Wrath of the Righteous is my GF and my favorite Adventure Path. PACG is our favorite card game. And so, with these two elements coming together, we had to try to make our party from that Adventure as PACG cards. There are 6 total, so I'm going to get started on them. Please let me know what you think! I encourage all feedback.
(Note: the Blessings listed here are our homebrew world's gods. We generally translate the Golarion Deities over to our own when we play the card game. However, since we don't know what blessings are in Wrath, we couldn't determine those at this point, so we've left them with their original names)
Hawk:
Hawk was the cleric of the team, and overall nice guy. It was a shame that he turned out to be a terrible healer (you have never seen so many 1's rolled on cure spells, I guarantee). Because of that, he learned to focus more on debuffs and support abilities. Over time, he came to learn he was the son of his patron God, and grew to reflect that more and more, eventually even being able to assume a beast form.
Hawk:
Male Tiefling Cleric
Strength: d6 []+1 []+2 []+3
-Melee: Strength+2
Dexterity: d4 []+1
Constitution: d6 []+1 []+2
Intelligence: d6 []+1
Wisdom: d12 []+1 []+2 []+3 []+4
-Divine: Wisdom+2
Charisma: d8 []+1 []+2 []+3 []+4
-Diplomacy: Charisma+2
Favored Card Type: Blessing
Weapon: 2 []3
Spell: 3 []4 []5 []6
Armor: 2
Item: 1 []2
Ally: 2 []3 []4
Blessing: 5 []6 []7 []8
Hand Size: 5 ([]6)
Proficiencies: Light Armor Heavy Armor [] Weapons
Instead of your first exploration, you may display a card with the divine trait. Each character at your location may recharge 1 random card from their discard pile. While this card is displayed, reduce the difficulty of monsters at your location by 1 ([]2). At the start of your turn, discard this card.
Add 2 to checks to acquire ([] or recharge) or for combat checks with spells with the divine trait that do not have the healing trait.
Shard of Moradin:
Hand Size: 5 []6 []7
Proficiencies: Light Armor Heavy Armor [] Weapons
Instead of your first exploration, you may display a card with the divine trait. Each character at your location may recharge 1 ([]2) random card(s) from their discard pile. While this card is displayed, reduce the difficulty of monsters at your location by 1 ([]2) ([]3). At the start of your turn, discard this card.
Add 2 to checks to acquire ([] or recharge) or for combat checks with spells with the divine trait that do not have the healing trait.
[] Add 2 ([]4) to combat checks using a weapon.
[] When you attempt a Craft check ([] or a check to acquire a Weapon or Armor with the Magic trait), you may use Divine in place of the normal skill.
[] When you play a Blessing of Moradin or Jaren, you may recharge it instead of discarding it.
Son of Jaren:
Hand Size: 5 ([]6)
Proficiencies: Light Armor Heavy Armor [] Weapons
Instead of your first exploration, you may display a card with the divine trait. Each character at your location may recharge 1 random card from their discard pile. While this card is displayed, reduce the difficulty of monsters at your location by 1 ([]2) ([]3). At the start of your turn, discard this card.
Add 2 ([]4) ([]6) to checks to acquire ([] or recharge) or for combat checks with spells with the divine trait that do not have the healing trait.
[] Display a card to use d10 in place of the normal die for a Strength or Constitution check. At the end of your turn discard this card. ([] If you did, you may move to another location). ([] If the card was a Blessing or Ally, recharge it instead).
[] When you play a Blessing of Jaren, you may recharge it ([] or put it on top of your deck) instead of discarding it.
This character seems like his power would depend a lot on how many other characters would be at his location. In a big party, everybody groups up and gets a card back plus a boost to combat. In smaller parties his power doesn't shine as much. It doesn't mean you should change him, it would more influence when he would get picked to play (apart from the 6 you're talking about).
This character seems like his power would depend a lot on how many other characters would be at his location. In a big party, everybody groups up and gets a card back plus a boost to combat. In smaller parties his power doesn't shine as much. It doesn't mean you should change him, it would more influence when he would get picked to play (apart from the 6 you're talking about).
