One of the problems with the current rogue is that it is very focused on traps, and ability that is very relevant in old skool dungeons, but less so in more diverse adventures. How about we regard this as one possible rogue specialization among many. By providing alternative versions of trapfinding and trap sense, we open up more jobs to the rogue than mine clearing. Similar to how a sorcerer chooses bloodline, a specialist rogue would pick a specialization.
Here it that idea expressed as a rogue archetype:
A specialist rogue is focused on a certain role. The standard rogue can be said to be a traps specialist. This archetypes allows for alternate specializations in other roles.
Class Skills The specialist rogue's class skills are Acrobatics (Dex), Appraise (Int), Bluff (Cha), Craft (Int), Diplomacy (Cha), Disable Device (Dex), Disguise (Cha), Escape Artist (Dex), Intimidate (Cha), Knowledge (local) (Int), Perception (Wis), Perform (Cha), Profession (Wis), Sense Motive (Wis), Sleight of Hand (Dex), Stealth (Dex), and Swim (Str). Depending on her specialization, a specialist rogue gains additional class skills.
Skill Ranks per Level: 8 + Int modifier.
Rogue Specialization
At first level, a specialist rogue must select a specialist role, which decides her class skills and how her specialist focus and specialist awareness abilities work. This replaces trapfinding and trap sense.
Backstabber
The backstabber is an athletic combat specialist focused on getting enemies in vulnerable positions and exploiting the advantage as hard as possible.
Class Skills: Add Knowledge (Arcana) (Int), Knowledge (Dungeoneering) (Int), Knowledge (Nature) (Int), Knowledge (Planes) (Int), Knowledge (Religion) (Int), to the list of class skills.
Specialist Focus: The backstabber adds 1/2 her level to Knowledge skill checks made to identify the abilities of enemies, and can make such checks unskilled. She add the same bonus to all Acrobatics skill checks to move through threatened squares (minimum +1) and can do so at full speed without penalty.
Specialist Awareness: The backstabber learns to use her enemies as cover. At third level, the backstabber gains a +1 dodge bonus to Armor Class and Reflex saves when she is in a position where she is outflanked or outflanks an enemy. These bonuses rise to +2 when the specialist rogue reaches 6th level, to +3 when she reaches 9th level, to +4 when she reaches 12th level, to +5 at 15th, and to +6 at 18th level.
Face
The face is a charming criminal. She runs negotiations with other gangs, fences, and specialists, bribes officials, runs protection rackets, and maintains the fear and loyalty that holds the gang's territory together. As an independent, she can be an adventurous merchant, con artist, fixer, or gambler.
Class Skills: Add Knowledge (Nobility) (Int), Knowledge (Religion) (Int), Linguistics (Int), and Use Magic Device (Cha), to the list of class skills.
Specialist Focus: The face adds 1/2 her level to Bluff and Diplomacy skill checks (minimum +1).
Specialist Awareness: At 3rd level, a face reacts intuitively to danger and can take a double move in a surprise round, even when she would not normally be allowed to act. This also gives her a +1 bonus on Initiative and a +1 dodge bonus to AC during a surprise round and in rounds when she does nothing but move. These bonuses rise to +2 when the specialist rogue reaches 6th level, to +3 when she reaches 9th level, to +4 when she reaches 12th level, to +5 at 15th, and to +6 at 18th level.
Fence
A specialist in appraising, laundering, and selling stolen and hot property, the fence tries to stay away from physical threats. Her special talents lies in avoiding detection and spotting curses before they cause any harm.
Class Skills: Add Knowledge (History) (Int), Knowledge (Nobility) (Int), Linguistics (Int), Use Magic Device (Cha), to the list of class skills.
Specialist Focus: The fence adds 1/2 her level to Craft skill checks made to forge or launder an item, to Linguistics checks made to forge an item's credentials, and to all Appraise skill checks (minimum +1). While appraising an item, she can use the Appraise skill to spot a cursed item (DC 15 + the cursed item's caster level) without triggering the curse.
Specialist Awareness: At 3rd level, a fence a special skill at avoiding curses and detection, giving her a +1 bonus on Will saves against divination magic. She is allowed a Will saving throw against any divination effect, even ones that do not normally allow a saving throw such as ''detect magic''. Items she has stowed away count as being in her possession for saving throws against divination magic and uses her saving throws. These bonuses rise to +2 when the specialist rogue reaches 6th level, to +3 when she reaches 9th level, to +4 when she reaches 12th level, to +5 at 15th, and to +6 at 18th level.
Pickpocket
A pickpocket is a specialist in minor street crime, mainly pick-pocketing and purse cutting, but at higher levels also the stealing of letters, compromising evidence, and other small items. Most pickpockets are youths or children with little skill, those who make a career of this need to be able to maintain a veneer of respectability to gain admittance to the scene of the crime .
Class Skills: Add Handle Animal (Cha), Knowledge (Nobility) (Int), Knowledge (Religion) (Int), Use Magic Device (Cha), to the list of class skills.
