claudekennilol
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If I'm on a mount, and I walk in a circle around an enemy, do we both provoke? My mount is the one doing the movement, but am I a legal target since I left a threatened square? Likewise, assuming the enemy had combat reflexes, is there anything that would stop the enemy from taking one AoO each against both me and my mount (because I'm walking in a circle around them and leaving multiple threatened squares)?
| bbangerter |
As with most mounted combat questions, the rules aren't clear/don't exist.
Personally I find it easiest to just treat the mount and the rider as a single creature for most things and it solves a lot of the problems with mounted questions. In this case I'd treat it as provoking only a single AoO which may be taken against the combined mount/rider.
Now of course treating them as a single unit when making the attack doesn't make sense, so the creature making the AoO can choose one or the other to target for AC to beat and damage to be dealt to. (This is all how I would handle it, not specifically supported or denied by rules text).
| Gilfalas |
If I'm on a mount, and I walk in a circle around an enemy, do we both provoke? My mount is the one doing the movement, but am I a legal target since I left a threatened square? Likewise, assuming the enemy had combat reflexes, is there anything that would stop the enemy from taking one AoO each against both me and my mount (because I'm walking in a circle around them and leaving multiple threatened squares)?
I believe the riding rules intend for rider and mount to be treated as a single entity for these purposes so you would only provoke once for the movement, although I would assume the AoO could be aimed at either your mount or you at the attackers choice.
| DM_Blake |
There is no common sense answer here either:
Let's say you only make one move that provokes (5' but it's not a free move, maybe it's rough terrain). I have Combat Reflexes so maybe both you and your mount provoke and maybe I can attack you both.
Scenario 1: I have a greatsword. Can I make an AoO against both you and your mount? Common sense says "no" - you only crossed 1 border between squares. That is just a single instant of time that provokes. It makes no sense that I could get two separate swings with one greatsword based on one single provoke.
Scenario 2: I have two shortswords. Now can I make an AoO against both you and your mount? Common sense says "yes" - You crossed 1 border between squares, a single instant of time that provokes, and in a single instant of time I can make an attack with each shortsword.
Scenario 3: Same as #2 but you're not mounted - you just make the move on foot. Now can I make an AoO against you with each shortsword? If scenario 2 makes sense, then the common sense answer MUST be "yes" for the same reason: I have two weapons and can use them both in the same instant that you provoke once.
But regarding #3, the rules say "no".
Based on the rules for #3, we can reverse engineer scenario 2 to also be "no" - the situation is the same but more target-rich, but the action economy is also the same and the rules only allow one AoO in response to one provoking action, no matter how many weapons you have.
This probably contradicts common sense.
And once we work backward to #2, we can work backward even more to #1 and confirm our common sense with the rules - if I can't do it with two swords, I surely can't do it with one.
At least this seems to confirm common sense.
So, for a mount and rider moving just a single space that provokes, you can only get one AoO. QED.
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Now which one can I hit?
Either the rider or the mount, the attacker chooses which one.
This is based on the rule that says that you move with your mount, so clearly you and your mount are both moving out of the threatened space. You're both provoking an AoO but I only get one. As will all other attacks in combat, it's always the attacker's choice to decide who to attack.
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And, finally, if you keep moving around me can I make additional attacks of opportunity?
No. Because Combat Reflexes specifically covers this situation and says "Moving out of more than one square threatened by the same opponent in the same round doesn't count as more than one opportunity for that opponent". So no matter how many squares you move around me, it is only one opportunity - it does not matter which I attack, you or your mount, I only have one opportunity so I only have one AoO.
| Komoda |
The answer is mount and rider both provoke. It doesn't matter what the "instant in time" is.
Going prone and being tripped are both the same "instant in time" yet they both have the potential to provoke from the same attacker (given the proper feats, of course).
The attacker would be limited to attacking each of you once, barring any crazy feats/abilities I am not aware of.
claudekennilol
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What about this? I'm approaching a large humanoid (so it has reach) let's just call it an Ogre. I'm on a Horse. I don't have a reach weapon. So I move up to his range. I continue moving. Diagram below.
H = Horse
O = Ogre
x = empty
HHxOO
HHxOO
to
xHHOO
xHHOO
I moved forward, but I'm still within the same threatened space (column 2). Did I leave a threatened space if I'm still in it?
| Gwen Smith |
If any part of you left a threatened square and you moved more than 5 feet, you provoke.
I've seen a lot of GMs adjudicate large (and bigger) creature movement by picking a single corner and tracking the movement from that corner. If there's a corner of the squares you occupy that is in a threatened area, follow that corner through the movement. If it provokes following that corner, then it provokes.