I've recently started playing in a new home game on Tuesday, but we only have two players in the party, and I'd like to avoid having the GM insert a DMPC, so I chose to play a Cleric of Pharasma for two reasons. 1. I've been wanting to play a full-caster for a while. 2. I like the versatility and healing abilities a cleric gets. The other player is a barbarian. For smashing.
I'd like to know how best to build this character to work in tandem with only 1 other PC. We are starting at 5th level and using 20 point-buy. The Race is set, though I know it isn't optimal, but the spells known, and feats I would like advice with. So far the build I have worked out is:
Lvl 5 Neutral unnamed Tiefling (devil-spawn) Cleric (Repose, and Restoration domains)
Str 14
Dex 14
Con 16 (+2 racial)
Int 12
Wis 20 (+2 headband, +2 racial)
Cha 8 (-2 racial)
(final totals taken into account)
Feats: Improved Initiative, Combat casting, ?
Spells:
4/day 0- Stabilize, detect magic, light, spark
6/day 1- Burning Disarm, Bless, Protection from Evil, Obscuring Mist
4/day 2- Align Weapon, Bull's Strength, Hold person
3/day 3- Wind wall
Honestly, this is the part I'm the most unsure about, do I have the number of each spell slot I get each day correct? I know I can switch these spells out each day, but this is what I'm assuming I prep as a default. Is this a decent range of spells to have available? And what is the +1 the class lists under "spells per day" for the domain spell?
Equipment: +1 Grayflame Silversheen Morningstar, +1 Agile Breastplate, CLW wand, Headband of wisdom.
Any help would be appreciated!
Feats wise consider extra channel, versatile channel, channel smite and/or selective channel. An alchemist level would be good to improve utility and combat stats.
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Feats wise consider extra channel, versatile channel, channel smite and/or selective channel. An alchemist level would be good to improve utility and combat stats.
I don't recommend Channel Smite, unless you're making this a very specific type of Negative Energy Cleric...
Versatile Channel might not end up being very useful, but Extra Channel, Quick Channel, and Selective Channel are great.If you have access to Inner Sea Gods, no Cleric of Pharasma should go without Fateful Channel. It's almost too good to be true.
Inner Sea Gods also has a good option for Deific Obedience for Pharasma; take the feat, do some cleric stuff in the morning, get a +2 to hit with daggers all day. This could open up a decent melee striker/TWF option for your cleric.
Healing (Restoration) is a great choice for a Domain/Subdomain. It gives you a lot of flexibility and keeps the awesome Empowered Cures ability.
I suggest Knowledge (Memory) instead of Repose. You're in a two-man adventuring party. Someone is going to have to make those Knowledge checks, and I don't imagine that Mr. Smash-Face is going to be optimized in this area. That domain gives you some more flexibility, some half-decent divination spells, and an awesome reroll ability for Knowledge checks.
For spells, I suggest focusing on whatever good buffs you can find for your Barbarian friend. Get yourself a Handy Haversack asap and work on building a scroll library of the huge number of condition removal and utility spells on the Cleric list.
The Fate's Favored Trait from Ultimate Campaign will help you be more effective in melee; Divine Favor and Prayer are the biggest beneficiaries. See if you can get your Barbarian to take that trait too and you can buff both of you with Prayer for +2 to just about everything while simultaneously debuffing your enemies, with no save allowed.
Blessing of Fervor is a good Haste substitute, so cast that one often.
At low levels, Bless and Divine Favor are probably going to be your go-to spells.
Feats wise consider extra channel, versatile channel, channel smite and/or selective channel. An alchemist level would be good to improve utility and combat stats.I don't recommend Channel Smite, unless you're making this a very specific type of Negative Energy Cleric...
Versatile Channel might not end up being very useful, but Extra Channel, Quick Channel, and Selective Channel are great.If you have access to Inner Sea Gods, no Cleric of Pharasma should go without Fateful Channel. It's almost too good to be true.
Inner Sea Gods also has a good option for Deific Obedience for Pharasma; take the feat, do some cleric stuff in the morning, get a +2 to hit with daggers all day. This could open up a decent melee striker/TWF option for your cleric.Healing (Restoration) is a great choice for a Domain/Subdomain. It gives you a lot of flexibility and keeps the awesome Empowered Cures ability.
I suggest Knowledge (Memory) instead of Repose. You're in a two-man adventuring party. Someone is going to have to make those Knowledge checks, and I don't imagine that Mr. Smash-Face is going to be optimized in this area. That domain gives you some more flexibility, some half-decent divination spells, and an awesome reroll ability for Knowledge checks.
For spells, I suggest focusing on whatever good buffs you can find for your Barbarian friend. Get yourself a Handy Haversack asap and work on building a scroll library of the huge number of condition removal and utility spells on the Cleric list.
