| 2 people marked this as a favorite. |
I'm sorry, guys. I just got my copy of the book and...
Paizo, you f@#%ed up big time.
Before, the rogue had appeal. It was not broken. The rogue was a roleplaying class and was designed to roleplay. It was not meant to be the best at DPR, but it was the absolute king of skills. That was all it needed. The rogue was not exactly a "munchkin-friendly" class, but I think we'd all rather reward thoughtful playstyles, wouldn't we?
I've been playing a rogue in my Age of Worms game for the last few months and you know what? I've been doing great! I've found every trap and been able to exploit the weakness of every encounter, and you know why?
Because I play smart.
"Oh, but powergamers are smart! Waaa waa waaaaa!" I hear you saying. Well, first off, stop crying, this is a game, dumbass. Second—okay, I'll concede powergamers use numbers, but that doesn't make them smart. You know who had big numbers? I'll give you a hint, they were polling numbers and they were in Germany. This is a joke, by the way. I know rollplayers have trouble identifying humor, so I'm just gonna clarify—please don't bother flagging me. I'm just kidding around, relax.
Anyways, no. Just...no. I don't rollplay smart. I roleplay smart. By making the rogue just another "I roll 1d20, I hit, I kill it, I loot the room" meatshield, you've robbed it of its flavor and its distinctiveness. I'm pretty sure I chose not to play 4E specifically to avoid this b!#+&!%#.
Congrats, Paizo. You caved to the powergamers. I suppose Book of Weeaboo Fightan Magic is next? Fine. I, for one, will be continuing to play Pathfinder the way Gygax intended.
EDIT: The monk changes are good though. I was getting sick of my monk buddy always making his Will saves and not killing me.
Back in your box, player scum.
I repot u
The thing about True Rogues (I refuse to acknowledge Unchained as a real Paizo sourcebook, since it reads like it was written by monkeys or Cosmos or something) is that they were a roleplaying class. Sure, classes like summoner or wizard might seem powerful, but they're a lot worse for roleplaying.
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
Guys I'm just trying to have a discussion about a common misconception and honestly I'm feeling so attacked right now.
I knew better than this. I know I did.
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
I knew better than this. I know I did.
Given your post history, you really don't and never have. It stopped being funny or cute ages ago.
I'm sorry to everyone I've ever mocked, including the people mocked in this OP. Even though it's actually a symptom of a tragic inferiority complex that comes from being a kobold. And even though you all deserve it.
It may just be that I'm tired but I don't see where you actually said what you were complaining about. What did the Unchained Rogue do to earn your ire?
Powergaming and anti-roleplay.
This thread amuses me, possibly because I haven't seen the new Rogue.
I did rather like the old Rogue. It was one of those classes that required some skill to use effectively, but when it was, it was one of the better classes. Maybe not in terms of damage so far as flexibility and the ability to eliminate threats before combat even became a thing. This is contrasted with some of the more "broken" classes, which were really easy to utilize to make powerhouses, but ended up being very 'meh' at higher levels. It's sort of like Diablo 3: The Barbarian was one of the easier classes to pick up for most people, but ended up having a horrible endgame, especially after the patches when greater rifts became a thing, while harder to use classes like Witch Doctor, while initially less friendly to players in the beginning, really shined at the end game of D3. It's an odd comparison, but those who have played the game know what I'm talking about. Rogue had a lower 'power floor' on average, but has a high 'power ceiling', whereas 'broken classes' had higher 'power floors' but lower 'power ceilings'. Does that make sense?
Getting away from that tangent though, what makes the Unchained Rogue broken? I was planning on picking up a copy of Pathfinder Unchained solely for the supposedly amazing Monk variant, but am still curious about Rogues, as that is one of my favorite classes ever, right behind Paladin and Sorceror.
This thread amuses me, possibly because I haven't seen the new Rogue.
Me neither!
I actually do not hold your views and I was being a dick about it. I think this thread was a bit below my usual "caliber", being a bit more pointed than I like. If we can do this safely, though, I'll say this: While the rogue's role is not underpowered, the rogue itself just didn't have much unique about it. I believe that the rogue suffered somewhat as a result. A bard could be skillier, a ranger could be sneakier, and that's even just working with the CRB. A rogue could work fine in a game, but by the plain numbers, it fell far behind.
I think the Unchained Rogue sounds awesome and a wonderful modification that adds abilities to distinguish the rogue a lot more. I don't want to make this a debate, since I think it's awesome that we don't need to debate this anymore. It's all practically rhetorical at this point.
I literally could not agree more. If I tried I would literally explode from agreement.
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
I'm probably giving this more attention than it deserves but I still don't see an actual thesis here. You said Paizo "caved to the powergamers" but you never say what about the Unchained Rogue actually does that. You said the core Rogue is better at roleplaying but don't give any examples of how the new version is different. You imply that Unchained is poorly written (by monkeys, no less) but you never gave an example of poor writing. Later on, you say you haven't even seen the new version but it sounds awesome. I assume it's all meant to be a joke about people saying the core Rogue is mechanically weak but if it's all a joke then it needs a punch line. I see no punch line. I conclude that you did not, in fact, "know better" and I will now console myself with the knowledge that somewhere there is a moderator who remains blissfully ignorant of what has transpired here tonight.
| 2 people marked this as a favorite. |
