possible for him to use more than 8 hours on this item? He only needs 2 hours of sleep,1 hour for spell preparation, so he could use the other 21 hours of the day as he likes right?
2. Is it possible to craft while being in a carriage (we could get one for the underground travel), and would that affect the crafting time? I know it does if i travel normally but this seems way more comfortable, specially if my companions take over my shifts and duties.
3. "If spells are involved in the prerequisites for making the item, the creator must have prepared the spells to be cast (or must know the spells, in the case of a sorcerer or bard) but need not provide any material components or focuses the spells require. The act of working on the item triggers the prepared spells, making them unavailable for casting during each day of the item's creation. (That is, those spell slots are expended from the caster's currently prepared spells, just as if they had been cast.)"
A) Does that mean i can not aid my companions in fighting outside the 8 hours of crafting?
b) does that mean i can't use the spell necessary for the creation of the item (In case of Quickrunners shirt: Haste) for the rest of the day or does it only burn one "Use" of the spell for that day?
I think thats all..Thanks in advance, and i´m sry for making errors, english is not my first language. I also hope that idea of creating a detect evil pipe is a good one ^^
Ive played a few item crafters, PF makes it pretty easy unlike 3.5, here is my take on your questions.
1.Is it possible for him to use more than 8 hours on this item? He only needs 2 hours of sleep,1 hour for spell preparation, so he could use the other 21 hours of the day as he likes right?
I would say no, you can not use this extra time to craft. Even if you don't require sleep at all, there are hard limits on how much you can craft in a given day. A creature without your ring would still have 16 hours awake, yet can only use 8 to craft. You are no different. Though, you might be able to craft while your companions sleep, which could be useful.
2. Is it possible to craft while being in a carriage (we could get one for the underground travel), and would that affect the crafting time? I know it does if i travel normally but this seems way more comfortable, specially if my companions take over my shifts and duties.
I'd say it depends on how comfortable your carriage is. Are we talking a luxury railroad car? Or like, an open top wagon being pulled by donkeys? "The creator also needs a fairly quiet, comfortable, and well-lit place in which to work. Any place suitable for preparing spells is suitable for making items." I'm playing in a seafaring game, my DM said my character's cabin qualifies for a quiet, comfortable, well lit place. If you're sharing the back of a wagon with a few other people, I'd say that doesn't qualify.
A) Does that mean i can not aid my companions in fighting outside the 8 hours of crafting?If you do any "adventuring", you are not spending the day crafting, but you can still get some crafting done. Check out the rules on crafting while adventuring. You must spend 4 hours through out the day working, but only get 2 hours of effective work.
...
b) does that mean i can't use the spell necessary for the creation of the item (In case of
Regarding 2:
I would probably be alone in the carriage now. But i have to ask my DM. Thanks!Regarding 3 B:
Actually i did not know that. We just assumed you need somebody who can cast the spell and then get the DC up by 5. So really we made it even harder than necessary. Thats a good input thanks!
Nardoz Zardoz is close, but not quite correct.
However, he also wants to create an item, i call: "Sherlocks Pipe"
Its simple: If he has it between his teeth or on his lips, the pipe allows him to use "Detect evil" as mentioned in the Spell Description.
This means the base price is
1x1x2000x1.5= 3000 GP (That means he has to spend 1500 GP on its creation and 3 days on crafting)
For reference: detect-evil
You have the correct price for a continuous item.Your fluff describes a use on command item. Price is 1*1*1800, and needs a standard action to activate.
Either way, it needs GM approval of what it does and what its price is.
A Cleric will provide the Spell, meaning he will be with me for the Crafting time. (Making the DC go up by 5)
Note that all items have prerequisites in their descriptions. These prerequisites must be met for the item to be created. Most of the time, they take the form of spells that must be known by the item's creator (although access through another magic item or spellcaster is allowed). The DC to create a magic item increases by +5 for each prerequisite the caster does not meet. The only exception to this is the requisite item creation feat, which is mandatory. In addition, you cannot create potions, spell-trigger, or spell-completion magic items without meeting their spell prerequisites.
