Cass feature vs. Altered Class feature

[Papa-DRB]

A buddy of mine is thinking about running the latest AP with an all dwarf party. I am considering a Goliath Druid 6 / Horizon Walker 1 / Nature Warden 10 character.

In order to qualify for Nature Warden, one of the requirement is "wild empathy class feature", however the Goliath Druid alters this "Primal Empathy (Ex) A goliath druid's wild empathy functions only with creatures that are Large or larger. This ability alters wild empathy."

So, does Altered Class Feature <wild empathy> still count as Class Feature <wild empathy> or not?

-- david

[Canthin]

Papa-DRB wrote:

A buddy of mine is thinking about running the latest AP with an all dwarf party. I am considering a Goliath Druid 6 / Horizon Walker 1 / Nature Warden 10 character.

In order to qualify for Nature Warden, one of the requirement is "wild empathy class feature", however the Goliath Druid alters this "Primal Empathy (Ex) A goliath druid's wild empathy functions only with creatures that are Large or larger. This ability alters wild empathy."

So, does Altered Class Feature <wild empathy> still count as Class Feature <wild empathy> or not?

-- david

I think RAW Wild Empathy and Primal Empathy are two separate abilities. In a case like this, I would check with your GM to see what he thinks.

There are many altered class features that keep the names the same for these kinds of purposes. (Example: Mountain Druids get "Wild Shape", but it is altered from the normal Wild Shape ability. It isn't renamed, so they can take Feats or Prestige Classes that require "Wild Shape" even though they can't turn into plants)

Personally, I would totally let you substitute Primal Empathy for Wild Empathy. Some GMs might not.

[Seranov]

RAW, I agree that Primal Empathy is technically a different ability than Wild Empathy. If you read it, however, it just says that your Wild Empathy only works on Large+ creatures. So you could ask your DM if it could work for your purposes. If he says "no", however, you're up a creek. :x

[Nefreet]

You don't possess the package of abilities that "Wild Empathy" encompasses, so it would not qualify.

I, also, however, don't see much harm in houseruling it to work.

Just ask your GM.

[Calth]

Primal Empathy unequivocally counts as wild empathy.

Archetype: If an archetype replaces a class ability with a more specific version of that ability (or one that works similarly to the replaced ability), does the archetype's ability count as the original ability for the purpose of rules that improve the original ability?

It depends on how the archetype's ability is worded. If the archetype ability says it works like the standard ability, it counts as that ability. (FAQ continues, but this is the relevant portion).

Primal empathy says it works like wild empathy, with certain restrictions. It therefore counts as wild empathy for the purposes of prerequisites.