Agreed. Like I said in the other thread where this came up, this is a really tough power to manage, since it varies so wildly based on party composition. I learned with my last set of characters that it's better to start low and buff if you're just doing it for fun (since nerfing something you made is very unfun. If it's your job, then it probably wouldn't be as big a deal), so I went with what I felt was a reasonable starting point.
Also, the way this group plays in the RPG was very united/phalanx formation style, so I'm okay slightly encouraging that. However, I don't want to go too far with it, so I'll consider pushing the ability if it's too weak. However, I'm probably not upping the heal, since he's memetically a terrible healer, so it's probably the debuff that I'd look to bump.
Interesting character- I like the variation on the healing power, which I think is more-or-less unique for a cleric. Basic stats and cards seem very balanced.
The fact that you could quite easily have an automatic +10 to any divine combat check seems very powerful, although I guess it depends on the divine attack spells available- In RotR, I think there were few enough that it wouldn’t be an issue, S&S, there would be a lot more scope for him to do some very big hitting- be interesting to see how WotR works for this.
I don't remember how powerful Alhazhra's Damage bonus gets, but I don't think it's far off. If I'm remembering wrong, I may want to step back on it a bit, though. He also only starts with 3 spells, which is always a tight slot, so I think it's okay for it to be a bit stronger than Alhazhra's, but not substantially.
A lot may change depending on how powerful, and how frequently useable his heal/debuff power is. If that ends up being spammable, I may have to weaken the character to compensate.
Not much change to Hawk. I weakened the progression of his divine bonuses in Son of Jaren, and fixed a few lines of text, but that pretty much covers it.
Hawk:
Male Tiefling Cleric
Strength: d6 []+1 []+2 []+3
-Melee: Strength+2
Dexterity: d4 []+1
Constitution: d6 []+1 []+2
Intelligence: d6 []+1
Wisdom: d12 []+1 []+2 []+3 []+4
-Divine: Wisdom+2
Charisma: d8 []+1 []+2 []+3 []+4
-Diplomacy: Charisma+2
Favored Card Type: Blessing
Weapon: 2 []3
Spell: 3 []4 []5 []6
Armor: 2
Item: 1 []2
Ally: 2 []3 []4
Blessing: 5 []6 []7 []8
Hand Size: 5 ([]6)
Proficiencies: Light Armor Heavy Armor [] Weapons
Instead of your first exploration, you may display a card with the divine trait. Each character at your location may recharge 1 random card from their discard pile. While this card is displayed, reduce the difficulty of monsters at your location by 1 ([]2). At the start of your turn, discard this card.
Add 2 to checks to acquire ([] or recharge) or for combat checks with spells with the divine trait that do not have the healing trait.
Shard of Moradin:
Hand Size: 5 []6 []7
Proficiencies: Light Armor Heavy Armor [] Weapons
Instead of your first exploration, you may display a card with the divine trait. Each character at your location may recharge 1 ([]2) random card(s) from their discard pile. While this card is displayed, reduce the difficulty of monsters at your location by 1 ([]2) ([]3). At the start of your turn, discard this card.
Add 2 to checks to acquire ([] or recharge) or for combat checks with spells with the divine trait that do not have the healing trait.
[] Add 2 ([]4) to combat checks using a weapon.
[] When you attempt a Craft check ([] or a check to acquire a Weapon or Armor with the Magic trait), you may use Divine in place of the normal skill.
[] When you play a Blessing of Moradin or Jaren, you may recharge it instead of discarding it.
Son of Jaren:
Hand Size: 5 ([]6)
Proficiencies: Light Armor Heavy Armor [] Weapons
Instead of your first exploration, you may display a card with the divine trait. Each character at your location may recharge 1 random card from their discard pile. While this card is displayed, reduce the difficulty of monsters at your location by 1 ([]2) ([]3). At the start of your turn, discard this card.
Add 2 ([]3) ([]4) to checks to acquire ([] or recharge) or for combat checks with spells with the divine trait that do not have the healing trait.
[] Display a card to use d10 in place of the normal die for a Strength or Constitution check. At the end of your turn discard this card. ([] If you did, you may move to another location). ([] If the card was a Blessing or Ally, recharge it instead).