DC does not change if another provides the spell.
However my Bard has a ring of Sustenance!
1.Is it possible for him to use more than 8 hours on this item? He only needs 2 hours of sleep,1 hour for spell preparation, so he could use the other 21 hours of the day as he likes right?
No. Eight hours is a hard limit on magic crafting.
The caster can work for up to 8 hours each day. He cannot rush the process by working longer each day, but the days need not be consecutive, and the caster can use the rest of his time as he sees fit. If the caster is out adventuring, he can devote 4 hours each day to item creation, although he nets only 2 hours' worth of work. This time is not spent in one continuous period, but rather during lunch, morning preparation, and during watches at night. If time is dedicated to creation, it must be spent in uninterrupted 4-hour blocks. This work is generally done in a controlled environment, where distractions are at a minimum, such as a laboratory or shrine. Work that is performed in a distracting or dangerous environment nets only half the amount of progress (just as with the adventuring caster).
However:
This process can be accelerated to 4 hours of work per 1,000 gp in the item's base price (or fraction thereof) by increasing the DC to create the item by +5.
So, at +5 DC, you can improve the rate you craft at.
2. Is it possible to craft while being in a carriage (we could get one for the underground travel), and would that affect the crafting time? I know it does if i travel normally but this seems way more comfortable, specially if my companions take over my shifts and duties.
Maybe, definitely a GM call:
The creator also needs a fairly quiet, comfortable, and well-lit place in which to work. Any place suitable for preparing spells is suitable for making items.
3. "If spells are involved in the prerequisites for making the item, the creator must have prepared the spells to be cast (or must know the spells, in the case of a sorcerer or bard) but need not provide any material components or focuses the spells require. The act of working on the item triggers the prepared spells, making them unavailable for casting during each day of the item's creation. (That is, those spell slots are expended from the caster's currently prepared spells, just as if they had been cast.)"
A) Does that mean i can not aid my companions in fighting outside the 8 hours of crafting?
Any spell slot used in crafting is not available adventuring, and visa-versa. If you used all your 3rd level spell adventuring during the day, you cannot craft anything needing a 3rd level spell that night unless you supply it with another caster's spell or item's spell. Just a normal allocation of resources.
b) does that mean i can't use the spell necessary for the creation of the item (In case of Quickrunners shirt: Haste) for the rest of the day or does it only burn one "Use" of the spell for that day?
One suitable slot per spell provided.
I think thats all..Thanks in advance, and i´m sry for making errors, english is not my first language. I also hope that idea of creating a detect evil pipe is a good one ^^
If the caster is out adventuring, he can devote 4 hours each day to item creation, although he nets only 2 hours' worth of work. This time is not spent in one continuous period, but rather during lunch, morning preparation, and during watches at night. If time is dedicated to creation, it must be spent in uninterrupted 4-hour blocks. This work is generally done in a controlled environment, where distractions are at a minimum, such as a laboratory or shrine. Work that is performed in a distracting or dangerous environment nets only half the amount of progress (just as with the adventuring caster).
If you can get in a 4 hour block, it will be worth 4 hours of crafting. If interrupted, it drops to 2 hours. If you use your ring to craft while adventuring as others sleep, you can get a full 8 hours in with 2 blocks of 4 hours.
Read the whole page I linked above on Magic Item Creation. It should answer a lot of your questions.
/cevah
A Cleric will provide the Spell, meaning he will be with me for the Crafting time. (Making the DC go up by 5)
Note that all items have prerequisites in their descriptions. These prerequisites must be met for the item to be created. Most of the time, they take the form of spells that must be known by the item's creator (although access through another magic item or spellcaster is allowed). The DC to create a magic item increases by +5 for each prerequisite the caster does not meet. The only exception to this is the requisite item creation feat, which is mandatory. In addition, you cannot create potions, spell-trigger, or spell-completion magic items without meeting their spell prerequisites.DC does not change if another provides the spell.
