Racial Heritage & Aquatic Ancestry


Rules Questions


1 person marked this as FAQ candidate.

I was allowed in my game to use both in conjunction but it seems that you shouldn't have to gain both to be able to breathe air underwater, I'm already aware it isn't a humanoid- we bypassed that as mechanically giving up two feats to be able to breathe underwater seems more than fair. I think it actually undermines it a bit more than it is fair...

The aquatic ancestry feat is poorly written. The amphibious special quality gives the ability to breathe air. Undine already have the ability to breathe air. If it just didn't work right in conjunction with racial heritage, that would be understandable. But it doesn't do what it's supposed to even when used in exactly the way expected. Can just taking racial heritage being undine to give the ability to breathe air? It seems like two things that do the same thing overlapping to get a result just one of them should be able to afford you.

Dark Archive

Amphibious grants the aquatic subtype, therefore the ability to breath underwater:

Quote:
Amphibious (Ex) Creatures with this special quality have the aquatic subtype, but they can survive indefinitely on land.
Quote:
Aquatic Subtype: These creatures always have swim speeds and can move in water without making Swim checks. An aquatic creature can breathe water. It cannot breathe air unless it has the amphibious special quality. Aquatic creatures always treat Swim as a class skill.

The only problem is, that a human doesn't have a swim speed, but considering that racial heritage does not allow outsider races, that's a rather minor problem.


Physical Description: Undines display a wide variation of skin tones, ranging from pale turquoise to deep blue to sea green. An undine's straight, thick hair tends to be of a similar, yet slightly darker color than her skin. All have limpid blue eyes. Physically, undines most resemble humans, and their physiques show human diversity in regard to overall height and body type. Aside from their coloration, their most racially defining traits remain their fin-like ears and webbed hands and feet.

Society: Undines define themselves as a unique race and are capable of producing undine offspring. While they remain able to interbreed with humans, they tend to keep to themselves, and form small, reclusive communities near bodies of water, or in some cases, floating settlements. A typical undine community lives under the guidance of a small council comprising officials appointed by consensus. Council positions can be held indefinitely, though a community unhappy with the performance of a council member can call for her resignation.

Intermarriage in undine communities is common, with children raised communally. A fair amount of regional diversity exists in undine culture, as inf luenced by the specific ancestry of independent settlements. It should also be noted that not all undine in a single settlement claim the same ancestry, as undines may marry other undines from outside their own communities.

Relations: Undines hold no biases or prejudices toward any particular races. Their communities rely primarily on trade, giving them ample opportunity to interact with a diverse range of outsiders and foreigners. They have no qualms about establishing neighborhoods within the settlements of other races, provided adequate respect is given to both the undines and any nearby bodies of water. Still, in such instances, a given undine community does what it can to retain its autonomy.

Given the descriptors liking them to Humans so much I cannot understand why they wouldn't be allowed in conjunction- and clearly if you become undine you would assume some swim speed as it becomes part of your class.

Grand Lodge

You cannot select Undine with the Racial Heritage feat.

Undine are Outsiders, and not Humanoids.

You could select Stone Giant, or Ogre, but not Undine.

The feat combo is not legal.


Before I digress to my original question, so if you were to assume it was a legal feat combo, Racial Heritage and undine- what then? Would you still believe you would need to take Aquatic Ancestry as well anyway?

Dark Archive

Racial Heritage does not grant you racial traits. It's powerful enough as it is. Mythic Racial Heritage allows you to gain one racial trait.


Why not just take Heritage: Merfolk?


PRD wrote:

Aquatic Ancestry: You gain the amphibious special quality. Your swim speed increases by +10 feet.

Amphibious (Ex):Creatures with this special quality have the aquatic subtype, but they can survive indefinitely on land.

"Creatures with this special quality have the aquatic subtype..."

So the Amphibious ability has aquatic subtype built into it. If something grants you Amphibious(Ex), but you don't already have the aquatic subtype, you gain it by default. So it sounds to me like it would work. The only prereq for Aquatic Ancestry is Undine and your modified Racial Heritage covers that. Remember that Undine doesn't come standard with Aquatic subtype either.

In fact, Merfolk are Humanoids with the Aquatic subtype so taking Racial Heritage(Merfolk) would make you a Humanoid(Human, Aquatic) but Amphibious is a Racial trait so a Humanoid(Human, Aquatic) would not be able to breathe air... they'd have to spend all their time in the water since Amphibious doesn't come along for the ride.

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