| Tryst |
I am fleshing out (pun intended?) a new Bard Archetype for an upcoming campaign that is already leaning pretty far dark, though not evil. After reading quite a bit about whips and trips, I put together the following as a start:
Bard Archetype: Dominatrix
Loses Weapon Proficiency in Longsword, Rapier, Sap, Shortsword, Shortbow
Gains Weapon Proficiency in Net
Begins with Weapon Focus: Whip, Weapon Focus: Net
Refluff Bardic Knowledge as Clientele Gossip
Loses Countersong Bardic Performance
Replaces Countersong with Harsh Words (refluff of the ability Wordstrike from the Sonic Striker Bard Archetype):
Wordstrike (Su): The sound striker bard can spend 1 round of bardic performance as a standard action to direct a burst of sonically charged words at a creature or object. This performance deals 1d4 points of damage plus the bard's level to an object, or half this damage to a living creature.
Keeps Fascinate as is.
Replace Distraction with Tie Me Up--Gain Net Adept and Net Maneuvering Feats
Replace Inspire Courage with Exquisite Pleasure/Exquisite Pain--Can use performance as either Inspire Courage or the Satire ability from the Court Bard Archetype:
Satire (Su): A court bard can use performance to undermine the confidence of enemies who hear it, causing them to take a –1 penalty on attack and damage rolls (minimum 1) and a –1 penalty on saves against fear and charm effects as long as the bard continues performing. This penalty increases by –1 at 5th level and every six levels thereafter. Satire is a language-dependent, mind-affecting ability that uses audible components.
The Arcane Duelist Bard and Daredevil Bard lose Versatile Performance in exchange for a series of feats at 2nd, 6th, 10th, 14th and 18th levels. So Dominatrix loses Versatile Performance in exchange for Whip It!--At 2nd level, gain Whip Mastery and Dazzling Display. At 6th level gain Improved Whip Mastery. At 10th level gain Greater Whip Mastery. At 14th level gain ability similar to Gypsy Archetype's Gypsy Prank--Add any perform skill to CMB and CMD for combat maneuvers with whip. At 18th level gain ability to use a whip for all combat maneuvers against any creature even if it would normally be immune.
Replace Well Versed with Fear Connoisseur--Dominatrix is able to stack fear effects from different actions to demoralize creatures from shaken to frightened to panicked (e.g., Enforcer, Dazzling Display, Blistering Invective, Cornugon Smash, Dirge of Doom) but cannot achieve more than Frightened at Level 2 (upgrades to Panicked at Level 6?)
Maybe, haven't thought this one entirely through yet: Lore Master--Replace with Costume Proficiency as the Diva Archetype does (refluff as Costume Kink):
Costume Proficiency: At 5th level, the Chelish diva has become so used to wearing strange and cumbersome costumes for her performances that she gains medium armor proficiency and can cast bard spells while wearing medium armor without incurring the normal arcane spell failure chance. At 11th level, she gains heavy armor proficiency and can cast bard spells while wearing heavy armor without incurring the normal arcane spell failure chance. A multiclassed diva still incurs the normal arcane spell failure chance for arcane spells received from other classes.
Suggestion-maybe use Weird Words with a more flavorful name, per sound striker archetype.
Dirge of Doom?
Inspire Greatness?
Jack of All Trades?
Soothing Performance?
Frightening Tune?
Still very much a work in progress, but wanted to get some thoughts on what I have so far--too much? I am trying to address the complaints I read with Trip builds at higher levels (can't use trip on lots of high level enemies, CMD outpaces CMB, etc.) without completely unbalancing the game.
Any thoughts?
| Tryst |
Hmm... I viewed it more as trading 5 feats (all the lethal damage-dealing weapons the Bard starts with proficiency in: longsword, rapier, sap, shortsword, shortbow) for 3 feats (Weapon Focus Whip (Bards start with Weapon Proficiency Whip), Weapon Proficiency Net, and Weapon Focus Net) that all involve weapons that don't yet deal lethal damage (or any damage, in the case of the net). That doesn't seem like a fair exchange to you?
| TGMaxMaxer |
Give them Whip Mastery at 1st. Ability to do actual damage with a whip is a fair trade (one archetype gets dervish Dance for crying out loud). Also treat class level as BAB for maneuvers with a whip, plus BAB from other classes.