Now that is a completely different answer from the one i got on Reddit for example. The thing is is
Note that all items have prerequisites in their descriptions. These prerequisites must be met for the item to be created. Most of the time, they take the form of spells that must be known by the item's creator (although access through another magic item or spellcaster is allowed). The DC to create a magic item increases by +5 for each prerequisite the caster does not meet. The only exception to this is the requisite item creation feat, which is mandatory. In addition, you cannot create potions, spell-trigger, or spell-completion magic items without meeting their spell prerequisites.
I do not meet that prerequisite, the Cleric does. I only provide the feat necessary for the creation of the item. Thus the DC would have to go up.
Also does the Pipe count as a "Spell-Trigger" item?
Thank you in advance
If the DC goes up +5 when you don't supply the spell, and it also goes up when you pay someone else to supply the spell, why would you ever pay? That does not make sense.
You are fulfilling the prerequisite in a way approved by the text: supplying the spell via other caster or item.
Spell trigger activation is similar to spell completion, but it's even simpler. No gestures or spell finishing is needed, just a special knowledge of spellcasting that an appropriate character would know, and a single word that must be spoken. Spell trigger items can be used by anyone whose class can cast the corresponding spell. This is the case even for a character who can't actually cast spells, such as a 3rd-level paladin. The user must still determine what spell is stored in the item before she can activate it. Activating a spell trigger item is a standard action and does not provoke attacks of opportunity.
This is standard for wands and staves.
If the activation is on command or if no activation method is suggested either in the magic item description or by the nature of the item, assume that a command word is needed to activate it. Command word activation means that a character speaks the word and the item activates. No other special knowledge is needed.
A command word can be a real word, but when this is the case, the holder of the item runs the risk of activating the item accidentally by speaking the word in normal conversation. More often, the command word is some nonsensical word, or a word or phrase from an ancient language. Activating a command word magic item is a standard action and does not provoke attacks of opportunity.
Sometimes the command word to activate an item is written right on the item. Occasionally, it might be hidden within a pattern or design engraved, carved, or built into the item, or the item might bear a clue to the command word.
The Knowledge (arcana) and Knowledge (history) skills might be useful in helping to identify command words or deciphering clues regarding them. A successful check against DC 30 is needed to come up with the word itself. If that check is failed, succeeding on a second check (DC 25) might provide some insight into a clue. The spells detect magic, identify, and analyze dweomer all reveal command words if the properties of the item are successfully identified.
This is what I suggested.
/cevah
Short update: Me and My GM finally worked out all the kinks of the Crafting, yet to get sure i just want to ask if i had the calculation of the base Price right.
1(Caster level)x1(Spell Level)x2000(Use Activated)x1.5 (10 minutes per level)= 3000 GP
But considering it is a slotless Item shouldn't the formula be:
spelllevel 1, casterlevel 1, use-activated 2000, not taking a body slot 2, 10minutesprolevel 1.5 - 1*1*2000*2*1.5=6000 GP
It means i have to spend 3000 GP and 6 Days on the Creation of the Item.
Which one is correct? Thanks again and my deepest apologies for being this annoying.
Short update: Me and My GM finally worked out all the kinks of the Crafting, yet to get sure i just want to ask if i had the calculation of the base Price right.
Nope, you do not have the calculations right. The proper calculation is:
<whatever the GM says it costs>
This is because if you blindly plug in the formula, you can get stupid things like a use-activated sword of true strike with a +20 bonus for less than the cost of a +2 sword. So the most important question is "does it feel like a 3000 gp item (a lesser minor item) or more like a 6000 gp item (a greater minor item)?"
Off-hand, I'd say that "detect evil at will" would be roughly equivalent to the deathwatch eyes or spectacles of understanding, but since it doesn't take up the eye slot as they would, I'd push it into the 6000 gp range. But that's a call based not on the formula but on comparable items.
And I'd be strongly tempted to disallow it entirely, because the equivalent paladin class ability has broken too many games when people start scanning the room for everyone evil to short-circuit the skill challenge. ("Oh, the Grand Vizier is evil! Now we know who will kidnap the princess!") If your GM thinks that's a consideration (based on the effect it will have on the campaign), the price could go up as high as she likes.