[] When you play a Blessing of Jaren, you may recharge it ([] or put it on top of your deck) instead of discarding it.
I'm making another update with a few rather small changes. The main thing I wanted to do was highlight a few abilities of each character that I felt needed special attention. If you could review the bolded abilities in particular and give your thoughts, I'd really appreciate it!
Hawk:
Male Tiefling Cleric
Strength: d6 []+1 []+2 []+3
-Melee: Strength+2
Dexterity: d4 []+1
Constitution: d6 []+1 []+2
Intelligence: d6 []+1
Wisdom: d12 []+1 []+2 []+3 []+4
-Divine: Wisdom+2
Charisma: d8 []+1 []+2 []+3 []+4
-Diplomacy: Charisma+2
Favored Card Type: Blessing
Weapon: 2 []3
Spell: 3 []4 []5 []6
Armor: 2
Item: 1 []2
Ally: 2 []3 []4
Blessing: 5 []6 []7 []8
Hand Size: 5 ([]6)
Proficiencies: Light Armor Heavy Armor [] Weapons
Instead of your first exploration, you may display a card with the divine trait. Each character at your location may recharge 1 random card from their discard pile. While this card is displayed, reduce the difficulty of monsters at your location by 1 ([]2). At the start of your turn, discard this card.
Add 2 to checks to acquire ([] or recharge) or for combat checks with spells with the divine trait that do not have the healing trait.
Shard of Moradin:
Hand Size: 5 []6 []7
Proficiencies: Light Armor Heavy Armor [] Weapons
Instead of your first exploration, you may display a card with the divine trait. Each character at your location may recharge 1 ([]2) random card(s) from their discard pile. While this card is displayed, reduce the difficulty of monsters at your location by 1 ([]2) ([]3). At the start of your turn, discard this card.
Add 2 to checks to acquire ([] or recharge) or for combat checks with spells with the divine trait that do not have the healing trait.
[] Add 2 ([]4) to combat checks using a weapon.
[] When you attempt a Craft check ([] or a check to acquire a Weapon or Armor with the Magic trait), you may use Divine in place of the normal skill.
[] When you play a Blessing of Moradin or Jaren, you may recharge it instead of discarding it.
Son of Jaren:
Hand Size: 5 ([]6)
Proficiencies: Light Armor Heavy Armor [] Weapons
Instead of your first exploration, you may display a card with the divine trait. Each character at your location may recharge 1 random card from their discard pile. While this card is displayed, reduce the difficulty of monsters ([] or barriers) at your location by 1 ([]2) ([]3). At the start of your turn, discard this card.
Add 2 ([]4) to checks to acquire ([] or recharge) or for combat checks with spells with the divine trait that do not have the healing trait.
[] Display a card to use d10 in place of the normal die for a Strength or Constitution check. At the end of your turn discard this card. ([] If you did, you may move to another location). ([] If the card was a Blessing or Ally, recharge it instead).
[] When you play a Blessing of Jaren, you may recharge it ([] or put it on top of your deck) instead of discarding it.
Nothing on Hawk really stood out as a big warning sign, other than potentially his cleric power, but since it's the first power, I figure everyone that's looked at him has considered that part. So, let me know if you have any general thoughts.
Disclaimer: I'm not familiar with the WotR-lore or your homebrew deities.
That being said, I promised you to give my feedback and so here we go:
First off: I personally don't like to play "Divine"-casters in any form or shape. I played Kyra a bit in RotR, but this was mostly due to her Exorcism-role and boy, did I try to like Lini but fail. So some bias towards this character is probably present. Also: I have no idea what those blessings mean and it seems like they're really relevant for this certain character, but, I promised.
The skills:
Why Diplomacy? I'm not getting that. I'm sorry. Can you please explain to me why a Cleric would have a bonus on Diplomacy. Yeah, sure, it's a nice twist instead of the normal Fortitude, but why not Knowledge then? Anyway, I digress.
Powers:
I do like the spin on the Healing Part, yes, and I do like the fact that he can debuff, yes. Right. So he can slightly heal and slightly debuff. That's awesome for great parties! So.. What's with the "Check to acquire/recharge spells without Healing trait"? I thought he was a healer/debuffer? Now he is a caster.
