Bane AoMF, GMF, and damage reduction

[Undone]

Bane increases the enhancement bonus by 2 (Similar to furious).
With a +1 weapon this would clearly bypass say silver and cold iron.

How does a bane amulet of mighty fists interact with GMF? Does it bypass nothing but magic or does it increase the bonus granted to 3 and not count the first one toward DR?

[Kazaan]

I'm pretty sure that Bane affects the enhancement bonus inherent to the weapon; "Against a designated foe, the weapon's enhancement bonus is +2 better than its actual bonus." So, if you have a Bane effect active on a weapon, it goes from being a +1 weapon to a +3 weapon against a designated foe. By contrast, Magic Fang provides just a bonus so, if you already have a +1 weapon, Magic Fang wouldn't give you any better and GMF at +5 bonus would only give you a +5 weapon, not a +6. Furthermore, that +5 from GMF wouldn't bypass DR aside from DR/Magic. So the question regarding Bane is does it apply the Bane increase strictly to the weapon's inherent enhancement bonus or to the best enhancement bonus available. In other words, if you have a +1 Bane Longsword and also had GMW cast on it for +5, would bane make it a +3 Longsword which +5 still tops? Or would the Bane benefit go towards the GMW bonus and make it a +7 Longsword? Additionally, if you used said Longsword vs a creature with DR/Cold Iron or Mithril, could you choose to use it as a +3 Longsword that can bypass DR instead of a +7 Longsword that couldn't (since GMW/GMF don't bypass except for DR/Magic)?

I forget where I read it, but I saw a statement, I think by SKR, that I'll paraphrase here: "If there are two equally valid ways to add a bonus, you can take the one most advantageous to you." So, if a +3 Longsword that can bypass DR other than Magic would net you more damage than a +7 Longsword that can only bypass DR/Magic, you should be free to use the Longsword at +3. For example, against a foe with DR 5/Mithril, the Longsword +7 from GMW would net 1d8+2 damage while the Longsword +3 from base weapon enhancement would net 1d8+3 damage. However, there's still the matter of calculating your to-hit. Do you take the +7 to hit but the +3 to damage? Or, if you want the +3 to damage that can bypass DR/Mithril, are you stuck with only +3 to-hit?

So this is a complicated question involving two major sub-questions:
1) Does Bane only increase the inherent Weapon enhancement bonus or could it increase the enhancement bonus provided by GMW/GMF?
2) If Bane can increase either, can you combine the enhanced to-hit from a Bane-enhanced GMW/GMF with the DR-penetration of Bane-enhanced inherent weapon bonus to damage?

I don't see any clear distinction in the rules so it's completely ambiguous on both questions, so I think this is a perfect candidate for a FAQ response.

[Ipslore the Red]

I don't believe you can ever have a numerical bonus higher than 5, GMW or no GMW, so +7 is out.

And bane is very clear that you use the actual bonus, meaning that a temporary GMW spell wouldn't stack.

[Ninjaiguana.]

Ipslore the Red wrote:

I don't believe you can ever have a numerical bonus higher than 5, GMW or no GMW, so +7 is out.

And bane is very clear that you use the actual bonus, meaning that a temporary GMW spell wouldn't stack.

In fact, you absolutely can have a numbered bonus above +5 on a weapon, as mentioned in the FAQ. Relevant section quoted here;

Weapon Bonuses: Can weapon special abilities (such as bane) or class abilities (such as a paladin's divine bond) allow you to exceed the +5 enhancement bonus limit and the +10 bonus-equivalent limitation?

For the enhancement bonus limitation, it depends on the specific effect or ability that's altering the weapon.

Bane: This allows the weapon to exceed the +5 limit, but only against the designated creature type. For example, a +5 dragon-bane longsword is normally a +5 weapon, but has a +7 enhancement bonus against dragons and deals +2d6 points of damage against dragons.
[Rest of answer cut for relevance - basically bane can take it above +5, but divine bond can't.]

You just can't enchant a weapon to greater than +5 with 'always on' effects.

As for the specific GMW and bane query, I don't know the answer to that one.

Also, to be clear, increasing the 'plus' of the weapon with most effects to +3, +4 or +5 means it breaks the relevant DR, too. Only effects which specify this benefit doesn't apply (such as greater magic weapon) forfeit this improved DR penetration.

[Undone]

Kazaan wrote:

I'm pretty sure that Bane affects the enhancement bonus inherent to the weapon; "Against a designated foe, the weapon's enhancement bonus is +2 better than its actual bonus." So, if you have a Bane effect active on a weapon, it goes from being a +1 weapon to a +3 weapon against a designated foe. By contrast, Magic Fang provides just a bonus so, if you already have a +1 weapon, Magic Fang wouldn't give you any better and GMF at +5 bonus would only give you a +5 weapon, not a +6. Furthermore, that +5 from GMF wouldn't bypass DR aside from DR/Magic. So the question regarding Bane is does it apply the Bane increase strictly to the weapon's inherent enhancement bonus or to the best enhancement bonus available. In other words, if you have a +1 Bane Longsword and also had GMW cast on it for +5, would bane make it a +3 Longsword which +5 still tops? Or would the Bane benefit go towards the GMW bonus and make it a +7 Longsword? Additionally, if you used said Longsword vs a creature with DR/Cold Iron or Mithril, could you choose to use it as a +3 Longsword that can bypass DR instead of a +7 Longsword that couldn't (since GMW/GMF don't bypass except for DR/Magic)?

I forget where I read it, but I saw a statement, I think by SKR, that I'll paraphrase here: "If there are two equally valid ways to add a bonus, you can take the one most advantageous to you." So, if a +3 Longsword that can bypass DR other than Magic would net you more damage than a +7 Longsword that can only bypass DR/Magic, you should be free to use the Longsword at +3. For example, against a foe with DR 5/Mithril, the Longsword +7 from GMW would net 1d8+2 damage while the Longsword +3 from base weapon enhancement would net 1d8+3 damage. However, there's still the matter of calculating your to-hit. Do you take the +7 to hit but the +3 to damage? Or, if you want the +3 to damage that can bypass DR/Mithril, are you stuck with only +3 to-hit?
So this is a complicated question involving two major sub-questions:
1) Does Bane only increase the inherent Weapon enhancement bonus or could it increase the enhancement bonus provided by GMW/GMF?
2) If Bane can increase either, can you combine the enhanced to-hit from a Bane-enhanced GMW/GMF with the DR-penetration of Bane-enhanced inherent weapon bonus to damage?

I don't see any clear distinction in the rules so it's completely ambiguous on both questions, so I think this is a perfect candidate for a FAQ response.

Thanks! I'm not entirely clear on the new damage reduction weapon rules and was just curious about how this interacted. I've been trying to bypass DR (Mostly on evil outsiders) and if this works I'd be ecstatic as evil outsiders have been the thing which has been making me grind my teeth into DR. If this works it makes bane a much more attractive option.