The Fate's Favored Trait from Ultimate Campaign will help you be more effective in melee; Divine Favor and Prayer are the biggest beneficiaries. See if you can get your Barbarian to take that trait too and you can buff both of you with Prayer for +2 to just about everything while simultaneously debuffing your enemies, with no save allowed.
Blessing of Fervor is a good Haste substitute, so...
Is Knowledge (memory) available from Pharasma?
Channeling is probably not the best route for a cleric who dumps charisma. You might consider trading it in entirely by taking Divine Strategist, which lets you act in surprise rounds and gives you a bonus to initiative. Though that will also cost you one domain, not being surprised and going first will be hugely important for a party of two.
Consider possible synergies with the other player. For example, if you can convince your partner to take the Savage Dirty Trick rage power at level 6, she could apply the Staggered condition to dangerous foes and you could then put them to sleep with the Repose domain’s touch attack. The Restoration domain is a cool choice, since it lets you remove your partner’s rage fatigue when necessary.
Channeling is probably not the best route for a cleric who dumps charisma. You might consider trading it in entirely by taking Divine Strategist, which lets you act in surprise rounds and gives you a bonus to initiative. Though that will also cost you one domain, not being surprised and going first will be hugely important for a party of two.
Consider possible synergies with the other player. For example, if you can convince your partner to take the Savage Dirty Trick rage power at level 6, she could apply the Staggered condition to dangerous foes and you could then put them to sleep with the Repose domain’s touch attack. The Restoration domain is a cool choice, since it lets you remove your partner’s rage fatigue when necessary.
First off, I love the username, second, I like the idea to put the Repose domain to use with the Dirty Trick maneuver, can the Barian use strength surge in conjunction with that?
I also didn't even know divine favor existed, after reading that, I think it definitely needs to go on my spell list.
....what is the +1 the class lists under "spells per day" for the domain spell?
Equipment: +1 Grayflame Silversheen Morningstar, +1 Agile Breastplate, CLW wand, Headband of wisdom.
You get extra spell slots for your domain(s). The only spells that can go in that slot are domain spells. For example, my cleric with Liberation and Travel domains could use either Remove Fear or Longstrider as his first level domain spell. Your spells per level are 5/3/2 regular cleric spells, plus the domain spell at each level.
Consider swapping the CLW wand for Infernal Healing - more flavorful for a tiefling and guarantees 10hp per use, although it takes 10 rounds. You can sacrifice one of your other spells for a Cure Light or Cure Moderate if you need an insta-heal.
That is what I meant with the domain spell question, my thanks.
I like the idea to put the Repose domain to use with the Dirty Trick maneuver, can the Barian use strength surge in conjunction with that?
Sure.
Another option for your character would be to ask your GM to let you take the Sacred Summons feat to call Psychopomps (the outsiders most associated with Pharasma) with Summon Monster spells. Being focused on summons would go a long way towards correcting the huge disadvantage you’ll have in actions compared to the typical 4-person party.
Alternately, see if you can take Leadership. Get a cohort Inquisitor with the Repose domain and you’ll be able to land a staggered/asleep/coup-de-grace combo almost at will. Said Inquisitor could also help with Knowledge checks, which as Tomos rightfully points out, will be a challenge for you.
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I like the idea to put the Repose domain to use with the Dirty Trick maneuver, can the Barian use strength surge in conjunction with that?
I also didn't even know divine favor existed, after reading that, I think it definitely needs to go on my spell list.
The Repose domain touch attack is very strong. Normally, it's kind of a bad idea because you have to walk up and touch it but in your situation, you will have a big nasty partner who will likely draw a lot of attention away from you.
I suggest modifying your stats to give yourself a 12+ Charisma.
With such a small party, you will have to really maximize your action economy. Quick Channel can help with that.
If you get at least 6 uses of Channel Positive per day, you can use a move action to heal both of you, a standard to touch or buff, and a swift to cast a quickened spell, assuming you will grab a lesser rod at some point.
Yes, Pharasma grants the Knowledge Domain, and Memory is a valid subdomain.
I think that Repose definitely has value, but given your circumstances, I think you will be better served by the Knowledge bonuses.
Keep Calm is right about the ability to remove fatigue being especially useful to your Barbarian partner.
Remember that this uses your standard action, so helping him rage cycle is probably not the best use of your time in combat.
Keep Calm's ideas about summoning are also great. You will definitely be at a disadvantage in combat, so even if they're just meat sacks, it's probably worth it to have at least some summoning ability.
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In my experience, bless and protection from evil are very situational. As you get higher level protection from evil becomes more useful as things keep trying to take over your brain. But at low level, as a full caster, you may want to try sanctuary as your go to protection spell. That will allow you to walk up and heal your sponge, I mean barbarian, and get off some full round spells.
