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A rogue is proficient with all simple and martial weapons, plus the hand crossbow and shuriken, and with light armor.
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why martial? because not all rogues use finesse weapons and focus primarily on Dexterity. Dexterity is still an excellent choice, because of the light armor, reflex/evasion and stealthy skill synergies, built directly into the class. But martial weapons open up two-handed weapons and expanded special quality weapons, as well as synergizing with the various weapon familiarity racial features. Daggers are still a fine choice, being at once a melee, grappling, ranged, and concealable weapon. why shuriken? to allow the 'ninja' option in core - or just a non-supernatural 'ninja' concept in general. also, this weapon is the easiest weapon to conceal of them all (+4!). overall, this set of weapons covers the widest variety of 'rogue' concepts, of which there are many, bypassing the need to multiclass to acquire proficiency with the tools of the trade for any particular one.
thoughts?
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ok, new thought. maybe instead of freely granting martial weapons, we just let proficiency with all martial weapons be a rogue talent...
Weapon Training (alternate):
A rogue with this talent gains proficiency with all martial weapons.
... in order to further justify a much more relevant change. i propose the rogue be granted all skills as class skills. sort of her special thing, much like the monk has all saving throws. and so:
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HD: d8
BAB: 3/4
Saves: Reflex
Skill Points: 8
Class Skills: () - Acrobatics (Dex), Appraise (Int), Bluff (Cha), Climb (Str), Craft (Int), Diplomacy (Cha), Disable Device (Dex), Disguise (Cha), Escape Artist (Dex), (Dex), (Cha), (Wis), Intimidate (Cha), (Int), Linguistics (Int), Perception (Wis), Perform (Cha), Profession (Wis), Sense Motive (Wis), Sleight of Hand (Dex), (Dex), (Int), Stealth (Dex), (Wis), Swim (Str), and Use Magic Device (Cha).
Proficiencies: Simple weapons, hand crossbow, rapier, sap, shortbow, shortsword, and light armor.
Starting Wealth: 4d6x10 gp (average 140 gp)
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because, bard, ranger, alchemist, investigator, all these classes lay claim to excelling in the skills department (in addition to their spells and two good saves, etc). so, this proposal helps to keep the rogue abreast. besides, the skills gained - Fly, Handle Animal, Heal, Knowledge (arcana, engineering, geography, history, nature, nobility, planes, and religion), Ride, Spellcraft, and Survival - might all be covered by 'rogue models' under the rogue's introductory paragraph ():
Rogue (in core rulebook):
Life is an endless adventure for those who live by their wits. Ever just one step ahead of danger, rogues bank on their cunning, skill, and charm to bend fate to their favor. Never knowing what to expect, they prepare for everything, becoming masters of a wide variety of skills, training themselves to be adept manipulators, , shadowy stalkers, or masters of any of dozens of other professions or talents. Thieves and gamblers, fast talkers and , and , and and all might be considered rogues, as well as countless other professions that rely upon wits, prowess, or luck. Although many rogues favor cities and the innumerable opportunities of civilization, some embrace lives on the road, journeying far, meeting exotic people, and facing fantastic danger in pursuit of equally fantastic riches. In the end, any who desire to shape their fates and live life on their own terms might come to be called rogues.
'agile acrobats' - Fly
'diplomats' - various Knowledges (especially History and Nobility)
'bandits' and 'bounty hunters' - Handle Animal, Ride, Survival
'explorers' and 'investigators' - Heal, various Knowledges, Spellcraft
the rogue class is meant to be versatile, and this is an easy way to ensure that, by allowing the rogue to excell at any skill she tries her hand at.
thoughts?
I certainly wouldn't give them all martial proficiencies for free. Why should a rogue be proficient with something like a heavy pick, spiked shield or falchion? Allowing it as a talent is OK because it's not going to make a huge amount of difference (greatsword and longbow?) and rogues could use the help.
All skills as class skills is fairly reasonable. It's not as though it's going to break anything - it's just +3 to a bunch of skills he won't be relying on much anyway - and he has only a limited number of skill points to go around.
To be honest it probably wouldn't break the game if you gave all the classes martial proficiency. The 1/2 BAB classes can't use them effectively and the 3/4 BAB classes probably should've had them in the first place. They also don't cost too much to get, so why not too bad to just remove the tax in the first place.
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Mudfoot,
the 'flavor' idea behind the proposal was less that the rogue had a background of training in every weapon (like a fighter), but rather that she had a knack for using all sorts of tools (including weapons) to get the job done. her lack of training reflects in her lower BAB rather than as a non-proficiency penalty.
anyhow,
with Weapon Training granting proficiency with all martial weapons, but not until 2nd level, most DMs'd probably let you grab a Martial Weapon Proficiency feat at 1st level, and when you grab Weapon Training at 2nd level, allow you to swap out MWP for another appropriate 1st level feat, so's you can use the weapon you want right out of the gates.