| Liam Warner |
I've been looking at the map an while it makes a nice pirate base it seems too small to actually develop if your that way inclined (as I am). From what I can see of the scale the entire island is only about 45 sqaure miles in size when you take away the two large bays, the various cliffs and mountains, the inner lake and add in some of that length is islets with ocean between them and the main island that doesn't seem a lot of room to build a small town.
I'm not expecting a kingmaker kingdom the size of Maine (or more not sure how that ends up just going by forum posts) but I thought from the maps/description I could build a town (castle, surrounding village with between a few hundred to a couple of thousand people and some farms to feed same plus if your lucky a mine of precious gems or metals to go with a pearl farm in the smaller bay) inland for protection and keep the fort plus build another on the other bay for protection and trade, now I'm wondering if any decent settlemet would cover the entire island. I mean rather than on a cliff overlooking the bay the fort actually seems to be build down by the water itself.
Anyway is it just me or is this island reward really that small or am I mistaken and you could build your own little kingso there?
| Fitzwalrus |
Outside of some of the larger holdings like Quent, Bag Island and Port Peril (which is sort of the brass ring at the end of the ride) I'm not sure very many of the various pirate holdings are intended to be totally self-sufficient economies. Most of the choice, larger locations are already occupied, and the smaller places like Tidewater Rock, Gannet Island or Isle of Empty Eyes are more a base of operations to be supported by the plunder taken by the pirate fleets based there (or the trade therefrom) rather than a prime site for colonization.
Our PCs are getting to the Shackles decades too late to carve out any major holdings without taking them away from someone else - which is kind of the whole point of the AP as written.
| Orfamay Quest |
As a general guideline, it takes about 1-2 acres of farmland to support a person. Ten square miles would be 6400 acres, so you could put the isle to the plow and support a population of 2000 people relatively easily, and even more so if you account for aquaculture and don't mind eating lots of fish and seaweed.
A bigger problem is raw materials. The analysis above assumes decent soil. Rocky outcroppings in the middle of the ocean tend not to have much soil, and what they have is salt-poisoned and poor. If you're going to use this as a base, you'll also need lots of expensive equipment and supplies -- cordage, canvas, and coopers staves, timber and tin, barrels and ballista bolts, et cetera. You'll almost certainly need to trade for much of what you need, and other than plunder, I'm not sure what you would have in trade.
| Liam Warner |
Magic can do wonders for that and I don't mind looting/trading for some, guess I may have gotten a bit of a misaprehension about the size of these places. I thought Port peril and the like were about the size of Norfolk island I.e. multiple settlements could be supported while the reward for the race could handle one (the fort was more of a defensive emplacement) with at least 4-5 hundred (Pc's with leadership) and possibly up to a few thousand but weren't in use due to the original dangerous occupants. Still the land area is apparently there (thanks for that information) so maybe it can be pulled off.
| ThunderMan |
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My city has,
• City 347,483
• Density 2,400/sq mi (930/km2)
• Urban 523,994
• Urban density 3,785.0/sq mi (1,461.4/km2)
• Metro 839,631
• Metro density 103.3/sq mi (39.9/km2)
The city limits are just under 150 square miles. And this is a pretty big agriculture city.
In golarion, I think only Absolom is bigger with a higher density. Most other towns and city's in the golarion setting you could fit on the island. Keep in mind this island already held a town of Cyclopes for a very long time and was able to feed at least a hundred of these guys.
So you could have a town of over 2000 people and still be in good shape with modern farming techniques. Or in golarion, have a Druid or two help with your farming, having domestic herd animals will help and don't need the space people do but that does mean farmland for grazing, or animal feed. And fishing is a staple food supply in many places.
So the island is plenty big enough to settle with a good population of people, you just can't look at population standards in a modern era.
And if it still isn't big enough for you, magic is the solution. There is a lot of dirt that can be moved from a 500 foot tall Mesa that is several square miles in area.
So a square mile, is 5280 ft multiplied by 5280 ft, with a 500 foot tall Mesa, we get with a single square mile of Mesa moved with magic is 13,939,200,000 square feet of rock dirt and filler that can be moved into the surrounding sea to expand the island, and this also discounts doing the same to the ocean floor to dredge up some land.
Don't have the time or people to do it yourself? Animate object, and let them work it out.
Best thing about golarion is that you have options to solve problems.