Pathfinder version of warlock

[Fiddich]

So, I am trying my hand at the whole GM thing for the first time. The players in the group are all old school RPG'ers (think 2.0), we've decided to get back into gaming. One of my players wants to resurrect a warlock, but as it stands we dont have a specific option in Pathfinder. Would my recommendation to try warlock or potentially a witch be the most common-sense alternative?

Am I missing a potential archetype here?

Many thanks from a returning player.

- Fid.

[Kolokotroni]

Its not a perfect match, but the 3rd party product the hellion by rogue genius games is a sort of more martial version of the witch. Its 3/4 bab with 6 levels of spell casting, it still gets hexes, and it gets a special bonded item, among them an amulet, which if chosen gives the character a 'force blast' ability. Its not anything spectacular, but it does scale as you level, which could bring back some of the feel of the 3.5 warlock.

[Lanitril]

One of my friends compares the Psionics Cryptic to the Warlock, because the Disrupt Pattern from Cryptic works an awful lot like an Eldritch Blast.

I've never seen a 2.0 warlock, but some people are very prone to saying that an almost direct port from 3.5 to pathfinder should suffice. Just change the skills to the new ones, etc.

I actually think the EB progression should match Sneak Attack progression, and give them an invocation every level. Maybe give them a couple Cantrips, possibly make some of their current class abilities into an invocation they have to take. If you're so daring, as I sort of am, allow Least, Lesser, Greater, and Dark Invocations to be 1st, 2nd, 3rd, and 4th level spells, respectively. I think Witch or Wiz/Sorc spell list would do the trick. I just wanted to give them an option at every level... Maybe Eldritch Heritage feats as bonus feats for flavor? I dunno.

I also sort of think the Warlock's Curse from 4e wouldn't be a bad ability to port over, either as is, or maybe make it your Charisma modifier as damage.

If you don't want any home brew though, I'd go with the Psionics Cryptic, cause Disrupt Pattern works an awful lot mechanically like EB, and they still get plenty of Power Points to manifest their psionics stuff. There's also another 3rd party warlock lying around, but I personally don't like Cryptic for flavor, or the 3rd party warlock mechanically. I could definitely deal with the Cryptic though for play style, as even though it's not the Warlock, is functionally similar, and still pretty cool with flavor.

[Imbicatus]

A Witch with the Arcane Blast feat fits the flavor of the 3.5 Warlock, but the blast isn't useable unlimited times per day like the Warlock.

[Fiddich]

Thanks for the responses. I am trying to keep out alot of 3rd party things, as I am not well-versed in alot of them.

Thanks for the tip about witch and Arcane Blast. I will have to see which he will enjoy the most.

- Fid

[Kolokotroni]

up to you on ther hellion, but one thing of note, is its author, owen stephens has now been hired by paizo. A pretty good endorsement of his talents. And its only a single class pdf, with mostly repeat rules (uses hexes and the witch's spell list) so its not overly complicated to familiarize yourself with if you wish to use it.

[Fiddich]

Excellent!

Thanks for the advice. I appreciate the guidance.

- Fid

[MrSin]

Invoker is a 3rd party class that's based heavily on the warlock if I remember correctly.

N. Jolly has a version of the warlock I think, and in the suggestion section there are a number of conversions and other homebrew versions of the warlock, some of which are converted from the witch.

In core you aren't going to find anything like the warlock. Pathfinder is terrified of things that can be used all day, especially weak blast or spell like abilities. The witch won't give you what you want.

[Magda Luckbender]

A few suggestions from another old-skool gamer who took up 3.5 and Pathfinder just a few years ago:

* Probably best to stick to Core Rule Book (CRB)for the first few sessions. If someone really wants something more exotic take it on a case by case basis. Make sure the GM understands it before using it. Gradually introduce additional resources.

* From a game balance and character power perspective, the CRB has the strongest options. E.g. Single classed wizard, cleric, druid, and sorcerer. Similarly, a Fighter generally wins the DPR olympics.

* Start at first level (duh!)

* Help everyone learn about Attacks of Opportunity. This funny Youtube video is a great start. My old group found this one both helpful and entertaining when they moved from 2.0 to 3.5

* Not all options are equal. Explicitly discuss character Tier issues prior to creating your keeper PCs. At lower levels the martial characters are stronger than casters, but casters eventually reshape the world.

* Pathfinder and 3.5 break some conventions from earlier editions. Your conventional wisdom may betray you. Try to release preconceptions before they are found to be incorrect. For one Pathfinder example, in-combat healing is not especially effective (with a few exceptions cough ... Life Oracle ... cough) and clerics make powerful offensive combatants.

Regarding the Warlock, there are several Pathfinder classes that could be flavored this way. It sounds like the player is trying to reconstruct an old PC who didn't get enough love. Perhaps tell us the specifics of what THAT character could do, and we can offer suggestions. Most suggestions will probably not be CRB.

[MrSin]

Magda Luckbender wrote:

* Not all options are equal. Explicitly discuss character Tier issues prior to creating your keeper PCs. At lower levels the martial characters are stronger than casters, but casters eventually reshape the world..

They're stronger until the caster cast color spray anyway. Then they're jelly. The downside to color spray being than its x/day, but its still something they can never hope to do.

[Magda Luckbender]

True. Even at low levels an optimized caster is powerful. E.g. Slumber Witch, Heaven's Oracle, et cetera.

My intent here was to help them avoid the situation where e.g. one player creates a terrific rogue while another player creates a summoner with a rogue-like eidolon. The summoner's lackey can do everything the rogue does, only better. PCs need not be balanced with each other, but don't let extreme imbalance sneak up on you.