I'm sorry, I don't get this character theme-wise.
Cards:
Maybe 1 up the Spells? Or the Allies? I mean, he is a caster right? He has Diplomacy right? I think it would be better balanced if his Cards were to align with his skills better.
Roles:
Shard: I'm totally blown up. Really. So he can heal a bit, he can debuff a bit, he can damage a bit and now he can get weapons easier? Is this like a jack-in-the-box? I thought this was a Cleric? Maybe I'm not getting it because I don't know the deities..
I do like all the powers though. I would really enjoy the Craft Check -> Divine Check. Man, I would use that power so much!
To be honest, it's a pretty nice looking character. Especially since S&S added so many Divine Attack Spells. But I'm just getting a lot of different vibes and a lot of different themes. I really like your Storm Sorcerer theme-wise, but this character just lacks it. The powers are great, really, but I just can't connect with this character.
Disclaimer: I'm not familiar with the WotR-lore or your homebrew deities.
That being said, I promised you to give my feedback and so here we go:
First off: I personally don't like to play "Divine"-casters in any form or shape. I played Kyra a bit in RotR, but this was mostly due to her Exorcism-role and boy, did I try to like Lini but fail. So some bias towards this character is probably present. Also: I have no idea what those blessings mean and it seems like they're really relevant for this certain character, but, I promised.
Thank you for looking at it either way. I appreciate getting feedback from the other side, since I'm a pretty big divine fan. I'm sure it'll be a useful take.
The skills:
Why Diplomacy? I'm not getting that. I'm sorry. Can you please explain to me why a Cleric would have a bonus on Diplomacy. Yeah, sure, it's a nice twist instead of the normal Fortitude, but why not Knowledge then? Anyway, I digress.
Hawk is the party face. Diplomacy is, quite literally, what he does. It's not necessarily a Cleric thing, but it's definitely the right call for this character.
Powers:
I do like the spin on the Healing Part, yes, and I do like the fact that he can debuff, yes. Right. So he can slightly heal and slightly debuff. That's awesome for great parties! So.. What's with the "Check to acquire/recharge spells without Healing trait"? I thought he was a healer/debuffer? Now he is a caster.
I'm sorry, I don't get this character theme-wise.
Hmm, that is a good point. I'm straddling a fine line with the character as he is, memetically, a really bad healer as clerics go. That being said, he is still a cleric, and I felt he needed some base healing power, and I hoped that the power being a very weak heal would emphasize that he is not good at healing, but can do it. The second power is to further emphasize this. He is a very talented divine caster...except when healing, where he stinks. He is primarily a debuffer, but can and does go on offense when needed.
When put that way, does it make sense, or do you still think the theme falls flat?Cards:
Maybe 1 up the Spells? Or the Allies? I mean, he is a caster right? He has Diplomacy right? I think it would be better balanced if his Cards were to align with his skills better.
I wish I had more cards than 15, because it was a pain in the rear to narrow this card list down. No cleric that I've seen has less than 5 blessings, and he's the son of a god, so he is not going to be an exception. Less than 2 weapons without it as a favored card type means that you can pretty much count out his melee ability, which is a waste of that skill. Armor I suppose I could drop, but he wore full plate armor in the game, so I'm reluctant to do so. That just leaves items. I could remove the one item, but I'm not sure that's enough to make the difference in spells or allies. With a power devoted to spells, though, I may have to.
Roles:
Shard: I'm totally blown up. Really. So he can heal a bit, he can debuff a bit, he can damage a bit and now he can get weapons easier? Is this like a jack-in-the-box? I thought this was a Cleric? Maybe I'm not getting it because I don't know the deities..
I do like all the powers though. I would really enjoy the Craft Check -> Divine Check. Man, I would use that power so much!
Yeah, this is one you probably need to know the gods for. Moradin actually originates in D&D, and is the god of dwarves and the forge. That should explain where the weapon and craft powers come from. I'm not sure about the bonus to weapons, I think I just wanted to differentiate the two roles, so Moradin focused on fighting with weapons, Jaren focused on fighting with spells.
