Dazing Spell on Multiple Hit spells

[Iorthol]

Does Dazing Spell cause spells such as magic missile and scorching ray against the same creature to make multiple will saves against multiple chances for dazing?

Ex. Would an orc hit by a CL 9 magic missile make 5 will saves to avoid become dazed?

[Ravingdork]

Probably not.

However, an orc standing next to a wall of fire would have to save every round. An orc attacking you when you have dazing fire shield up would have to save for every attack he lands.

[Iorthol]

Do you have any sort of documentation to support the idea that it wouldn't cause multiple saves?

[Ravingdork]

Not for dazing specifically, though I've seen several discussions with similar metamagic feats in which the designers stated that the effects were only applied once (I think it was in regards to a toppling magic missile spell and whether or not the target was facing multiple trip attempts).

[james maissen]

Iorthol wrote:

Do you have any sort of documentation to support the idea that it wouldn't cause multiple saves?

Well it would be one SR roll, and not 5 rolls if the target had SR.

The magic missiles hit simultaneously, so why would you suspect that it would be 5 saves?

Quote:

You can modify a spell to daze a creature damaged by the spell. When a creature takes damage from this spell, they become dazed for a number of rounds equal to the original level of the spell.

For a magic missile, there would be only one time where a creature would be damaged by that spell.

But YMMV,

James

[Iorthol]

James: By SR I meant Scorching Rays not Spell Resistance, but that mechanic is similarly supporting.

You have sound logic. I'm seeking specific rulings to fully back up my theory of 1 chance to daze.

[Melvin the Mediocre]

I don't think there has ever been an official ruling, but there is a pretty solid consensus that the secondary effect is only attempted once per target. You can do some searches for toppling spell and magic missile to view some more discussions.

[james maissen]

Iorthol wrote:

James: By SR I meant Scorching Rays not Spell Resistance, but that mechanic is similarly supporting.

You have sound logic. I'm seeking specific rulings to fully back up my theory of 1 chance to daze.

You didn't use 'SR', but instead did spell out scorching ray.. which, like magic missile, hits simultaneously.

Now the counter is that energy resistance is applied for each ray in the scorching ray.

However, the wording on the metamagic is 'when a creature is damaged by the spell' and as such this only occurs at one time for these two spells.

Now for Melf's Acid Arrow or Wall of Fire, these spells damage each round and so could make victims need to save more than once.

-James

[Richard McGuffin]

Sorry for the necro, but this was the thread I found with a similar headline so why start another right?

Question is: Does a creature hit by a Dazing Spell + Spiritual Weapon reset the daze counter when hit on consecutive turns? Assuming failed saves of course.

[Rory]

Richard McGuffin wrote:

Question is: Does a creature hit by a Dazing Spell + Spiritual Weapon reset the daze counter when hit on consecutive turns? Assuming failed saves of course.

Yes. The second hit and subsequent failed save places the dazed condition anew on the target with the longer duration taking effect.