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I just had a few questions regarding this ability because I've heard answers in both directions regarding some things.
When the ability Storm Shape increases to Huge etc, does this actually affect YOUR size? If so, does this affect your Strength for size increase, or perhaps unarmed damage for purposes of the whirlwind ability?
I've just been thinking because someone pointed out that the DC for the Whirlwind ability is REALLY low for this class unless your Strength is skyrockety. There was just a few things about it all that made me wonder if it'd be unbalanced to make the Kindler's size increase as well?
Any input/clarification is much appreciated!
Oh... so nobody has really come to a true yes/no on the matter then?
Sounds like people are mostly saying just use Wildshape to an animal with really high strength first?
Have any actual Paizo staff comment on this before? I'm just really curious since I'll be playing this character sooner than later.
I wonder if there's any way to get a mod/developer's attention... hm. I'm mostly just concerned because someone pointed out at some level, the DC for it is almost impossible to NOT beat, making the power nearly useless unless your Strength is ridiculous.
That is also a very good use of that ability. Only thing is the DC may be incredibly low. Or possibly a lot better than I expect it, depending what the answer to this riddle of a move is.
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The Master of Storms can damage and trap Small or smaller creatures caught in her whirlwind, dealing lethal damage equal to her unarmed strike damage to each one that fails a Reflex save (DC 10 + the Master of Storms's class level + the Master of Storms's Strength modifier) and lifting it into the air if it fails a second Reflex save.
At 4th level, and again every two levels thereafter, the size of creatures the Master of Storms can affect increases by one step, to a maximum of Huge at 8th level.
I fail to see where a DC of 10 + prestige class level + strength bonus is "incredibly low".
When the ability Storm Shape increases to Huge etc, does this actually affect YOUR size? If so, does this affect your Strength for size increase, or perhaps unarmed damage for purposes of the whirlwind ability?
At 2nd level, a Master of Storms becomes a physical embodiment of the fury of the storm. As a standard action, she can transform herself into a whirlwind (as whirlwind universal monster ability) for a number of minutes per day equal to her class level. This time need not be consecutive, but must be spent in 1-minute increments.
....The whirlwind is always 5 feet wide at its base, but its height and width at the top vary from creature to creature (minimum 10 feet high). A whirlwind’s width at its peak is always equal to half of its height. The creature controls the exact height, but it must be at least 10 feet high.
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As a swift action, the Master of Storms can change the height of her whirlwind form from a minimum of 10 feet tall to a maximum of 20 feet tall.
At 4th level, and again every two levels thereafter, the maximum height of the whirlwind increases by 10 feet, to a maximum of 60 feet tall at 10th level.
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The Master of Storms can damage and trap Small or smaller creatures caught in her whirlwind, dealing lethal damage equal to her unarmed strike damage to each one that fails a Reflex save (DC 10 + the Master of Storms's class level + the Master of Storms's Strength modifier) and lifting it into the air if it fails a second Reflex save.At 4th level, and again every two levels thereafter, the size of creatures the Master of Storms can affect increases by one step, to a maximum of Huge at 8th level.
The answer seem straightforward, the Master of Storm size don't change, he still occupy a 5' square, what change is the height of the funnel and what he can affect. Not the size of the character.
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Well, let's look at 4th level as an example. Entry requirements mean you're a 10th level character. The DC will probably be 15-19, and the target gets two chances to make the check.
As for size, he's not just a 5' square. He's a cone. At the bottom he's 5', but he's 30' tall, and his head is a 15' diameter. That would be a huge size, I think.
May just be my character's fault for having a strength of 14. I just have a not-so-sure feeling now on if this class was meant for Druids, or Clerics, or what. But it seems to be a weird mix of spellcasting and certain abilities.
My stats for my character are:
14 Str
14 Dex
12 Con
12 Int
18 Wis
7 Cha
So that means when I'm first level in the Prestige Class, the DC would be:
10 + 1 + 2. 13. A reflex save of 13 for small creatures, who likely have a higher reflex save AND dex sounds like my ability literally won't see any use if they can save probably 80% of the time. I could be looking at this all wrong though. Some people did say you can turn into animals with higher strength to augment this, and there IS a feat to turn large when you wildshape. I wasn't intending on putting my stat points into strength as I levelled though. Was more intending on putting more into Wisdom (Though I guess it wouldn't hurt to put the first two into Wisdom, then strength onward).
Does give me the idea to take the Special Ability Focus feat, however. Er, actually, thinking about it, does Ability Focus even affect the Master of Storm's Storm Shape ability? Or is there any feat that does give +DC bonuses to Supernatural abilities?
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At level 8, if your goal is to play a shapechanging druid, a belt of giant strength +2 would be appropriate, so a DC of 15 for the whirlwind.
Or you can use bull strength to boost your strength.
And you force people to save every time you enter their square, not once/turn.
So it is not 1 successful save vs DC to avoid damage and if that fail 1 successful save to avoid being picked up. It is one ST every time you enter their square.
A Good ST for a CR 8 creature is 11. Let's assume you don't have a flying speed without the spell and that you have a land speed of 30'.
You start 10' from the enemy already in whirlwind form.
Fly forward 10', check for damage, eventually for picking him up, if the target isn't picked up, move another 5' and then back, second check, rinse and repeat as many time as needed.
With a 30' base speed and a double move, you can force someone to make 6 saves.
With a 15% failure chance for each save you have a 62% chance of dealing some damage, regardless of the target AC.
If you transform in a small air elemental before entering whirlwind form you have a fly speed of 60 and you can force someone to take 12 saves. That is a 85% chance of inflicting him some damage.
With Bull strength the DC would be harder by 1 point, making the chances of delivering some damage 73% with a base speed of 30 and 93% for a base speed of 60.
With a DC of 14 the chances of grabbing your target are only 12% and 23%, fairly low, but that is the value against a target whose good save is reflex. If he has a bad reflex St he is in for a world of hurt.
For an ability that you take at level 7 it don't seem bad at all.
Note: you need to maximize your fly skill, to be able to maneuver with ease while flying.
Note 2: you get storm shape at level 2 in the PRC, so the minimum DC is 12+your strength bonus.
Oh! Well, you've kind of opened my eyes to some opportunities with this ability. For that, I thank you. I was kind of wondering about any ways to up the DC of the Whirlwind ability (Like, aside from upping strength), possibly via feat or whatnot.
Also, a question. While in whirlwind form, can things hit you?
It is such a strange ability, to be honest. Raises so many questions... like... do you technically turn into a whirlwind yourself? Or do you just start magically exuding a whirlwind around yourself? Because by the sounds of it, you can go into enemy spaces as if you yourself weren't a physical being... and you can have creatures inside you (I think that's how the whirlwind description describes it?), but people can still swing a sword at something that is technically just... air, and hurt it. It is VERY confusing.
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on the back and forth vacumn cleaner thing.
Don't forget, you are flying. That means *each* of those 180 reverses will require a fly skill check.
I pointed out that you need to maximize your flying skill. Instead I forgot that urning cost you 5' of movement and a 180° degree turn cost 10' of movement. So the whirlwind is very useful to attack several enemies in adjacent squares, less useful if you want to attack multiple times the same enemy (and it is appropriate too)
If you take this prestige class it would be very useful to print the page with the Flying skill rules.