To be honest, it's a pretty nice looking character. Especially since S&S added so many Divine Attack Spells. But I'm just getting a lot of different vibes and a lot of different themes. I really like your Storm Sorcerer theme-wise, but this character just lacks it. The powers are great, really, but I just can't connect with this character.
That is great feedback, as I'm so close to the characters that I can easily miss the big picture. I'll go back to the drawing board and see if we can do anything to help the theme shine through more.
Hawk is the party face. Diplomacy is, quite literally, what he does. It's not necessarily a Cleric thing, but it's definitely the right call for this character.
Well, I just realized that your party is made of RPG characters that you’re using. In that case you should stick with this. But I just had the feeling the most of your characters have some Diplomacy. Maybe tweak some down, or tweak this one up? I mean: Sure a band of goodfellows, they must be diplomatic. But does that make it feel special and unique for a character?
Hmm, that is a good point. I'm straddling a fine line with the character as he is, memetically, a really bad healer as clerics go. That being said, he is still a cleric, and I felt he needed some base healing power, and I hoped that the power being a very weak heal would emphasize that he is not good at healing, but can do it. The second power is to further emphasize this. He is a very talented divine caster...except when healing, where he stinks. He is primarily a debuffer, but can and does go on offense when needed.
When put that way, does it make sense, or do you still think the theme falls flat?
Well, the theme does come out. But I just feel like he is a bit of everything now, magic wise. Especially with S&S, Divine got a lot of boosts when it comes to damage casting and Arcane got boosts on Divine stuff (I believe Safe Harbor is an Arcane Healing example). So, maybe just change the ability to something in the trend of:
“For your combat check that has the Divine trait add 2 to it.”.This way he still is stronger in damage dealing, but his method for acquiring and recharging any Divine spell is equal. (I feel like being some jerk for just pointing out things I don’t like, but in the other hand, it’s kind of what you want, right? :P)
I wish I had more cards than 15, because it was a pain in the rear to narrow this card list down. No cleric that I've seen has less than 5 blessings, and he's the son of a god, so he is not going to be an exception. Less than 2 weapons without it as a favored card type means that you can pretty much count out his melee ability, which is a waste of that skill. Armor I suppose I could drop, but he wore full plate armor in the game, so I'm reluctant to do so. That just leaves items. I could remove the one item, but I'm not sure that's enough to make the difference in spells or allies. With a power devoted to spells, though, I may have to.
Okay, how about this: By giving him a bonus to Divine Spells (with Damage) you could change some of his Cards around, to this: (Again, feeling like a jerk, but you can always ignore me)
Favored Card Type: Blessing
Weapon: 2
Spell: 4
Armor: 2
Item: 1
Ally: 1
Blessing: 5
Giving her the spell one-up gives a better Caster feeling. And she probably won’t explore much, because of her innate ability to heal/debuff.
Yeah, this is one you probably need to know the gods for. Moradin actually originates in D&D, and is the god of dwarves and the forge. That should explain where the weapon and craft powers come from. I'm not sure about the bonus to weapons, I think I just wanted to differentiate the two roles, so Moradin focused on fighting with weapons, Jaren focused on fighting with spells.
Fair enough. I never knew much about Pathfinder Lore, let alone homebrew deities. :’)
That is great feedback, as I'm so close to the characters that I can easily miss the big picture. I'll go back to the drawing board and see if we can do anything to help the theme shine through more.
Okay, how about this for a change. Since Moradin is about Fighting and Forging, make that your Melee-specialist and add bonuses to that. And for Son of Jaren, since he is about spells, give him some more Oomph when it comes to damaging and debuffing (perhaps Healing). So that both of the roles have a better emphasis on a different path. Maybe switch the first Power around. Making Son of Jaren able to heal a bit better and Shard of Muradin able to let people knock down barriers?
We've put together the characters. Thanks again to everyone for your help with these!
Attached below is a google doc with all of the cards if you want to try them out. We'll be updating them as we play, as inevitably stuff will change once we actually play. Let me know what you guys think!
Also, if you like the Art, it is commissioned from a friend of mine at Maewyn's Menagerie so if you like it, you can get art from her, too!