And that brings us to attack spells, summon monster, though a full round action, will be useful in every fight if you can cast it reliably. There is a regional feat that your DM may allow that allows you to summon as a standard action for a price (fort save based.) I forget what it is called, but it is something like academea graduate.
Command might be a good 1st level spell, and hold person is an excellent choice.
You are definitely right about the summoning. That feat, Acadamae Graduate, is awesome, but from kind of an obscure source. It's especially cool considering he has chosen the Healing(Restoration) Domain.
I've seen this feat used to good effect like this:Round 1: begin full-round casting action summon monster
Round 2: cast summon monster as standard action using Acadamae Graduate, monsters appear in flanking position on enemy, smash faces.
I disagree about your spell selection. I have played through a lot of sessions/levels with Clerics and I think that Protection from Evil becomes less relevant at higher levels. It's amazing at low levels, bordering on broken. +2 to AC, +2 to saves, immunity from attacks of summoned creatures, immunity to mental control.
It's also phenomenally useful to keep your Barbarian buddy from bashing your brains in when he inevitably gets dominated.
Bless is also useful throughout a Cleric's career. Despite what the optimization fans on the boards may say, there will come a time when you have "nothing better to do" and a round where you can do nothing else. Go ahead and use a wand or scroll, but it is a nice buff that stacks with most other spells.
Sanctuary, on the other hand, tends to fail just when you need it most. Enemies get a save to resist, and unless you have optimized for DC (tough with a Cleric), they will pass it when it's least convenient for you. I say avoid this spell.
Grace works a lot better for the purposes you suggested, and it's a swift action to cast it.
There is a regional feat that your DM may allow that allows you to summon as a standard action for a price (fort save based.) I forget what it is called, but it is something like academea graduate.That feat, Acadamae Graduate, is awesome, but from kind of an obscure source.
Academae Graduate won’t work for clerics, sadly--prepared arcane casters only.
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Academae Graduate won’t work for clerics, sadly--prepared arcane casters only.There is a regional feat that your DM may allow that allows you to summon as a standard action for a price (fort save based.) I forget what it is called, but it is something like academea graduate.That feat, Acadamae Graduate, is awesome, but from kind of an obscure source.
He could dip Wizard I guess. That would be kind of weird though.
Maybe homebrew a divine version?
Academae Graduate won’t work for clerics, sadly--prepared arcane casters only.There is a regional feat that your DM may allow that allows you to summon as a standard action for a price (fort save based.) I forget what it is called, but it is something like academea graduate.That feat, Acadamae Graduate, is awesome, but from kind of an obscure source.He could dip Wizard I guess. That would be kind of weird though.
Maybe homebrew a divine version?
Homebrewing is certainly an option for our group in particular, I'll see about summoning, since that seems like the easiest way to even things out numbers-wise, but I'm not sure of the benefits of summoning Psychopomps specifically. Or is it the standard action casting time that I should be looking at?
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@OP: With your STR 14 your Tiefling Cleric of Pharasma can be a sturdy martial backup to your Barbarian ally, while still concentrating on being a powerful full caster.
Too bad you already have that gorgeous Grayflame morning star, because the melee weapon you want is the longspear. Using a reach weapon lets you fish for AoOs, protect your ally's flank, and still cast a spell every round. You already have great stats for a reach cleric, and your WIS 20 makes your offensive magic very strong. A morningstar would be a terrific backup weapon, for the occasional situation where the longspear is not optimal.
Here are two versions, one with no investment in melee combat other than your STR 14 and caught by surpirse, the other with two combat feats and pre-buffed for a tough fight. This demonstrates the range of melee options available to you.
Melee Light Version: No martial feats & caught unprepared by surprise:
Summary: You suck. No AoOs flatfooted. You get one longspear attack +5 to hit for 1d8+3. You may instead draw and activate your Grayflame morningstar to attack at +7 for 1d8+4.
If you buff up as below, lacking any melee feats or traits, you will attack with a longspear for +9 to hit for about 2d6+11 HP damage, and also get one AoO. That's actually pretty decent but, like Rage, you can only maintain it for minutes a day.
Melee Heavy VersionMartial feats Combat Reflexes and Power Attack, Well Prepared for a tough fight[/b]:
Summary: You are nearly as combat effective as your Barbarian ally, yet remain a full spellcaster.
Active Buffs: Bull's Strength, Divine Favor (with Fate's Favored trait), Weapon of Awe, Magic Weapon (or you have a +1 weapon ...), Enlarge Person
You get one longspear power attack at +9 for about 2d6+15 HP damage. Available buffs & feats quadruple your offensive melee power. You also get two AoOs (three when you are not Enlarged). Your zone of control is a 50' diameter donut. At a guess, your raging Barbarian ally might do slightly more damage, but will project less battlefield control.
