Murderous Command Sneak attack

[Powergaming DM]

If someone is given a Murderous Command spell to attack their allies would that be a sneak attack?

[Fake Healer]

shouldn't be. Doesn't say anywhere that a person engaged in combat that is suddenly made to attack his fellows makes them surprised or flatfooted so no. Now that doesn't mean that a rogue who got the order wouldn't be able to move into a flanking position and attack his buddy and get sneak attack damage added.

[insaneogeddon]

If they were in a position to with out a 5ft step definitely.

If they happened to be greater invis they would get it and wouldn't switch it off right ... it is a MURDEROUS command after all.

[Kobold Catgirl]

I would say they get a Sense Motive check to recognize his condition. Or Spellcraft checks to recognize the spell, anyways. Otherwise, yeah, I might say they're flat-footed.

[Ascalaphus]

I'd run it the same as Kobold Cleaver. There is no directly obvious way to see just what spell was cast, or at who, and if the target was affected.

Surprisingly (for a spell with "command" in the name), MC is not a language-dependent spell. Otherwise people would probably realize their buddy's been told to attack them, if they speak the language.

[Remy Balster]

Ascalaphus wrote:

I'd run it the same as Kobold Cleaver. There is no directly obvious way to see just what spell was cast, or at who, and if the target was affected.

Surprisingly (for a spell with "command" in the name), MC is not a language-dependent spell. Otherwise people would probably realize their buddy's been told to attack them, if they speak the language.

Would you do the same for confusion, or other mind affecting effects that can cause someone to attack an ally?

[Ascalaphus]

@Remy: Yes.

For the Sense Motive check though, I think I'd take the lower DC from either that to detect the mind-altering effect or the victim/attacker's Bluff check.

Basically, if you detect the effect with SM, you know that your ally is being "weird" and you should be careful. If you penetrate the Bluff you sense a hostile intention before he actually does something.

[Remy Balster]

Ascalaphus wrote:

@Remy: Yes.

For the Sense Motive check though, I think I'd take the lower DC from either that to detect the mind-altering effect or the victim/attacker's Bluff check.

Basically, if you detect the effect with SM, you know that your ally is being "weird" and you should be careful. If you penetrate the Bluff you sense a hostile intention before he actually does something.

Sounds very reasonable.