| 2 people marked this as FAQ candidate. |
Let's say my character is using Form of the Dragon II to change into a dragon of size M. Is it exactly as if he had cast Form of the Dragon I or does he get DR for example?
Read the spell descriptions... You get EXACTLY WHAT THE SPELL SAYS YOU GET.
Very interesting (and helpful) answer...
Why in the Hells would anyone want to change into a medium dragon when they qualify for bigger? The main reason for casting the spell is to terrify the mooks after all.
Space, but this isn't the point I want to discuss, even if we're free to talk about it.
So, I'm sorry but the description of this spell isn't as straightforward for me as it seems for you. For example, there is no reason why the size bonus and the natural attacks should change between Form of the Dragon I and Form of the Dragon II - it doesn't between the different Beast Shape spells and the damage dices of the natural attacks are the ones corresponding to the appropriate dragon size. I wonder about the other abilities... and this is why I'm asking.
In the past Elemental Body was discussed like this, same reason, and the answer was...
Stat/Nat armor changes and nat attacks are size based, if you're using the old spells size, you use the old spells stats. [Those are a product/partial product of your polymorph size not the/just the spell.]
Powers (DR, breath, I think even fly by RAW, etc) use the new spells, as they are spell/power level based not size based. [Those are purely a product of the spell, they don't interact with size charts anywhere.]
It's not a perfect answer, polymorph stuff has more than a few "but what if these combine?" questions that lead to grey areas, but it was where that discussion landed, for what it's worth.
That understanding sounds like an artifact of 3.x Polymorph rules.
PRPG Polymorph no longer includes any adjustment to stats directly based on changing Size.
There is only the "Size Bonus" category, which in fact can apply even when you aren't changing Size Category at all.
(it would be clearer to call it "Polymorph Bonus" or some such)
This spell functions as form of the dragon I except that it also allows you to assume the form of a Large chromatic or metallic dragon. You gain the following abilities: a +6 size bonus to Strength, a +4 size bonus to Constitution, a +6 natural armor bonus, fly 90 feet (poor), darkvision 60 feet, a breath weapon, DR 5/magic, and resistance to one element. You also gain one bite (2d6), two claws (1d8), two wing attacks (1d6), and one tail slap attack (1d8). You can only use the breath weapon twice per casting of this spell, and you must wait 1d4 rounds between uses. All breath weapons deal 8d8 points of damage and allow a Reflex save for half damage. Line breath weapons increase to 80-foot lines and cones increase to 40-foot cones.
None of the granted bonuses are DEPENDENT on choosing the Large form, the Large size is just a choice you "also" have, you gain the same bonuses and specified abilities regardless of if you choose the Medium DF1 size or the Large size. That also goes for the nat weapon damage dice, they are the same when using DF2 regardless of size (RAW).
Elemental Body is similar, in that the stat bonuses depend on the spell (and chosen Element), not the Size.
(some abilities depend on the Size of Elemental, but that comes down to the difference in wording, Form of Dragon does not state that)
Beast Shape's stat bonuses, etc, are dependent on size of creature, again, due to difference in wording vs. Form of Dragon.
I guess it's worth FAQ'ing to clarify what the intent is, if ANY effects should depend on size, even if stats/DR don't change, weapon damage die for one seems like it SHOULD depend on size (smaller die, but still gaining the tail attack that FotD2 has but FotD1 doesn't), but Paizo would need to FAQ/Errata that as it's not derivable from RAW.
I would say the stat bonuses don't improve, but you get the additional powers. You run into this with some of the other polymorph spells like Monstrous Physique. Sometimes you want the abilities available in the higher level spell, but there's no matching creature of that size in the bestiary, so you use the size from the previous level spell.
Depending on your GM you may be able to add templates like young to the creature to allow better size variety. I'd allow it simply because of how limiting the new polymorph spells are without that versatility.
I feel like the wording and the spirit of the spell are different. However, as some of you mentioned, it would be weird to have a wording different from Beast Shape to say the same thing...
Thanks for your answers.