Specialist Focus: The pickpocket adds 1/2 her level to Disguise skill checks as long as the disguise is only in minor details (generally to fit into a social context), on Stealth checks to hide in a crowd as long as she is disguised to fit into that group, and to Sleight of Hand skill checks (minimum +1).
Specialist Awareness: At 3rd level, a pickpocket gains the ability to disappear in a crowd, giving her a +1 bonus on Reflex saves and a +1 dodge bonus to AC against attacks made against her as long as she is in a crowd (see urban adventures) or there are at least 4 other creatures adjacent to her. These bonuses rise to +2 when the specialist rogue reaches 6th level, to +3 when she reaches 9th level, to +4 when she reaches 12th level, to +5 at 15th, and to +6 at 18th level.
Point Man
The point man is a dedicated lookout and scout, the first to advance into unknown territory and covering the backs of others while they do what they have to do.
Class Skills: Add Climb (Str), Handle Animal (Cha), Ride (Dex), Use Magic Device (Cha), to the list of class skills.
Specialist Focus: The point man adds 1/2 her level to Disable device skill checks made to open doors and other openings and to Perception skill checks (minimum +1).
Specialist Awareness: At 3rd level, a point man gains an intuitive sense that alerts her to newly arrived enemies, giving her a +1 bonus on Reflex saves and a +1 dodge bonus to AC against attacks made in the first round of regular combat (not a surprise round). These bonuses rise to +2 when the specialist rogue reaches 6th level, to +3 when she reaches 9th level, to +4 when she reaches 12th level, to +5 at 15th, and to +6 at 18th level.
Runner
A runners is a delivery girl and mobility and getaway expert. A runner runs contraband short distances and is often the fastest and most reliable way to deliver a message. A runner is also an excellent second-storey man, able to get to places no-one thought needed security.
Class Skills: Add Climb (Str), Knowledge (Engineering) (Int), Ride (Dex), and Use Magic Device (Cha), to the list of class skills.
Specialist Focus: The runner adds 1/2 her level to Knowledge skill checks made to know a shortcut, best route, or to know where a person can be found at the moment, and to all Acrobatics skill checks (minimum +1). A runner can use Acrobatics to climb as long as she uses accelerated climbing.
Specialist Awareness: At 3rd level, a runner gains the ability to run and dodge, giving her a +1 bonus on Initiative at all times and a +1 bonus on Reflex saves and a +1 dodge bonus to AC in any round in which she only moves or interacts with terrain and unattended objects. These bonuses rise to +2 when the specialist rogue reaches 6th level, to +3 when she reaches 9th level, to +4 when she reaches 12th level, to +5 at 15th, and to +6 at 18th level.
Scoundrel
The scoundrel is a rogue specializing in versatility. This happy-go-lucky individual can stand in for any more specialized rogue and makes a great solo operative.
Class Skills: Add Climb (Str), Linguistics (Int), Ride (Dex), Use Magic Device (Cha), to the list of class skills.
Specialist Focus: The scoundrel lacks a specialist focus.
Specialist Awareness: The scoundrel is a great improviser and talented in many areas. At third level, a scoundrel gains a +1 bonus on Acrobatics (Dex), Bluff (Cha), Disable Device (Dex), Escape Artist (Dex), Perception (Wis), Sense Motive (Wis), Sleight of Hand (Dex), and Stealth (Dex) skill checks. These bonuses rise to +2 when the specialist rogue reaches 6th level, to +3 when she reaches 9th level, to +4 when she reaches 12th level, to +5 at 15th, and to +6 at 18th level.
Smuggler
A smuggler delivers cargoes between distant destinations. His main skill is to avoid detection, it is just not economical to try to force your way past customs and barriers. A smuggler needs to know his vehicle and the terrain he operates in better than anyone.
Class Skills: Add Climb (Str), Knowledge (Geography) (Int), Ride (Dex), Survival (Wis), to the list of class skills.
Specialist Focus: The smuggler adds 1/2 her level to Profession skill checks made to run a vehicle or caravan (such as teamster or sailor) and to all Stealth skill checks (minimum +1). She can use her Stealth skill modifier to hide a vehicle or caravan she is running (including any passengers), but suffer the Stealth size penalty for the size of the vehicle or caravan.
Specialist Awareness: At 3rd level, a smuggler gains an intuitive sense that alerts her to danger while sneaking, giving her a +1 bonus on Reflex saves and a +1 dodge bonus to AC as long as she is trying to use Stealth. These bonuses rise to +2 when the specialist rogue reaches 6th level, to +3 when she reaches 9th level, to +4 when she reaches 12th level, to +5 at 15th, and to +6 at 18th level.
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Heyyy, a suggested Rogue revamp that isn't the same old "Rogues Rogues, Suck Suck, Cocktail Napkin Arithmetic Knows All, Rama Rama" - I like this!
Comments:
Universal - I don't see why Climb shouldn't be a class skill for all Rogues, certainly as long as Swim is.