Let them count as having WF Whip for prereqs, or give it to them. Not a massive boost so long as they don't get all the net stuff too.
Call the Wordstrike sub "Razored Tongue" or somesuch, and make it functional. Call it sonic damage and roll it all into a single power that levels. At 3rd, vs objects 1d4+level (bypassing hardness) and vs creatures 1d8 word +1 word per 2 levels after 3rd, add Cha mod once per creature, single Fort Half for each creature affected regardless of how many words target them, 30ft range.
At 2, give the Dazzling Display as a standard action that the cavalier gets, at 6 Imp Whip Mastery, treated as 1 size larger for purposes of what she can trip. At 10 Greater Whip Mastery, treated as 1 size larger for purposes of grappling with whip. At 14, can use trip and grapple with whip on creatures of any size and even those normally immune to the maneuvers.
Pleasure and Pain I like, keep that.
Fear Connoisseur should be a +4 against saves vs fear effects and +4 to checks to demoralize her at 2nd level. She can use perform Oratory in place of Intimidate to demoralize opponents.
At 5th level, She can also stack fear effects from successive effects she causes (but not effects caused by others) to a max of frightened. At 11th level, this can increase the effect to panicked. Shaken->Frightened->Panicked. For example, a Dominatrix of 5th level can intimidate someone she has affected with Blistering Invective, or her Dazzling Display, and cause them to go from shaken to frightened. She could also simply Intimidate to demoralize them a 2nd time before the first duration was up, and cause them to be frightened. Only the level of fear is increased, the durations are not cumulative. This replaces Well Versed, Loremaster and Jack of All Trades.
Include the medium armor option at 5th, but don't give heavy at 11th. Instead, give armor training at 9th, (full speed and +1 MaxDex/-1 ACP), increasing at 13, 17. Also, a Dodge bonus to AC of +1 at 13 &17 in medium armor and not encumbered. Keeps them mobile and still not crap in the AC race.
John Compton
Developer
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It looks like you have a lot going on with this archetype, and I think it might err on the side of too much change. Take a look at some other bard archetypes, and I think you'll see that they tend to replace around 4-6 abilities--or just have several abilities that each replace multiple bard abilities. At a glace it seemed like you might have 10 custom abilities/replacements, and I encourage you to combine those under similar headers while focusing more on what the archetype needs to change and less on what could change.
I also agree with others here that granting 4 bonus feats at 1st level (Weapon Focus x2 plus the two special net feats at 1st level--because distraction is a 1st-level performance) is way too much. I would give this bard bonus feats (maybe replacing versatile performance and gaining more at that rate) with a limited pool of feat options.
| Tryst |
@TGMaxMaxer--I think you nailed it perfectly, thanks for the great advice. You guys were right, I got greedy with the nets.
@John Compton--I'm not so sure, some of the Bard Archetypes only replace two abilities, but others are almost unrecognizeable as Bards (Archaelogist, Sandman, I'm looking at you!). You are right in that the original was too much, I will probably go with TGMaxMaxer's recommendations and call it a day. While I was going through all the archetypes again and again before posting, it seemed like a major common theme was to replace Versatile Performance with a series of abilities aimed in another direction, so my goal was to try to make her an archetype who replaced Versatile Performance with whip combat tricks while keeping a "performing" flavor and also not being a complete waste of time at higher levels. What I find funny is that while I was worried about being too awesome by being able to trip, frighten, etc. everything, when I gave it to my GM he was worried I was going to die and hurt the party because I gave up all my lethal damage weapons, so I agreed to take dagger back (kinda fits I suppose). I guess time in-game will tell.
Thanks for all the advice, guys!