With either approach, any damage you score via AoOs is 'extra', in that your Standard Action each round is reserved for casting a spell. The only down side is that you can't use a shield, although a buckler remains an option.
Regardless, you should carry a Sling. You will attack with it at +5 to hit for 1d4+2 HP damage, unbuffed. Buffed that can be more like +8 to hit for 1d6+6 damage. It's not much damage, but it's something at a distance. Summon Monster spells will be your primary missile weapon.
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Homebrewing is certainly an option for our group in particular, I'll see about summoning, since that seems like the easiest way to even things out numbers-wise, but I'm not sure of the benefits of summoning Psychopomps specifically. Or is it the standard action casting time that I should be looking at?
I can't see any reason why a homebrew Acadamae Graduate feat for a Cleric would throw things out-of-balance. It would be used for the same spell (Summon Monster) anyway and Clerics don't get crazy boosts to their summoning abilities like Wizards can.
I think that standard action summoning would be very valuable to your small group. You could go with Spell Focus/Augment Summoning, but I think you probably need your limited feats for other things.Summoning psychopomps is appropriate because your character is a Cleric of Pharasma. They're connected in Golarion.
I'm not sure how tough it would be to fit some of those into appropriate tiers of Summon Monster, but it would take a homebrew GM ruling as they're not on the lists.
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@OP: With your STR 14 your Tiefling Cleric of Pharasma can be a sturdy martial backup to your Barbarian ally, while still concentrating on being a powerful full caster.
** spoiler omitted **...
I agree with your thought that it is good for a Cleric to be at least somewhat prepared for melee, but your "Melee Heavy Version" has spent 5 whole rounds buffing himself for the fight.
Ain't nobody got time for that.|
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your "Melee Heavy Version" has spent 5 whole rounds buffing himself for the fight.
Ain't nobody got time for that.
That's not how you do it. You layer hour-per-level and minutes-per-level buffs with short duration buffs. If your party scout warns you of imminent danger you start the short duration buffs just before combat starts. This is most useful when moving forward in a dungeon, and least useful when bushwhacked while sleeping. If your GM habitually starts combat without warning at close quarters, well, this approach won't work very well for you.
It's hardly ever worth a Standard Action to self-buff. Swift Action and Move Action buffs are great e.g. Quick Channel, Grayflame, etc. Nonetheless, it's usually possible for a Clericzilla to get their buff on. Most parties have a scout, and the primary responsibility of the scout is to warn the party what's ahead. In PFS play it's possible to pre-buff for about 50% of encounters, and for about 80% of end-scenes. It just requires planning, forethought, and some luck. You want to buff up for the tough stuff, and don't sweat the small stuff.
Who is going to do the scouting in this party? I'm not saying that buffing isn't the way to go, BTW.
I'd ditch the stabilize cantrip - you'll be able to use the heal skill to do this better. I'd put in some small buff like guidance or virtue you can throw all day long on your friend (and you).
Has the group considered gestalt rules? Your situation is ideal for them. :)
Has the group considered gestalt rules? Your situation is ideal for them. :)
I actually did convince this particular GM to allow Gestalt for the last 2-man group we had for a different campaign... then the Gunquisitor I was partnered with took out the BBEG's #1 minion in one hit. Apparently that wasn't supposed to happen. We did happen to get a "scout" in the form of a Kobold NPC though.
I'm going to see if I can get that Longspear for reach and all that other good stuff, though I think the stats are going to be set in place as is. My question about the psychopomps was more about the power of the creatures themselves and how I could fit them into the summon monster x list. I suppose I'll have to do that part myself, although some advice on that front would also be helpful.
Unfortunately, Leadership has been banned at our tables due to the amount of extra book-keeping it requires.
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Has the group considered gestalt rules? Your situation is ideal for them. :)I actually did convince this particular GM to allow Gestalt for the last 2-man group we had for a different campaign... then the Gunquisitor I was partnered with took out the BBEG's #1 minion in one hit. Apparently that wasn't supposed to happen. We did happen to get a "scout" in the form of a Kobold NPC though.
I'm going to see if I can get that Longspear for reach and all that other good stuff, though I think the stats are going to be set in place as is. My question about the psychopomps was more about the power of the creatures themselves and how I could fit them into the summon monster x list. I suppose I'll have to do that part myself, although some advice on that front would also be helpful.
Unfortunately, Leadership has been banned at our tables due to the amount of extra book-keeping it requires.
The d20pfsrd says that AP44 Trial of the Beast has two psychopomps in an 'alternate' Summon Monster list:
Nosoi at level 3Vanth at level 6
It looks like all they did is match up the listed CR to the other creatures already on the list. I imagine that a bit more goes into the decision to add a monster to a summon list than that though. I'd talk it over with the GM. Maybe you remove an option on the appropriate list and replace it with a psychopomp?