Backstabber - I'd suggest renaming it "Hit-man." I'm skeptical of it getting all those esoteric Knowledge skills as class skills, though I understand what your intent is. Without giving it as much thought as I could, I might say give it Heal and just one of those Knowledge skills (to reflect the Hit-Man's personal proclivity, not unlike a Favored Enemy) as bonus class skills, and allow it to add one-and-a-half times its level (so, +1 at 1st level, +3 at 2nd, etc.) to Knowledge checks for the purposes you describe under its Specialist Focus.
Face - While I can see reason to give it Knowledge (Religion) as a class skill (they sound like they might sometimes be called on to perform wedding ceremonies for crime families), there isn't quite enough there, and a lot of what is can just as soon be covered by Knowledge (Nobility) - the rest is, quite frankly, too esoteric for most Rogues (certainly if you're not going to give the fence Knowledge [Arcana] or Spellcraft, a decision I'm on board with, especially given how you handled it instead); Given that they're outgoing fixers and emissaries and so forth, I'd switch out Knowledge (Religion) for Knowledge (Geography) and call it good.
Pickpocket - I'm less than sure about giving it those Knowledge skills; what I'd be inclined to do instead is take them out and give it Skill Focus (Knowledge [Local]) as a bonus feat (perhaps at 2nd or 3rd level to make sure people don't take a level in Pickpocket just for the bonus feat). I'd also lower the number of adjacent creatures required to benefit from its Specialist Awareness to 3, and then lower it again to 2 at 9th level.
Scoundrel - A versatility specialist ought to have somewhat more open-ended abilities; I'd give it one additional class skill of its choice that it doesn't already have OR a +1 bonus to any two skills of its choice, and one additional skill of its choice to grant its Specialist Awareness bonus to. Rather than having diddly for a Specialist Focus, I'd give it Extra Rogue Talent as a bonus feat at 3rd level.
Smuggler - As athas.org's DARK SUN 3.5 Athasian Bard demonstrated, two skills above all should be associated with the profession of smuggler: Bluff and Sleight of Hand. In this case, what I'd do is invent a new feat called "Smuggler" that follows the same pattern as feats like Alertness, Athletic, Deceitful, and so forth (+2 to two skills, can eventually increase to +4), and give this Smuggler that as a bonus feat at 3rd level.
Finally - I'd be inclined to say these specializations deserve more interesting stuff once high levels are reached; what I'd do to accomplish that is provide each specialization with 2 or 3 exclusive Advanced Rogue Talents at the expense of being prohibited from ever taking an equivalent number of Advanced Rogue Talents that are already on the list (for example, the Face might lose access to Hide In Plain Sight and Frugal Trapsmith, while the Point Man would lose Rumormonger and Deadly Cocktail; they'd both gain access to two new Advanced Talents exclusive to their specialization).
Nice comments so quick. The listed skills can definitely use some work, but its nice that you like the idea itself.
Agree Climb can be a skill all specialized rogues have, giving them only 3 skills each - it was often a bother trying to find 4 skills that fit.
Abut the smuggler, I think the Runner and Pickpocket covers the kind of smuggler you're talking about - the smuggler here is more about smuggling boatloads of stuff.
For higher-level abilities, I could see some new advanced talents fitting these roles - maybe even just recommended rogue talents. I am reluctant to give the specialized rogue new features that don't replace something the rogue already has, and there really isn't much past level 10 to replace.
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Like I said, nothing but Advanced Rogue Talent options, but those there are - options for options sounds fair enough to me. "Recommendations" seem more pointless than not to me, and some of these cry out for something that isn't already offered. A few off-the-cuff ideas:
Hit-man: Something akin to a Cavalier's Challenge or Ranger's Quarry or Favored Enemy?
Face: Activate a "plant?" Subtle mind-control abilities (like the Bene Gesserit Voice from Dune)?
Fence: Permanent blessing of nondetection? The ability to cast remove curse? Object Reading similar to the psionic power that has yet to make it into Pathfinder proper?
Pickpocket: "Eyes all over the city?" Exceptional ability to 'read' what a person has on them, the better to know what to steal and to successfully steal it (even in combat)?
Point Man: Develop an eidetic memory? "Spider-sense"? Improved Deflect/Snatch Missiles Ozymandias-style?
Runner: Personal haste for a certain number of rounds per day? Same thing, but spider climb? Ethereal jaunt? Monk-like movement speed bonus?
Scoundrel: Something like Archeologist's Luck? Reroll anything once per day? Limited wish, but even more limited? Serendipitously come into the possession of a random wondrous item?
Smuggler: Favored Terrain? A one-time bonus of gold and/or a magic item of choice (the ability to choose being offset by not having the chance to get things as good as what the Scoundrel might get randomly)? The full-on athas.org 3.5 DARK SUN Athasian Bard Smuggler class feature (bonus to Sleight of hand and Bluff checks equal to half level)? A personal secret chest?
I understand about the Smuggler - but they still need their Bluff bonus (and Sleight of Hand, depending). Think of what the smuggler from The Hobbit had to deal with, to name only one.
* Noted, will continue to look at it. Thanks again.